Need some ideas for a 2nd UU

GeoModder said:
Well, I was just thinking that it could overcome a grenadier...
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Well thats kinda te he point of a UU, to have an advantage over another unit. Knight's main contemporary counters are pikes. So theres no harm there, they can still be killed easily. Giving it shock or cover would be bordering on overpowered. The free promo is the better part of the deal. So possibly an innate +25% vs Guns would be better.

GeoModder said:
Why do you consider longbows a good counter to knights? :hmm:
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Theyre not really a good counter persay. Its just that it can already keep a knight out of a city, so theyre partially a counter in that regard. Having no counter means nothing can stop it. So I just pointed out that there are things that could stop it.
 
achilleszero said:
Well thats kinda te he point of a UU, to have an advantage over another unit. Knight's main contemporary counters are pikes. So theres no harm there, they can still be killed easily. Giving it shock or cover would be bordering on overpowered. The free promo is the better part of the deal. So possibly an innate +25% vs Guns would be better.
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I know all that. But I also seems that a knight with +25% against gunpowder units but not immune to first strikes makes the odds of a Drill promoted grenadier a bit better.
I only suggested the immunity removal as a 'might be' to increase the odds Mechaerik would take my proposal. ;)
 
GeoModder said:
I know all that. But I also seems that a knight with +25% against gunpowder units but not immune to first strikes makes the odds of a Drill promoted grenadier a bit better.
I only suggested the immunity removal as a 'might be' to increase the odds Mechaerik would take my proposal. ;)
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Ahh, I see. Good thinking.

I, on the other hand , am not above making uber-powerful units. As long as they dont break the game.
 
Adding in an innate 25% against gunpowder might be a little strong. if they get pinch, they get a 50% boost against them. Then again, you could probably get cuirassiers soon after gunpowder so :hmm:. I think I'll go with the boost against gunpowder.
 
GeoModder said:
The point of the discussion was when knights started to become obselete, not how.
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Longbows made them more obsolete, though. The Battle of the Golden Spurs only proved that Pike beats Knight. But then military commanders had the brilliantidea of avoiding Pikemen with their Knights. It's much harder to avoid something that can attack you from a distance, which is why Crecy is regarded as the battle which made Knights obsolete.
 
nutnut said:
Longbows made them more obsolete, though. The Battle of the Golden Spurs only proved that Pike beats Knight. But then military commanders had the brilliantidea of avoiding Pikemen with their Knights. It's much harder to avoid something that can attack you from a distance, which is why Crecy is regarded as the battle which made Knights obsolete.
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So what you are saying is that they were already becoming obsolete, but then longbows cemented it. I think thats what GeoModder means by this:

GeoModder said:
The point of the discussion was when knights started to become obselete, not how.
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Anybody got any ideas for Israel?
 
mechaerik said:
Anybody got any ideas for Israel?
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I think you should either give them the slinger, and switch Assyria's UU, or you could give them settlers with a defense score.

Maybe some type of Mossad (spy with two moves or greater chance of intercepting an enemy agent or something) agent or IDF (replaces Machinegunner so it only defends?), I have no idea.
 
If worst comes to worst, i'll give them the Slinger and give Assyria a battering ram (which isn't very original, but beggers cant be choosers). Right now I found the Bible and am looking through it to find something. Jericho seems interesting but I can't find anything useful.
 
mechaerik said:
So what you are saying is that they were already becoming obsolete, but then longbows cemented it. I think thats what GeoModder means by this
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Sort of. At the time Pikes were making it difficult for Knights on the battlefield. Longbows made it much more dangerious.
 
mechaerik said:
Anybody got any ideas for Israel?
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A thought, but I may be impossible to easily put it in your mod: Zionist.

During war when a city is razed after being conquered, partizans are spawned in the capital (IIRC). How about making a UP (unique partizan), called Zionist, instead of a second UU?
The problem is that the UP should scale in strength according to the era a city is obliterated. But perhaps with Python something can be arranged?
 
Dom Pedro II said:
What about the Zulu?
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For the Zulu I've decided to use iklwa, which will replace macemen. An Iklwa was actually a type of spear, but the Zulu used it as their primary weapon when Shaka came to power. Also, I think it would be cool to see Shaka with a mace uu. :p
 
mechaerik said:
For the Zulu I've decided to use iklwa, which will replace macemen. An Iklwa was actually a type of spear, but the Zulu used it as their primary weapon when Shaka came to power. Also, I think it would be cool to see Shaka with a mace uu. :p
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Isn't that the weapon that the Impi already uses?
 
Shhhhh......:p



For the sake of not having to think of another idea, I say its an assegai.
 
mechaerik said:
Shhhhh......:p



For the sake of not having to think of another idea, I say its an assegai.
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Well, yes... of course, if the new unit is using the assegai in the traditional fashion, as a throwing spear, then it's essentially just another Skirmisher ;) ... And if not, then it's exactly the same as the Impi.

Of course, there are also alternatives to military units... maybe they could have a Scout, Worker or Settler variant?
 
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