Monks...

[westamastaflash]

Ok, So I'm playing the Elohim on Epic emperor, standard map 9 civs. I've got a pretty sweet base of operations, having wiped out the Doviello and Sheaim from my home island. I've got the best level of the Altar of the Lunnotar and I start to crank out Monks to prepare for my invasion of Sheebla and Flauros who are both AV. My monks start with 14 XP so its nice to have purity right off the bat. I used a gigantic stack of them, confessors, sphener, valin, 4 paladins, and a bunch of mages to start my invasion of Sheebla.

I can't get any monks up to a high level of enlightenment however - since they have "Guardsman", My good defensive units (sphener, paladins) don't defend the stack and my lvl 6-7 monks die from counterattacks even though I've got freakin str 15 units defending the stack with them.

When I had finished scorching the earth of the continent that the Vampires and Orcs once inhabitied, I had literally TWO of my 20 or so monks left. Sure, I saved some XP via spirit guides, but all my good monks keep dying since there is no good way to protect them.

Could we please either take guardsman away from monks or ajdust it so that you can turn it on or off? That way I can try to get a monk to level 12 for enlightment!

 

[westamastaflash]

Oh and I have 5 spirit mana to boost their strength but they can't get focus until they get lvl 6...

 

[Sarisin]

I am starting out in an Einion Logos/Elohim game now and I am frustrated by the Pacifist promotion they have when they leave their borders. From what you wrote it sounds like more trouble on the way when I get to the point of building and army to take out.

It really sounds like the Elohim are not a very good civ for making war outside your borders. Defensively, they are excellent of course.

 

[Vehem]

I can't get any monks up to a high level of enlightenment however - since they have "Guardsman", My good defensive units (sphener, paladins) don't defend the stack and my lvl 6-7 monks die from counterattacks even though I've got freakin str 15 units defending the stack with them.

It's an interesting point. They originally got Guardsman to defend Corlindale, but now that Guardsman is a standard promotion, they may not need it anymore...

 

[deadliver]

See? guardsman has emerged from the shadows to prove it's lameness once again...of course to be honest I was happy monks came with it, I am just not as clever as Masta.

Seems to not be so bad when it is free, almost as if there should be some sort of building or perhaps wonder that allows you to build units that start with it. Hmm.

 

[hbar]

I thought Guardsman had been reworked in FF to only negate marksman, and not increase the chance to defend...

 

[deadliver]

Gives +3% defensive bonus per guardsman when stationed in a city as well.

 

[xienwolf]

And yes, it only blocks assassins, it does not make the unit any more likely to defend than it would generally be inclined to without the promotion.

 

[MagisterCultuum]

I was just thinking it could be nice to add a promotions with <bStackEffect> and <iBetterDefenderThanPercent> (perhaps 2 different one, one making defending more and the other less likely) so that the player could choose which units he wants to protect and which he is more willing to loose.

 

[xienwolf]

Could actually be pretty interesting to do that, but would have to ensure that there was some complicated AI framework behind it, or a hefty negative AI weight value to ensure that the AI never attempts to use it. Then just make it bStackEffect, bEffectProm and bNoXP with all unitcombats (and NULL) enabled and no other prereqs. You could have +/- 10 version (brave/timid) and +/- 100 version (Courageous/Cowardly). Then any unit you have is able to customize precisely how heavily he defends.

 

[Willgar]

Ok, So I'm playing the Elohim on Epic emperor, standard map 9 civs. I've got a pretty sweet base of operations, having wiped out the Doviello and Sheaim from my home island. I've got the best level of the Altar of the Lunnotar and I start to crank out Monks to prepare for my invasion of Sheebla and Flauros who are both AV. My monks start with 14 XP so its nice to have purity right off the bat. I used a gigantic stack of them, confessors, sphener, valin, 4 paladins, and a bunch of mages to start my invasion of Sheebla.

I can't get any monks up to a high level of enlightenment however - since they have "Guardsman", My good defensive units (sphener, paladins) don't defend the stack and my lvl 6-7 monks die from counterattacks even though I've got freakin str 15 units defending the stack with them.

When I had finished scorching the earth of the continent that the Vampires and Orcs once inhabitied, I had literally TWO of my 20 or so monks left. Sure, I saved some XP via spirit guides, but all my good monks keep dying since there is no good way to protect them.

Could we please either take guardsman away from monks or ajdust it so that you can turn it on or off? That way I can try to get a monk to level 12 for enlightment!

Dont understand the problem - just promote up some of your heavy melee guys to Guardsmen and they will take the brunt of attacks. Personally, i like monks with Guardsman for mid game raids as they protect mages rather nicely.

 

[[to_xp]Gekko]

even better could be giving all units a mechanic that works like the naval crews, that allows the player to set the unit to have either:

1) increased chance to defend stack
2) default behaviour
3) decreased chance to defend stack

that would allow to player to further customize the way their army is gonna defend before clicking END TURN, if they want to.

 

[xienwolf]

even better could be giving all units a mechanic that works like the naval crews, that allows the player to set the unit to have either:

1) increased chance to defend stack
2) default behaviour
3) decreased chance to defend stack

that would allow to player to further customize the way their army is gonna defend before clicking END TURN, if they want to.

That is what Magister had mentioned, but using Stack Promotion makes it even MORE customizable than just having normal crew setups.

(Stack Promotions mean you can gain them multiple times, and get the full effect from each gain)

 

[deadliver]

That does sound pretty cool. See to it that Magister gets a 5% raise.

 

[MagisterCultuum]

5% of nothing isn't that much. I demand at least 20% more.

 

[xienwolf]

I tried to warn you not to get greedy. That remark just cost you a 75% pay cut.

 

[Sarisin]

He shouldn't complain. At least he was immortalized by the game in using his moniker for a Great Sage.

Personally, I think my name should be used in naming a Barb Hero or maybe a fourth Stooge.

 

[kenken244]

In that case, they should add a script that adds my name everywhere there is a typo in the text.

 

[the343danny]

OP, ty. I didnt know about focus and enlightenment until your post. Made me play the elohim. In this game, I recieved the spiritual trait via the unique feature.

 

[westamastaflash]

OP, ty. I didnt know about focus and enlightenment until your post. Made me play the elohim. In this game, I recieved the spiritual trait via the unique feature.

Yeah, spiritual makes them good.

Are you guys absolutely sure that guardsmen doesn't increase the chance to defend the stack? Because I had monks dying while my paladins were at full health!