Before the cooldown it was great for the AI because on high difficulties Mongolia would annex like 4 cities within the first 100 turns and snowball out of control form there.
I like the first one the most, or just -60The Mongols are supposed to be a sort of counterpick to diplo civs, correct? We don't want them to be a diplo civ, we just want them to ruin DVs for other people. The problem I have with the sphere of influence idea is that it necessarily makes Mongolia a strong contender for DV. I don't get the feeling we want to pivot Mongolia that way.
So, that gives 2 options: Either they can destroy CSs, or they can erode other player's influence.
People like getting heavy tribute without necessarily getting a whole city, so what about some of these options?:
- When Mongolia demands tribute, All civilizations lose -30
Influence with the target City-State if they are friends/allies, have a pledge of protection, or have an embassy.
- So, civs that aren't affected if they aren't interacting with that CS, but you could lose 90 influence if you have all 3.
- All civilizations lose 3
- So, Mongolia passively erodes other civ's influence if a CS is intimidated by Mongolia, basically a reverse Gunboat Diplomacy
- City States which Mongolia can demand tribute from do not provide votes to the
World Congress.
- Mongolia can passively lock out votes if it can manage to intimidate CSs
- Mongolia steals
- So, Ghengis Khan can take votes from a CS's allies and use them himself for the next WC vote, then the votes reverts to the ally for the next vote.
Influence regardless of status.I personally don't want Mongols to be counterpick. Counterpicks idea in civ game suck. As ElliotS mentioned - Japan's stuff was removed for a reason and that reason was - it make the game less fun and more frustrating. Same with Mongols. I think Mongols will be a very interesting civ with a very unique gameplay. It is also a lot of fun because you have different types of city-states: which one is better to get as an Ally - Religious or Cultural?
If this is not possible code-wise then simply having it work the was as T3 tenet in Autocracy is just fine. In fact in my opinion it is even better. Just make Mongolia's heavy tribute give them +60
and thats it. Probably even without cooldown cause it will make it very bad lategame. Or it should be something like 45+15(scaling with era)I dislike that because it is useless for the first 120 turns in the game. It should be +60I like the first one the most, or just -60
How is it useful? remember that this would work only for those civs and city-states that you met. Even on Pangea you don't meet half of CS before mid-game. Not to mention that it does not give you anything. It just denies stuff to othersHow is it useless? Civs could lose allies and friends. I'm not arguing that exactly -60
You get bonus from heavy tributes and additionally to that you make it harder for other civs to get bonuses and vote from the CS. Why would it work only on civs that you have met?
I was thinking about that, if it is possible code-wise then i'm okay with it
and ignore ZoC. For every former city state controlled by the Mongolians, they gain +1 
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in each city. +25% 
vs city state units and +50% against city state cities."
Heh... You might want to try these guys"Mongol Terror: Mounted ranged units get +2
This is just so boring and unfunWhat about this as their full UA:
"Mongol Terror: Mounted ranged units get +2
This removes the wonky hard-cooldown heavy tribute ability entirely, allows them to be anti-diplomacy in a very straightforward way, and is easy to understand.
They look fun, but are different enough that I wouldn't worry about it if people like my idea.
What about this as their full UA:
"Mongol Terror: Mounted ranged units get +2
This removes the wonky hard-cooldown heavy tribute ability entirely, allows them to be anti-diplomacy in a very straightforward way, and is easy to understand.
The yields it grants are very open to adjustment, as this was just a first draft. My thoughts are: There are 16 city states in an average game. The ones you can take are generally ones you can friend or ally, so to make it better to take it over you need to give yields that are worth more than tribute and more than a vote and more than an ally.
The yields don't need to scale with era as your number of cities and number of city states taken will. I didn't want to give it specific yields based on the type of city state as it seemed difficult to track or do.
It would absolutely not be a nerf as written.
It still doesn't really address the fact that I generally want to keep CS'es around and if I do want to conquer city states I don't really need combat boosts. I get bonuses now I guess but I still won't want to conquer more than maybe 1-2 CSes. Early game heavy tribute is way better than those yields, later the delegates are more valuable.
Let me do the math: Heavy tribute is about 80
early game, and can be done every 16-20 turns. That comes out to 4-5 yields per turn if you bully non-stop. This would be significantly more yields, though it doesn't offer a burst of yields. It would also grow better because it scale with cities. The yield are in each city, so as the game goes on a single city state could be worth 10+ of each of those yields per turn. (With varying value between the yields.) This seems better than tributing or allying those city states.
That's stepping in Zulu's toes a bit isn't it?
