New religions

[Civkid1991]

Civkid, I really like your idea, though I'm not sure how it would work out in practice. But if those unique features weren't revealed before a certain tech, it might work out. But it might frustrate people to be denied the religion they wanted because someone else had long ago settled next to a landmark.

is there a chance of the unique features being changed from randomly placed at the beginning to randomly spawning randomly through out gameplay via random event? This wouldn't put any specific civ at any advantage or disadvantage when it comes to finding a religion.

It would also be interesting to see religion spread through not only priests and religious units but also via random events (such as religious pilgrims coming to the Yggdrasil leaving message of the FoL -> you have a the choice of allowing religion to spread to cities or discourage your people from following superstitions)

 

[Calavente]

By the way, it's 21 religions/spheres

hmm I think not... it's 21civ/21spheres/21gods-angels.
but for religions :
each religion seems to have 3spheres of influence. (OO : body, mind, water)
21spheres ==> 7 religions.

BUT
#there are some sphere that are common to some religions (body : RoK/OO, Fire : AV/Order, Life : FoL/RoK/Order)
#some religions don't have priests (CoD).
currently, with 5 religions, you have 12 mana spheres called by divine spells.

#some mana really don't fit with the religion thematic : death(undeath), dimensional. (remains 8 unassigned spheres, out of 21 possible and 15 existant).
#some civ/cult does not leads to a religion : Cassiel and the agnostics grigoris.

If nothing change withthe coming of shadow in term of mana sphere assignement, and no new mana than shadow and sun, you would have :
-17spheres,
-6 religion covering at least 14sphere (15 if air goes for one of the new religions)
-2 sphere unassignable (dimensionnal/death)
-2 creed without divine spells : CoD and agnosticisme.

#2 more religion will still create many overlapping for accessing divine spells.
Implementing more religion would require creating new spheres.

==> conclusion : to cover the whole FfH spheres, there are no need of 21 religions (long talk, short conclusion)

 

[sylvanllewelyn]

Obviously we can't have 21 religions. The 7 religions in Civ4, and the 7 that will be here once "shadow" comes out, will have the same problem: later religions will simply be insignificant.

As for mana corresponding to civilizations, I feel that the mana choices really have to be re-worked. Obviously each civilization should start with the magic sphere they represent. Besides that, the other 2 mana types should be "allied": the magic wheel could take a while to setup I guess. Or palaces should only have 1 mana type after all. On the other hand, holy shrines should provide 3 mana types that corresponds to their religion. 21 types of magic is not too much, as you're not really expected to use them all anyway, and you're forced to make choices.

As for the tower of mastery victory: if holy shrines now provide 3 mana types, it should be easier to win it if you aim to take control of these holy cities.

 

[Ekolite]

@ Calavente: I think that some of the religion magic spheres could be changed. I think that death + dimensional (if it get new/more spells) would be great spheres for the Veil. I don't know what it is atm but I think it should be death dimensional and probs fire.

 

[Calavente]

maybe ...
if there are (almost) no cross between assigned manas :
17manas spheres ==>
6 religions + 1 mana used 2times +1 no priest religion (CoD)

==> would totally saturate the options for religion : no more religions needed happy me!!

but more manas (force, creation, metamagic and winter) would add 1 religion (mulcan, with change of mana spheres attributions) no mana used 2 times... and many options... many hard choices for your few chanelling III units... arrg... groovy !!

 

[Sureshot]

AV is death, fire, and entropy, with divine and summoning.

 

[Ekolite]

Oh yeah forgot about entropy.

Does anyone else think the orcs religion should be put in. Maybe even just as a cult. I don't think any of the current religions really suit them.

AV and OO are really more science based. Orcs are barbarians.
FOL: Orcs prefer burning woods
RoK: Cant imagine orcs worshipping the earth. did used to have that burning trait after all.
Or: Orcs are barbarians
Emp: I suppose possibly if it is a neutral religion but not sure
CoE: I cant really imagine secret cults of orcs sneaking around.

I know I'm being a bit stereotypical here but it just annoys me how they always turn into treehugging elves lol.

If there religion was added as a cult maybe the barbs could get it too.

 

[Rex rgis of Ter]

^The point of FoL is to allow evolution of the strongest occur(Priest of Leaves Civi). The Orcs want to kill everyone and thus, become the most eveoved species and powerful in Erebus.

 

[Ekolite]

So are you saying Fol is for them?

 

[Rex rgis of Ter]

So are you saying Fol is for them?

No, that FoL is for everyone, afterall, everyone wants to win. YOu should read the civilopedia entry for priest of leaves, it shows why they are neutral, and fit most civs.

 

[xienwolf]

Aye, FoL is the TRUE neutral choice. Never affects your current alignment, so both Evil and Good can have it (no good can have OO, and no evil can have RoK, even though they are also "Neutral" religions)

 

[Hangly Man]

No, no new religions until the next version (or possilble one after that.) I think you all finally have a chance to finish a game w/o a new patch or download.

theoretically nice, but in any one game, more than a certain number (depending on the map or number of players) would not add much, as you wouldn't have religious blocks forming.
Also, with 7 each can be nice and distinct, but with 21 there might not be much difference between many of them.

The religions could be either/or propositions, where founding religion x makes religion y impossible to research. That way you could limit the number of religions in a game to, say, seven. That would seriously boost the replay value.

21 sounds like a lot of work to implement though.

 

[Hangly Man]

Oh yeah forgot about entropy.

Does anyone else think the orcs religion should be put in. Maybe even just as a cult. I don't think any of the current religions really suit them.

Cult of the Pig?


Also I really really hope the Council of Essus has something to do with spiders.

Really really.

 

[zxcvbnm]

The Council is a dark elven thing, so are spiders (they actually get 2 baby spiders from kills instead of 1)

 

[Hangly Man]

The Council is a dark elven thing, so are spiders (they actually get 2 baby spiders from kills instead of 1)

Yeah. I hope they decide to do more with it though.

Like fusing warriors with captured spiders or something. ...Which makes them nigh-invisible, gives them web spells, makes them able to wrap defeated enemies up in cocoons to lay their eggs in... stuff like that.

 

[zxcvbnm]

Or Svartalfar spider riders like Clan makes wolf riders (not necessarily religion-based as the council is more about tricks and deceiption and not spiders but both are dark elven)

 

[Hangly Man]

Spiders are super tricky and deceitful though.

There needs to be a Council-only hero named "Gandelweaver" that is half-spider and does tons of really cool stuff like spawn more spiders in the corpses of dead enemies, creating a spider army like the werewolf and vampire armies.

I really have to insist on this point. It can't happen any other way.

 

[xienwolf]

Hrm, if there were 21 religions, it would be interesting to have a single tech which founds EVERY religion (you get to select 1 from the list), then still have sections of the Tech tree which have religion requirements to research them.

Then, each leader can actually have his prefered religion, though if they took long enough someone else may have influenced their lands enough that they won't ever change to it.

But it would be impossible to found multiple religions, or even get a second religion unless it natrually spreads into your borders, or the other player gifts you a Missionary.