[Multiplayer] Let's Vox Populi - 8p FFA|Hotseat|Hotseat no good?

Discussion in 'Community Patch Project' started by HorseshoeHermit, Jul 14, 2018.

  1. HorseshoeHermit

    HorseshoeHermit 20% accurate as usual, Morty

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    I want to begin a bold, large, immersive game of Civilization, with the systems designed by the community, to compete for the distinction of the greatest civilization to stand the test of time. Giant Multiplayer Robot will help me do it. For those who don't know, multiplayerrobot.com is a site that lets players use hotseat over the wire. Its server takes care of transmitting game saves from user to user, so that you can just click and play, focus on the game.

    Due to irregular activity in this thread, participation is now exclusively a GMR affair: Get in first, get your spot.

    The room is created -> http://multiplayerrobot.com/Game#27506
    The room is now http://multiplayerrobot.com/Game#27643 , but it is private. The users have received invites through GMR to enter the game.

    Eight slots are open, eight players will play. A tournament to stand the test of Time.


    Game options: Standard speed, Terra map, full VP, normal planet, ALL victories
    TBD by voting:
    - Resources standard, legendary, or scarce
    - Standard size (no AIs) or Large size (some AIs)
    - Time victory on or OFF

    There was no input, so by fiat, we will play with standard resources standard map, no AIs, no Time victory. We play to a proof of true supremacy!

    I've already specified Terra, because it offers the balance of Pangaea with the opportunities of Continents. It's the best!

    Total mods list (final):


    Full VP (no eui) January 15 version
    Use the installer and follow ALL INSTRUCTIONS here. Get it from the "Old versions location" dropdown, open the 2019 folder, find 1-15, get the .exe and run it.​
    This will give you:
    • Community Patch
    • Community Balance Patch
    • City-State Diplomacy Mod
    • Civ IV Diplomacy Features
    • Barathor's More Luxuries
    • "Compatibility Mod" for VP no eui
    You will also need VP modmod:
    • Enlightenment Era for VP (here)
    and interface enhancements:
    • Faster Aircraft Animations (here) This doesn't affect the save data
    • Promotions Tree (here)

    ---​
    The roster:
    1. me
    2. NigelC
    3. civplayer33
    4. Suigintou (GMR)
    5. Chuck Stone (GMR)
    6. tekamthi
    7. Itto Ogami (GMR)
    8. colmodena (GMR)

    ---​
     
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2019
    ryanmusante likes this.
  2. HorseshoeHermit

    HorseshoeHermit 20% accurate as usual, Morty

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    CLARIFICATIONS


    Hotseat mechanics
    • Players take their turns offline, sequentially. It is just like playing single player, except your Human opponents are not active during your turn.​
    • Diplomatic interaction works thus: One player (A) proposes a deal, and the other player (B) on his or her turn may either accept, modify, or reject those terms. If a deal is modified, it is proposed to the first player on his or her next turn. Players may choose not to respond to proposals, which lets the offering player reconsider the terms; the terms are offered again at B's next turn by default.​
    • As a consequence, peace deals can be accepted one turn of conflict after they are tendered - so the use of non-binding agreements, dialogue, and convention becomes important.​

    (keep watch on this post for more information)
     
    Last edited: Jul 26, 2018
  3. Owlbebach

    Owlbebach Emperor

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    Haven't heard about it, could you please tell how exactly does it work? If it is a hotseat - does everyone see each other turns? Are you planning to have a 1-month long game if there are 8 people who all have their own schedule and timezone?

    I mean the idea is interesting, expecially if it can be stable enough. Also i strongly suggest Pangea because Terra is way too big and there is plenty of Naval Fights on Pangea. Pangea is not Oval, it creates lots of interesting terrain
    Some examples:
    https://prnt.sc/k6mg0r
    https://prnt.sc/k6mghr
    https://prnt.sc/k6mgbf
    https://prnt.sc/k6mg3z
     
  4. Paramecium

    Paramecium Prince

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    Do you plan to play only with humans or with AI, too? To fill up some empty slots/ empty space on the map? And what would be the difficulty setting, even without AIs? Because those inlfuence your advantages vs Barbarians and if someone has to drop out, the AI might take over, not sure if everyone can handle a Deity AI, me at least not yet. ;)
     
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  5. Recursive

    Recursive Covets Lands That You Currently Own Moderator

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    *shows up just to drop out and have an AI with DifficultyBonus 7, okay have fun scrubs*

    In all seriousness, is this a game that'd be taking place over a month or so? Civ is quite a long game as-is. How often would turn frequency be?
     
  6. Grabbl

    Grabbl Prince

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    From my experience, PBEM timescale is usually measured in years :D With 8 players, one turn a day is already a very good pace... It's the best way to play civ however, you can really think about each decision (and should do so...). I'd really love to try it with VP, but can't guarantee the time for such a project :( Great initiative, however!
     
  7. avl8

    avl8 Prince

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    Im in, a long time GMR user.
     
  8. Mauro Mezzina

    Mauro Mezzina Chieftain

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    Depending on game pace (how much time for one turn) and difficulty level I would love to take part
     
  9. HorseshoeHermit

    HorseshoeHermit 20% accurate as usual, Morty

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    While I never spring for A.I. competitors in my GMR games deliberately, I think VP makes room for an exception. Perhaps 8 humans and 4 A.I.s? As long as we remember it is a free for all.

    I still think that a player you can't really communicate with is just a drag in some sense, but VP's AI makes up for it with some deadly smarts.

    To explain PBEM, you play one turn and then send the data to the next player. The interface locks out other players from seeing your data when you use a password. Unfortunately, the game kind of bugs out in this - each player will be able to see the current research of the next player in turn order by looking for a moment. They will also be able to hear the sound effect of the wonder or new era notification of that player, as well as if an AI player has made an offer to that player. This is a problem with Civ V.

    The timescale of PBEMs is years. Optimizing for timezones makes the biggest difference, either seeding us across the globe from east to west, or all having an agreed-upon active time of day, most important in the first 50 turns or so (not sure how it differs for VP). You might be able to conclude a normal game of BNW in one year.

    Whichever date we begin, I think it's agreeable we use whatever the latest stable version is for the game at that time.
    Please continue to post with any complications I cannot foresee.
     
  10. Owlbebach

    Owlbebach Emperor

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    Thats way too much. Based on my experience something like Standard Pangea, low Sea Level, 10 Players is the best.
    Thats crazy-long, probably 3 minute timer should be introduced. And even with timer - probably not with me, thats way too long to wait
     
  11. HorseshoeHermit

    HorseshoeHermit 20% accurate as usual, Morty

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    I defer to those with more experience with the mod for reasonable size settings.

    I don't understand how a 3 minute timer is applicable. We're talking about people playing the turn when they get it, one turn at a time as intended, and in between the demands of real life.
     
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  12. Owlbebach

    Owlbebach Emperor

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    Based on what you said i was under impression that the idea is to make several turns per day without quiting the game. If timer is introduced (and i firmly believe that 3 mins is more than enough) and you have 6 human players in the game then it takes you ~20 minutes to complete a turn, so 3 turns per hour, you can make 8-10 turns per day so the game will roughly take 6 weeks, maybe even less
     
  13. avl8

    avl8 Prince

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    I wonder if GMR can support VP games. Heard it has some problems with the mods.
    Theres a similar client on Steam but i dont know if it supports mods.
     
  14. HorseshoeHermit

    HorseshoeHermit 20% accurate as usual, Morty

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    GMR adapted to be able to support any mod that can load from the mods menu.

    Owlbench my proposal isn't to play a game using the standard Internet option. If 6 players can be rounded up to play a live game with a turn timer, and saving and quitting after 10 turns, I will be pleasantly surprised. This is a hotseat play-by-email and the save file still has to travel the internet, and then players load the application, load the save, play, save it, then submit. The timer for such things is set in hours, not minutes.

    It's not a Pitboss. Maybe it should be? But then I have no knowledge that it is technically doable.

    Some people run games with 6 hour timers to great success, because they still effectively run as each player taking one turn on every day. I am active frequently, but irregularly, and there is always the possibility I can't respond for a consecutive 12 hours. Therefore I can't join with a timer set to any faster than that.
     
  15. Giza

    Giza Chieftain

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    I'd like to participate. Though it would be the first time I try GMR.
     
  16. Moi Magnus

    Moi Magnus Emperor

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    Not sure how it works for civilisation, but for other games, play by emails work like this:

    When that's your turn, you receive an email. You connect, you play your turn, you disconnect. The next player recieve an email.
    (You can also connect when it is not your turn to see the state of the game, and make diplomatic actions)
    On quicker game that civ, the expected pace is approximatively 1 turn per week (i.e everybody is expected to play at least one turn per week).
    This pace is very adequate for games that are diplomaty heavy, because you have one week to discuss about trades and agreements.
    For civ, one turn per day is probably more adequate (but I've never tried)
     
  17. Owlbebach

    Owlbebach Emperor

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    This is crazy long, i'd love to play with several people in the game but damn, not like this....
     
  18. CppMaster

    CppMaster Emperor

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    Exactly my thought. It would be better to just play MP game few hours each weekend, so it would be done after about a month.
     
  19. Moi Magnus

    Moi Magnus Emperor

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    I fully understand. That's a completely different game of playing. But for some pleople that can't play more than 45 minutes in a row, that's the only way to play.
    (My great grand father used to play chess by phone, one move per day, that's kind of a predecessor to this)
     
  20. HorseshoeHermit

    HorseshoeHermit 20% accurate as usual, Morty

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    Moi Magnus described a pitboss server. I have no experience with that. The difficulty of an internet option is two-fold. One, it may necessitate the use of a VP modpack. Two, Civ V multiplayer stability is still donkey balls - VP can't fix this. The virtue of Hotseat is it is played offline.

    I will continue to poll for interest in a PBEM. Others can construct a game with their own desired parameters.
     

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