My argument for Democracy

luiz

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Firstly, let me apologize if this post seems confusing and poorly written. This is not an essay, it's more like me talking to myself, hence the somewhat "flow of consciousness" feel to it. This is me trying to remind myself why Democracy (as practiced in Western countries) is still the best form of government we have, even after disastrous and depressing results like we had back in October, when my first gut reaction is "bring the Emperor back! Death to the Republic!". Anyway, this was the prologue.

The case against Democracy
A lot of the traditional arguments for democracy rest on a bunch of assumptions that are nothing but illogical "sacred cows". Like the "1 person 1 vote" principle. The argument that the people who contribute the most to society should have more say is at the very least as good as the argument that everyone should have an equal say. The argument that only people who make a net contribution should have political say is likewise just as good. Another sacred cow is the notion that a candidate who got 51% of the votes is somehow a more legitimate representative of the "will of the people" (which doesn't even exist) than the candidate who got 49%. Fact is such differences are so small they're irrelevant, a different result might be achieved if elections are held one day after or before the actual date. And of course there's no reason to believe one is more representative of the majority (which is nothing but a collection of individuals with conflicting views and interests, not a solid block with a common will).

My case for Democracy
Despite what was said above, Democracy as we have it, with "1 person 1 vote" and "majority rule" is still the best system. Not because everyone is entitled to the same say - that is illogical and silly - nor because there is such thing as "will of the people" represented by a candidate who got 50%+1 of the votes. But because this system has shown to be the most conductive to personal liberties, alternance of power and limited Executive powers. A limited Democracy in which only certain groups get to vote is a quick way to get cliques and self-serving interest groups that get in the way of the emergence of new elites. Alternance of power would be much smaller, and thus the government would grow comfortable and (even more) corrupt. Likewise, while there is no real additional legitimacy to candidate that got 50%+1 of the votes compared to one who got one less, such system makes for predictability and apparent legitimacy, which is important for stability. And precisely the fact that there is no such thing as "will of the people" make such majoritarian system appealing. The government will almost inevitably be composed to coalitions of conflicting interests, keeping Executive power permanently in check. So, in a crazy but actually pretty straightforward way, majority rule is the best protection for minority interests. Provided such rule needs to be renewed every few years.

That's it. Please forgive me if it sounds incoherent or ranting. It was an argument with myself that I felt like writing down.
 
These are decent arguments for democracy.

However, have you considered:

* That democracy could it make it politically lethal to make reforms?
* ...or to block bad new laws?
* That it allows control by those that are nominally not in power to a much more significant degree?
 
* That democracy could it make it politically lethal to make reforms?
True, but minority-rule systems are generally even more opposed to reforms, if they go against or are perceived to go against the interest of the ruling minority.

* ...or to block bad new laws?
That's a problem, but the gridlock and limited Executive power inherent of Democracies (and here I mean liberal Democracies, not monstrosities like Venezuela) is a good limiter for it.

* That it allows control by those that are nominally not in power to a much more significant degree?
And that's a usually a good thing.
 
I think that you have successfully identified the best reasons for democracy being the best known government system (I'd add most conductive to human well being as well)

In the first section where you describe illogical traditional arguments for democracy, I'm not sure that I accept that they are arguments at all. '1 person 1 vote' and '51% wins' are not arguments for democracy, but rather descriptions of the system.

Thanks for the post. I think that it is valuable to not simply assume that democracy is best while not allowing discussion. It does absolutely seem to be the best system, but we should continuously be able to justify it.
 
And that's a usually a good thing.

Eh? How do you make that out?

The Murdocks of the world, and other corporatists, being in control is a good thing? Is it?

(Although I'm very much in favour of democracy, I should say.)
 
Eh? How do you make that out?

The Murdocks of the world, and other corporatists, being in control is a good thing? Is it?

(Although I'm very much in favour of democracy, I should say.)

The fact that not only government officials have influence on how the government is run is generally a good thing (though of course it can be abused if the government is effectively hijacked by special interests).
 
The Murdocks of the world, and other corporatists, being in control is a good thing? Is it?

That's basically my main beef with democracy.

(Although I'm very much in favour of democracy, I should say.)

I kinda few the former as a natural outgrowth of democracy. I might have been a lot less hostile if I believed it didn't.
 
One of the big problems with democracy these days is that re-election and campaigning is so important.. So politicians are spending way too much time dealing with those issues, trying to raise money, etc. rather than dealing with the problems they were actually elected to deal with.

In some cases those who donate money then become more important to politicians than those who they're supposed to represent. This puts more power in the hands of those with money, and takes power away from your average citizen.

I'm not sure what to suggest as a solution, but I see that as a big problem.
 
How about the promotion of greater financial equality amongst citizens?

I don't believe rich people are all that bothered about how much money they actually have. Just as long as they've got more than anyone else.
 
The increased power of corporations is more of a problem with capitalism than democracy.

No. The problem is that democracies lack the political will to curtail the power of corporations since the vast majority of people do not care. The majority of the people may have an opinion in line with yours, but do not pursue the issue with the same vigour as anyone on CFC does.

So until capitalism becomes for some reason unviable, it will work in tandem with democracy.
 
Indeed, all forms of government are susceptible to be influenced by the rich and powerful. It's not like monarchs never were.

Also, I don't think empirical evidence really indicates that we live under some corporate plutocracy.

Additionally, maybe the power of monied interest in a Democracy is a good counter to raw populist politics? There's another potential argument.
 
Why would any other government type be better? Money is money, and no one is immune to its charms.

It's simple, we kill the money.

Joker.gif
 
Additionally, maybe the power of monied interest in a Democracy is a good counter to raw populist politics? There's another potential argument.

You could perhaps say that Western democracies are less democratic than say, Venezeula or North Korea, as the former have significant civil societies that act as a sort of surrogate aristocracy that counters the populist tedencies - but paradoxically can also strengthen it - and do not have a formalised system of authority with titles (i.e. problem with unaccountability in democracies I mentioned earlier).
 
You could perhaps say that Western democracies are less democratic than say, Venezeula or North Korea, as the former have significant civil societies that act as a sort of surrogate aristocracy that counters the populist tedencies - but paradoxically can also strengthen it - and do not have a formalised system of authority with titles (i.e. problem with unaccountability in democracies I mentioned earlier).

In North Korea, the government reigns supreme over the people, not the other way around.
 
You could perhaps say that Western democracies are less democratic than say, Venezeula or North Korea, as the former have significant civil societies that act as a sort of surrogate aristocracy that counters the populist tedencies - but paradoxically can also strengthen it - and do not have a formalised system of authority with titles (i.e. problem with unaccountability in democracies I mentioned earlier).

North Korea is a straight up dictatorship, and the thing with Venezuelan-style "populist democracy" is that the theoretical expansion of majority power ultimately always lead to an overpowering Executive and hence less majority power (and thus less democracy).

The more you look at it from every angle, the more you have to appreciate Western-style liberal democracies, with all their ugliness and imperfections.
 
In North Korea, the government reigns supreme over the people, not the other way around.

If democracy is the embedding of government throughout its citizens, using its citizens as conduits, than North Korea is perhaps one of the most pure democracies.

Non-totalitarianism is characterised by a certain self-sufficiency of government (from its citizens), thus at the same making governments less prone to pry into citizens.
 
You could perhaps say that Western democracies are less democratic than say, Venezeula or North Korea, as the former have significant civil societies that act as a sort of surrogate aristocracy that counters the populist tedencies - but paradoxically can also strengthen it - and do not have a formalised system of authority with titles (i.e. problem with unaccountability in democracies I mentioned earlier).
It's settled, Kaiserguard is one of those "postmodern phrase generators" that's somehow gained sentience and run amok.
 
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