Neat combinations/tricks you've found

[Mesix]

If you are getting a 12K tech out of an event from your first library then you have given up quite a bit of research over the course of the game by not having libraries. To me this is more of a problem then the "exploit" that you are taking advantage of.

Getting a 700-1000 tech early in the game when you are naturally building your first library is much better IMHO.

 

[Jules.lt]

The risk I was mentioning was to take the option that has a *chance* of giving you a full tech, while you could be certain to get a bonus to your library.
(in a modified version where the free tech is replaced by a chance to get a free tech)

Putting in an event that could somehow reward you for putting off building libraries is totally absurd.
Part of the problem is that there is a sure-fire trigger to get the event, when events are supposed to be random and unexpected.

Rewards should be at least somewhat proportionate to what you put in to get it, anyway. So this 100 gold for a free tech makes no sense at all.
We have several ways to get a free tech of your choice already: the tower of divination and the infernal grimoire. Both of those require a significant effort to get, and that is as it should be.

 

[benana]

I think this discussion has gotten a little off-topic...
That being said, why not make the orb event not let you choose the tech you get?
Once upon a time, I heard that goodie huts, when they gave you a tech, gave you the cheapest one you weren't currently researching. That seems like a good mechanic to me... still a free tech, but it doesn't help you beeline for anything.

 

[Senethro]

80 gold for +2 beakers per turn is a bad deal. Commerce now is better than commerce later. You could probably get a higher benefit from turning the science slider up and getting your next technology sooner than choosing this option.

As long as there is a suitably expensive tech on offer the gamble will still pay off better, while being unfair on those who get unlucky.

Automatic selection of cheapest tech would be a suitably inoffensive reward.

 

[Sephi]

two times that I played elves recently I got hunting from a hut before turn 4. The event really isn't more unbalanced than free techs from huts. The 50 for a priest event is also not balanced. Maybe option 3 should get an additional penalty. Like 50% to get 2 in the city? Or a penalty for the city.

 

[benana]

80 gold for +2 beakers per turn is a bad deal. Commerce now is better than commerce later. You could probably get a higher benefit from turning the science slider up and getting your next technology sooner than choosing this option.

As long as there is a suitably expensive tech on offer the gamble will still pay off better, while being unfair on those who get unlucky.

Automatic selection of cheapest tech would be a suitably inoffensive reward.

I'm not sure I agree. The bonus lasts the whole game, so you see a lot more than 80 beakers out of it (also, I thought it cost less than 80, but the exact price isn't the issue). If you have something better to do with the money, go ahead, but if you don't, it's a good investment.
Also, don't forget that it's 2 beakers before bonuses (like the +25% from a library).

Maybe a free tech, even the cheapest available, would still be better in many cases... I think it comes down to play style in that case, which is where we want to be.

 

[Senethro]

Techs from huts are kind of ok though, because they aren't common unless you heavily invest in scouts and your opponents don't. The Ljosalfar extra scouts make the elves the civ most likely to get lucky from huts early on, but somewhat prone to a warrior rush.


benana: If you go look in the S&T forum you'll see a Flauros game that completed the tech tree by turn 280. While a lot of improbably cheesy tactics were employed to do this, its a fairly good indication that time is short and you can't hang around for 40 turns to get a return on your investment.

 

[TheGreatSteve]

The "if everything is OP everything is balanced" style is what keeps me playing FfH. If you're going to change the event, either make it rarer or buff the other option. Don't nerf the fun part of it.

Attach another event to keeping the orb for study, where your sages determine it's properties. You could choose that it radiates magic power, and it provides a random mana. Choose that it exudes an aura of peace and wisdom and it gives Disciple units built in the city +2 exp. Say it strengthens metals held near it and melee units built there have a chance to get +1 str. Say your sages found nothing, but the whole city seems better with the orb in place, and it provides a :happy: benefit and a few city-buffing effects.


Anyway, back to the actual topic.
If you intend to play Hyborem on an Erebus map, start with the Lanun. Erebus's smart civilization positioning will give you a nice coastal start. Get fishing, start teching. By the time you have to start settling the less appealing inland areas you're ready to switch.

The trick here isn't that Lanun on the coast tech well, although that is a good thing. It's that you switch when they've about reached their potential. Inland cities aren't nearly as good for them. Their Boarding Parties are weaker. The same mapscript that gives them such a nice start also generally places them such that they can't expand a lot without going through someone else.

I always find as Hyborem that my greatest threat is my former civ. It's been set up intelligently by a human, and now is enjoying all the bonuses the computer gets to make up for being dumb. If you start with the Lanun you're a lot less likely to finish up your neighbors, emerge onto the world stage, and realize your former nation controls half the world. Plus the coastal start gives AV a better chance to spread around.

 

[Sephi]

Senethro: With some settings (like no tech trading and small map) it can be good to buy 2 for 80 . You shouldn't always base your strategy on being able to trade techs with a deity AI like in the Flauros game

 

[Senethro]

No, its always a terrible deal. Part rushbuying a temple, especially via slaves, will give you a better return.

 

[mahazel]

Drill + Fear: enemy units can`t attack unit with fear promotion, but they sustain injuries from defensive strikes and your "not attacked unit" get +1 xp per enemy unit who try to attack him
Tried it with Eurabatres...

 

[Imuratep]

Defensive Strikes IMHO are underpowered on higher difficulties as every AI unit anyway has level 3-4 (0-30 defensive strike damage of a level 2 archer - what you got with apprenticeship. 30%-8%-10% for a normal AI axeman is 12 % at maximum usually 0 % if you hit anyway.)

 

[Sephi]

No, its always a terrible deal. Part rushbuying a temple, especially via slaves, will give you a better return.

when you have only FoL and don't need the happiness rushbuying a temple isn't all that great . I am not saying it's a great deal but it might be usefull sometimes. Maybe if you play Marathon, I don't know.

 

[hbar]

If linked events worked, then the orb would be a perfect example of good event design. Instant reward (free tech) vs. chain of events with progressively better awards. Say, once the orb city gets an alchemy lab, you get a free mana from the orb; once it gets a weaponsmith you get a free promotion for melee; once a tavern is built you get a free great sage, etc. Over time these things add up to more than a free tech (especially if it is changed to a random tech instead of player choice) but you have to wait.

Also, I think breaking the orb should release a boss (read: leveled) spectre/wraith nearby.

 

[cIV_khanh93]

Breakingthe orb gives you a fre tech??? jesus... well it doesnt happen every game since it sa random event.

 

[Methuselah]

Breakingthe orb gives you a fre tech??? jesus... well it doesnt happen every game since it sa random event.

Yes it does. It's not a random event, it triggers when certain conditions are met.

 

[Emptiness]

Fortunately that's going to change:

Patch 0.40y (unreleased)
1. The Iron Orb event no longer occurs to the first player to qualify (its random like most other events).

 

[Jules.lt]

Hmm... I hope he also makes the results more transparent, since he kept the same.
But thanks anyway, it feels good to be heard.

(btw, I'm not sure I understand this right: he means that the event will now be random like all others, not that it is already, right?)

Edit:

It wasn't supposed to be -1 weight. It was -1 so I could test it and I forgot to set it back. The next patch will make it weighting 400 like the others.

(Talking about chances of the event happening)

I feel better, now.

 

[Ashrak]

Unholy AV-paladins, build 4 or more ritualists and switch to order

 

[DirtyFinger]

Build lots of privateers as Sidar.

Cast World Spell (Into the Mist, I think) and place your invisible ships near every single coastal city and bleed their economy dry.