New Civ Game Guide: Tonga (Tides of Power)

[TheGhostEnthusiast]

I really hope not... That would be the most depressing way to introduce Civ continuity... Once things are unlocked they should stay unlocked (even if they become useless like traversing oceans will be)

On an upbeat note though... Tonga has my favourite Civ logo by a country mile...

I am also a fan of the bird, though my cursory research hasn't turned up anything regarding the symbol's significance. I am curious as to what the inspiration was.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

I am also a fan of the bird, though my cursory research hasn't turned up anything regarding the symbol's significance. I am curious as to what the inspiration was.

Probably this:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tongan_megapode?

 

[Ryansinbela]

That is what the wiki says

 

[Krikkit1]

I really hope not... That would be the most depressing way to introduce Civ continuity... Once things are unlocked they should stay unlocked (even if they become useless like traversing oceans will be)

On an upbeat note though... Tonga has my favourite Civ logo by a country mile...

If things are going to stay unlocked, then they should start unlocked. Let America build its SteelMill or Statue of Liberty before the Pyramids if it wants. (the cost of the building and the civics would likely be too much to be practical, but it seems reasonable)

That does mean that Modern Rome is somewhat nerfed (only 4 Traditions). And any continuity civ will only have 1 UQ in any of it’s founded cities.

Which is why a new set of bonuses (specifically separate Civics that enable Traditions and certain UIs) is needed for each age.

Those bonuses should probably be semigeneric…2 complete new sets for each civ is unrealistic. They could either be completely Generic or based on Attributes.

I could see letting the civs main UA appy across Ages… but that would be Terribly complicated for Some UAs.

So Either
1. Civs lose their unique “Golden Age” abilities for genericized all age abilities
or
2. Civs are just copied each Age and some civs Really work poorly (lack of Traditions/UI…Free Codexes/Relics in Modern, etc.)
or
3. They have their “Golden Age” uniques in their “Golden Age” and outside of that they have
-no uniques?
-semi generic uniques
-fully generic uniques

Tonga has a kit that is well focused on Antiquity and setting up for Exploration …trying to mash it into Modern would be a shame…I could see that work as an unbalanced probably buggy option, but I would far rather the main way of doing it is to let Tonga go into Exploration / Modern and let it get some Diplomatic and Expansionist uniques that fit those Ages.

 

[TheGhostEnthusiast]

2. Civs are just copied each Age and some civs Really work poorly (lack of Traditions/UI…Free Codexes/Relics in Modern, etc.)

On this specific note, given that the age-nonspecific categorization of "Great Work" already exists, I could see such abilities simply being changed to provide whatever reward is relevant at the time, like Baroque Friedrich.

 

[bengalryan9]

On this specific note, given that the age-nonspecific categorization of "Great Work" already exists, I could see such abilities simply being changed to provide whatever reward is relevant at the time, like Baroque Friedrich.

Maybe, but all those exploration age civs with unique missionaries are gonna need a different solution.

 

[Nigel_Tufnel2]

Instantly my favorite Civ!

 

[Lord Lakely]

On an upbeat note though... Tonga has my favourite Civ logo by a country mile...

Yeah, it's fun to see wildlife represented as well. I thought it was a quail at first, but turns out to be a Tongan Megapode, an endemic species of bushturkey. Same bird order (Galliformes or landfowl, which includes quails, chignons, turkeys, pheasants and peafowl), different branch.

 

[Krikkit1]

Maybe, but all those exploration age civs with unique missionaries are gonna need a different solution.

Or Maurya (unless they get one ?additional religion? one additional ideology?)

 

[stealth_nsk]

The UU makes me not see much value in the UQ as it can already do what the unique quarter unlocks. I get that it allows scouts in exploration to use it but, eh, I don't bother with scouts in exploration and why would I when I discovered so much in Antiquity already by making use of my Tehinas with the Tonga? Sure, the UQ offers a bit of culture but it also makes it a nice target to capture for any opponents to take your advantage with your UU away. I feel like the UQ should do something else but I am not sure what the "increased culture for every trade route" exactly does. It may be pretty nice. It just feels redundant - possibly to the benefit of your enemies.

I think wording makes intention quite specific - Firaxis wants scouts in exploration to regain this ability regardless of which civilization you evolve into.

 

[Gedemo]

I really love this one!

 

[UWHabs]

I think wording makes intention quite specific - Firaxis wants scouts in exploration to regain this ability regardless of which civilization you evolve into.

Yeah, the culture bonus on the UQ is the primary bonus, the scout ability is basically "how can we translate that ability to the next era without shoe-horning it into a tradition that you have to slot and un-slot". In some ways it fixes the problems with Ortoos, which lose their ability in the next age, because they could only tie that into Mongolia itself, so that opponents can't use it against you in exploration.

 

[Navelgazer]

So, my first thought is that, if a conquered Tofi'a lets your scouts get to distant lands, but only Tonga has the prohibition on incorporating IPs, then you could still be able to secure yourself Distant Lands settlements in Antiquity as long as Tonga is on your starting continent and you're playing as anyone else.

Though, as noted, the simpler path to this might be playing as Tonga, levying units in DL, and conquering from there.

 

[King Flevance]

I think wording makes intention quite specific - Firaxis wants scouts in exploration to regain this ability regardless of which civilization you evolve into.

I actually think the wording far too open for that specific claim. Making sure to point out that captured ones give your opponent your UU's ability. Though this could be seen as a disclaimer, it can also be viewed as an exploit. Not a huge flaw or anything but I know I will be rushing Tonga often enough because of this. Not sure how it will effect my play if I am playing Tonga. I need to see the impact of the culture boost.

 

[Siptah]

So, my first thought is that, if a conquered Tofi'a lets your scouts get to distant lands, but only Tonga has the prohibition on incorporating IPs, then you could still be able to secure yourself Distant Lands settlements in Antiquity as long as Tonga is on your starting continent and you're playing as anyone else.

Though, as noted, the simpler path to this might be playing as Tonga, levying units in DL, and conquering from there.

Only Tonga can interact with DL independents though, as it seems. At least the last times I tried to interact with DL independents with the current civs, clicking on them had no result.

 

[Krikkit1]

Though, as noted, the simpler path to this might be playing as Tonga, levying units in DL, and conquering from there.

Which is why they should probably cause any DL units Tonga levys to be teleported to the nearest coast/water tile.

(and make Ocean tiles block vision like Mountains..until Astronomy so that Only Tonga can see what’s out there ahead of time.)

 

[stealth_nsk]

Which is why they should probably cause any DL units Tonga levys to be teleported to the nearest coast/water tile.

(and make Ocean tiles block vision like Mountains..until Astronomy so that Only Tonga can see what’s out there ahead of time.)

Or not allow levying units in DL at all.

 

[Leucarum]

Or not allow levying units in DL at all.

Which makes that weirdly specific line about levying scouts interesting...

 

[Ryansinbela]

Did anyone else see the Polynesian looking land units or am I delusional

 

[Daigotsu Max]

Two benefits from Tonga's addition:
1. Maybe now I'll get to build Ha'amonga 'a Maui again
2. This is a really good predecessor to Hawai'i. Now just give us modern Maori for a nice full Polynesian line