Moving to Emperor

ownedbyakorat

Warlord
Joined
Feb 7, 2006
Messages
242
So, having felt I had a good mastery of Monarch level, being able to win with pretty much any leader and any start, I decided to try out Emperor.

I rolled three games... in none of the three did I start with more than two resources in my capital. Two of three I was on an island by myself (fractal map). On both of those there was no copper anywhere on the island (rather big islands, too, big enough for a dozen cities). Nor were there any luxuries except for a single Whale resource off of each... necessitating Optics, which is a long way off when you can't grow your cities due to lack of happiness! And variety in health resources was as well severely limited.

In the third game I was on a continent with a four other civs. I explored nearly the entire continent. Unless there was one in someone's capital fat cross, there was no copper on that entire continent, and the only luxuries I saw were isolated single calendar luxuries.

I didn't see gold, fur, ivory, or gems on any of the three maps, at all!

Is this normal, or did I just roll some really bad maps? Monarch level seems to give you an embarassment of plenty compared to Emperor. Given that getting a religion at that level is nigh impossible, how do you deal with it? Just keep all your cities at size three until you can get Drama and pump up the culture slider?
 

Andrei_V

King
Joined
Jan 14, 2006
Messages
930
Just keep your cities at size 3 until you get Monarchy or find a luxury resource in a nearby island. Work cottages mostly and let the cities grow past 3 to whip necessary buildings (like Granaries for faster growth or Libraries for border expansion) once in a while.

Monarchy (Hereditary Rule) is a priority in an isolated start unless you can build the Pyramids (Representation) or found a religion, e.g. Confutionism. If you go for the CoL early and skip all the techs you can postpone (like Archery, Animal Husbandry, sometimes even Agriculture, and so on), you have a chance.

In such a start you won't need culture slider for a long while, it just does not pay off.
 

Poodlebrain

Chieftain
Joined
Feb 4, 2004
Messages
15
I did the same thing when I moved up to Emporer. Although, I ran 10 experiments using Washington as my leader and huge terra maps. On each occasion the settler was placed on a coastal tile. 7 of the 10 maps I was at either the extreme northern or southern edge, meaning lots of useless frozen tiles and unimproveable tundra tiles. The other 3 maps all had start locations surrounded by extensive jungle meaning additional cities couldn't grow until IW. Generally there were adequate resources for a nice healthy capital city, but decent locations for additional cities was the real issue.

I played the games out until 0 AD, and my second and third cities would generally be about one third the population of the AI's similar cities due to poor terrain, and I would have at most 5 cities when the free expansion ceased while the AI civilizations would have significantly more cities with more abundant resources. And I won't go into the issues I had with Barbarians due to the distances between my cities.

I will grant that I did not attempt to tailor my play to compensate for the maps, I followed a pretty much pre-deterined research plan and build order, while I sent warriors out exploring and worker stealing. I learned pretty quickly that I had to take a go slower approach if I wanted to be successful at Emporer level.
 

ese-aSH

Prince
Joined
Mar 30, 2006
Messages
352
ownedbyakorat said:
So, having felt I had a good mastery of Monarch level, being able to win with pretty much any leader and any start, I decided to try out Emperor.

I rolled three games... in none of the three did I start with more than two resources in my capital. Two of three I was on an island by myself (fractal map). On both of those there was no copper anywhere on the island (rather big islands, too, big enough for a dozen cities). Nor were there any luxuries except for a single Whale resource off of each... necessitating Optics, which is a long way off when you can't grow your cities due to lack of happiness! And variety in health resources was as well severely limited.

In the third game I was on a continent with a four other civs. I explored nearly the entire continent. Unless there was one in someone's capital fat cross, there was no copper on that entire continent, and the only luxuries I saw were isolated single calendar luxuries.

I didn't see gold, fur, ivory, or gems on any of the three maps, at all!

Is this normal, or did I just roll some really bad maps? Monarch level seems to give you an embarassment of plenty compared to Emperor. Given that getting a religion at that level is nigh impossible, how do you deal with it? Just keep all your cities at size three until you can get Drama and pump up the culture slider?
I never noticed that my first city location was poorer in emperor...
but if you have no copper, iron nor horses, the game is lost you wont be able to entertain early wars and stop AI expansion.
Remember : in emperor your second city should be an AI capital ;)
 

aelf

Ashen One
Joined
Sep 16, 2005
Messages
17,250
Location
Tir ná Lia
Just wait for iron. Until then, survive on warriors. Detouring to get archers is very costly. Getting no copper and horses at the start is quite common on Emperor, but it usually means you have iron (far more important later on), and probably in the capital's fat cross too. Make sure you get IW as soon as you have the important worker techs. More annoying is the lack of early happiness resources, which I find a very common situation too at this difficulty.
 

obsolete

Deity
Joined
Dec 17, 2005
Messages
6,201
Location
Planet Earth
Remember : in emperor your second city should be an AI capital

That would bankrupt you from the get-go.
 

malekithe

King
Joined
Feb 5, 2006
Messages
755
obsolete said:
That would bankrupt you from the get-go.

Not at all. Conquering and keeping every AI city *might* bankrupt you. But, still, it's usually managable if you know what you're doing. I think you might be overestimating the distance maintenance cost.

Note, this isn't an endorsement for only acquiring cities through warfare. You can win on emperor without ever taking cities through aggression. Myself, I usually settle 2-3 cities and then take the AI capital.
 

obsolete

Deity
Joined
Dec 17, 2005
Messages
6,201
Location
Planet Earth
That capital will be sourrounded by many other cities. How do you keep it from culture flipping back. It's stuck in the middle of a culture-bomb field which the ai has very highly biased against you.
 

ibn sina

Warlord
Joined
Jul 29, 2005
Messages
102
You steal the worker of the first A.I you encounter and then fortify your warriors outside his city so he just keeps wasting archers on you. You esseintaly cripple that opponent and can later take the capital before he has even built any other cities. (This strategy is especially easy with Inca due to their UU).
 

malekithe

King
Joined
Feb 5, 2006
Messages
755
obsolete said:
That capital will be sourrounded by many other cities. How do you keep it from culture flipping back. It's stuck in the middle of a culture-bomb field which the ai has very highly biased against you.

Take the other cities too then. The capital is usually the only city with any sort of cultural defense.
 
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