Monarchist Cookbook Game IV, Mao Zedong of China!
- Thread starter r_rolo1
- Start date
Oops, looks like I missed the deadline.
I decided (too late) to give this one a try. I normally play on noble and prince, and monarch is the level I should be moving up to. I played my round last night, but I was too tired to write a report to post the save. I even forgot to put the pics on photobucket.
I can get my report up tonight with the save, if you guys still want. But as I am only a noble/prince level player, I'm pretty sure my save wouldn't be chosen anyway.
So since discussion is open now, I have a few questions after reading some of the reports.
1. I noticed a lot of players settling on the sugar. I put my city 1NE to gain access to the marble. What are the benefits of settling on the sugar as opposed to the other fine tiles on that river?
2. A lot of people also founded the 2 fish city NE of the capital. I don't see a lot of production potential from that city other than with lots of whipping, but it's a great city for the Moai Statues. While its not a bad city spot, I was mostly wondering why you settled it so early? Wouldn't it be better to grab some good sites in the south before the AI gets there first?
I'll be following this game and shadowing the rounds you play. Thanks in advance for helping me move up a skill level.
I decided (too late) to give this one a try. I normally play on noble and prince, and monarch is the level I should be moving up to. I played my round last night, but I was too tired to write a report to post the save. I even forgot to put the pics on photobucket.
I can get my report up tonight with the save, if you guys still want. But as I am only a noble/prince level player, I'm pretty sure my save wouldn't be chosen anyway.So since discussion is open now, I have a few questions after reading some of the reports.
1. I noticed a lot of players settling on the sugar. I put my city 1NE to gain access to the marble. What are the benefits of settling on the sugar as opposed to the other fine tiles on that river?
2. A lot of people also founded the 2 fish city NE of the capital. I don't see a lot of production potential from that city other than with lots of whipping, but it's a great city for the Moai Statues. While its not a bad city spot, I was mostly wondering why you settled it so early? Wouldn't it be better to grab some good sites in the south before the AI gets there first?
I'll be following this game and shadowing the rounds you play. Thanks in advance for helping me move up a skill level.
RichardMNixon
Czar
One problem I see with the voting that I hadn't thought of before is that if I were to vote for mine, it would likely be the only vote and thereby stand a high chance of winning.
Monsterzuma
the sly one
- Joined
- Jun 1, 2008
- Messages
- 2,984
General comment:
Spoiler :
Pretty sure you are allowed to vote for your own save
@ gskyes: it doesn't hurt to post your save certanly!
The double fish spot is a great city. It can borrow the corn from the capital as well. For me i settled it early so i could outsorce GS production from my capital to that one. Starting to generate some great people early is very important as the first few are so insanely effective it is not funny... Of course as rusten mentioned it is also a great option for globe theater. With 3 6 food resources and a hill you will strive hard to find a better production city for the early game(workers and settlers) if thats what you want to use it for...
The city on the sugar gains +1 food initially(3 food city tile) which is great(normaly the sugar is the same as a floodplain), it grabs all the floodplains(by settling on one, one is wasted), it also gets the bannana which is a pretty good tile. The marble is not a very good tile(1 food, 3 hammer 2 commerce) so not getting access to it imeadiatly isn't a huge loss(eventually it'll get into your culture anyways). By settling one E you also get 2 dead tiles which might matter in the midgame when it is your burrecracy capital(size 20ish). Faster early growth, an extra food resource and full growth potential is the biggest pros of settling on the sugar.
@Monsterzuma:
Alex needs to die anyways so culture won't be much of a problem... and even if it was with monument + library + palace + academy you'll actually generate a fair bit of culture...
@ gskyes: it doesn't hurt to post your save certanly!
The double fish spot is a great city. It can borrow the corn from the capital as well. For me i settled it early so i could outsorce GS production from my capital to that one. Starting to generate some great people early is very important as the first few are so insanely effective it is not funny... Of course as rusten mentioned it is also a great option for globe theater. With 3 6 food resources and a hill you will strive hard to find a better production city for the early game(workers and settlers) if thats what you want to use it for...
The city on the sugar gains +1 food initially(3 food city tile) which is great(normaly the sugar is the same as a floodplain), it grabs all the floodplains(by settling on one, one is wasted), it also gets the bannana which is a pretty good tile. The marble is not a very good tile(1 food, 3 hammer 2 commerce) so not getting access to it imeadiatly isn't a huge loss(eventually it'll get into your culture anyways). By settling one E you also get 2 dead tiles which might matter in the midgame when it is your burrecracy capital(size 20ish). Faster early growth, an extra food resource and full growth potential is the biggest pros of settling on the sugar.
@Monsterzuma:
Alex needs to die anyways so culture won't be much of a problem... and even if it was with monument + library + palace + academy you'll actually generate a fair bit of culture...
Bleys
Deity
I think we may have to have a 2-round vote here. First to trim the list to 6ish saves, then to vote for the "final" winner.
Maybe one idea is to have Rolo (the current King) pick the 5 or 6 we vote on, leaving out any "grossly obviously better" ones, and then we vote on those. I am not against rolo just picking one "winner", I trust his judgment to be objective and not pick the best or the worst, but to give us a reasonable one. Starting next round, when there are likely to be less entries, we can go for the actual voting.
Speaking for my own preferences, I like any of the 3-city saves with the "on sugar" and "on hill with Iron in first ring" spots settled, that has both Writing and IW. I think those are the middle of the road. Mine is poor with the city on the lake and no writing. Others didnt get the Iron settled. The ones with 4 cities which include the 2-fish to the north are the strongest, therefore should be avoided.
Maybe one idea is to have Rolo (the current King) pick the 5 or 6 we vote on, leaving out any "grossly obviously better" ones, and then we vote on those. I am not against rolo just picking one "winner", I trust his judgment to be objective and not pick the best or the worst, but to give us a reasonable one. Starting next round, when there are likely to be less entries, we can go for the actual voting.
Speaking for my own preferences, I like any of the 3-city saves with the "on sugar" and "on hill with Iron in first ring" spots settled, that has both Writing and IW. I think those are the middle of the road. Mine is poor with the city on the lake and no writing. Others didnt get the Iron settled. The ones with 4 cities which include the 2-fish to the north are the strongest, therefore should be avoided.
Artichoker
Emperor
- Joined
- Dec 21, 2007
- Messages
- 1,711
If you're concerned about a candidate game being too strong, why not just vote as usual, and then take the "middle" save?
For example, if there are 10 candidates, the votes can first help establish a ranking for the different candidates. Out of that list of candidates and their ranking, then maybe select the candidate whose ranking falls exactly in the middle of the list. If it's an even number of candidates, then maybe take the one with the lower ranking (out of the 2 candidates in the middle).
For example, if there are 10 candidates, the votes can first help establish a ranking for the different candidates. Out of that list of candidates and their ranking, then maybe select the candidate whose ranking falls exactly in the middle of the list. If it's an even number of candidates, then maybe take the one with the lower ranking (out of the 2 candidates in the middle).
r_rolo1
King of myself
I'm not a great friend of the idea of trimming out good saves, just for the sake of it.....
I'll keep the current system for now, just to see if it is enough to avoid the cakewalk syndrom. If not, I'll adopt more drastic measures
@gskyes
Feel free to post the save
You'll be considered as well if you don't delay it too much ( votes have to be on in next friday 
)
I'll keep the current system for now, just to see if it is enough to avoid the cakewalk syndrom. If not, I'll adopt more drastic measures
@gskyes
Feel free to post the save
You'll be considered as well if you don't delay it too much ( votes have to be on in next friday )
KingMorgan
Deity
Sorry I'm late posting my save. Nothing to write home about, all over the shop.
*Edit*
Some strong first checkpoints, on the mrble city, mid game will you really notice those 2 dead tiles, will this city be at 18 pop? Marble will be required for the GL, do you want to risk that 3 border pop without a CRE leader?
Thanks Rolo!
One save.
View attachment Morgan BC-1450.CivBeyondSwordSave
Spoiler :
*Edit*
Some strong first checkpoints, on the mrble city, mid game will you really notice those 2 dead tiles, will this city be at 18 pop? Marble will be required for the GL, do you want to risk that 3 border pop without a CRE leader?
Thanks Rolo!
One save.
View attachment Morgan BC-1450.CivBeyondSwordSave
Attachments
Bleys
Deity
How about this method. (which is ONLY used for rounds where we have a TON of saves to choose from)
2 rounds of voting.
1st round, you pick 5. You MAY vote your own. Top 5 vote counts go to the next round. (1st is 5 points,2nd is 4, etc)
2nd round, you vote 3. You MAY NOT vote for your own (if its there). 3rd most votes gets the nod for next round. (not calling it "Best Ball" anymore).
This sort of method keeps all the best saves in play, but ensures that only the 3rd or 4th "best" is likely to be the one we use to continue. First round can be done in the thread, 2nd round is done by PM (which is the "actual official" method for rounds with less than 8 entries).
I am just concerned that our method is not going to work out that well with 10 saves in the pool, is all, we need a way to get to 5 or 6 to "vote" on in the "official" manner.
2 rounds of voting.
1st round, you pick 5. You MAY vote your own. Top 5 vote counts go to the next round. (1st is 5 points,2nd is 4, etc)
2nd round, you vote 3. You MAY NOT vote for your own (if its there). 3rd most votes gets the nod for next round. (not calling it "Best Ball" anymore).
This sort of method keeps all the best saves in play, but ensures that only the 3rd or 4th "best" is likely to be the one we use to continue. First round can be done in the thread, 2nd round is done by PM (which is the "actual official" method for rounds with less than 8 entries).
I am just concerned that our method is not going to work out that well with 10 saves in the pool, is all, we need a way to get to 5 or 6 to "vote" on in the "official" manner.
r_rolo1
King of myself
No save, KingMorgan
@ Bleys
I'll keep that suggestion on queue ... but as we are already in voting spree ( I already received a few ) , this rould will have the voting system that is stated in the OP( just to avoid further confusion )
@ Bleys
I'll keep that suggestion on queue ... but as we are already in voting spree ( I already received a few ) , this rould will have the voting system that is stated in the OP( just to avoid further confusion )
Bleys
Deity
OK bro. If nothing else, its something to consider for future games. I think this "trend" we see of LOTS of starts, then fewer and fewer submissions as the rounds go by will continue, so its something to think about for future games.
Siran
Warlord
@ sirian and pawelo
Spoiler :
Spoiler :
)
Diamondeye
So Happy I Could Die
I have voted in an earlier post, just posting so you don't wait for my votes later on. And for the 
ofc
ofc
r_rolo1
King of myself
I've seen some discussion about the area with the pigs, the marble, the FP and the sugar..... In my game I had the bad luck of having barbs in the wrong spot ( 
) , but it looks that there is not consensus of where to settle in there
IMHO settling ON the sugar is the best bet ...... it will give a very strong commerce city and has no
problems for quite a while, allowing quick growth. I don't think marble is important enough to be a issue for the moment
On other topics:
- Like I said before, everyone that posted a save and a report can vote... I'm saying this because a lot of you didn't voted yet
-The votes are only PM to be easier for me to make the counts ( It is more expedite to see my PM box than to sort the thread, including all the spoilers ). But votes can be ( and I would like to ) discussed in here.... The discussion of pros and cons is a important part of this kind of games
Anyway I haven't checked all the saves Must see them tonight
) , but it looks that there is not consensus of where to settle in there IMHO settling ON the sugar is the best bet ...... it will give a very strong commerce city and has no
problems for quite a while, allowing quick growth. I don't think marble is important enough to be a issue for the moment On other topics:
- Like I said before, everyone that posted a save and a report can vote... I'm saying this because a lot of you didn't voted yet
-The votes are only PM to be easier for me to make the counts ( It is more expedite to see my PM box than to sort the thread, including all the spoilers ). But votes can be ( and I would like to ) discussed in here.... The discussion of pros and cons is a important part of this kind of games
Anyway I haven't checked all the saves
Must see them tonight RichardMNixon
Czar
I voted first for Tycoonist's for what seems to be considered the best city placement. He also has iron working already which should be a big help in improving the two newest cities.
My second choice was Rusten, he has writing and archery already and is almost finished iron working. Shouldn't be too much effort to build another settler and drop it where we find iron.
My third choice was Winston Hughes. I'm not as upset about his Shanghai as some people seem to be especially since it leaves room for a pig/banana city. I'm also curious as to what can be done with the oracle, as I usually pick code of laws when I get around to building it.
I think I am one of the few/only people to research AH in order to look for horses. I did that after bronzeworking when I was concerned about having no copper, is this not a common practice or was iron working just a much higher priority in order to deal with the jungle?
My second choice was Rusten, he has writing and archery already and is almost finished iron working. Shouldn't be too much effort to build another settler and drop it where we find iron.
My third choice was Winston Hughes. I'm not as upset about his Shanghai as some people seem to be especially since it leaves room for a pig/banana city. I'm also curious as to what can be done with the oracle, as I usually pick code of laws when I get around to building it.
I think I am one of the few/only people to research AH in order to look for horses. I did that after bronzeworking when I was concerned about having no copper, is this not a common practice or was iron working just a much higher priority in order to deal with the jungle?
Did you look at my save? I've got both iw and writing and i'll get that iron city up shortly . Anyways i think i'll vote for me for first as i have better production position and is producing GS not in my capital(so i can use that for production instead), rusten for second(as even though he is teching faster than me i like my production position better), also my barb city is only defended by warriors and it is in the right position saving me a settler. For 3rd it is rather close between tycoonist and rave but i'll go with tycoonist.
I've got both iw and writing and i'll get that iron city up shortly . Anyways i think i'll vote for me for first as i have better production position and is producing GS not in my capital(so i can use that for production instead), rusten for second(as even though he is teching faster than me i like my production position better), also my barb city is only defended by warriors and it is in the right position saving me a settler. For 3rd it is rather close between tycoonist and rave but i'll go with tycoonist.Similar threads
