News: WOTM 06 Pre-Game Discussion

[Malemute]

What are people considering for beginning builds/techs? I'm thinking of going Worker > Work boat > Warrior > Settler
Does it make sense to make the Work boat first?

For techs, starting with Mining so the worker has something to do and then probably Bronze Working afterwards. Maybe Sailing then Wheel and Pottery. I'm not really sure if I'll go for AH for a while unless I see some pigs, sheep, or cow nearby. I'd like to get Iron Working (nearby jungle) and Metal Casing (Collussus) soon. If I can get the Oracle, maybe spend the free tech on Metal Casing rather than Code of Laws if I can find some happiness hookups nearby.

I'm guessing the start won't leave us completely isolated from neighbors as that wouldn't give us much of a chance to use the UU.

 

[Conquistador 63]

No, not guaranteed.

From reading Sirian's guide to map scripts, I think it is guaranteed we'll have an island for ourselves, even though we might be reached by galleys (or not). If this month's map were "Archipelago" instead of "Islands", then it we couldn't be sure about it. Unless the map was hand-modified to that point, which wouldn't make sense to me.

 

[Thrallia]

it is Gyathaar....nothing is guaranteed except it will be interesting

Unless the map was hand-modified to that point, which wouldn't make sense to me.

it makes perfect sense....hand modify it so that inside knowledge of the map scripts won't necessarily give you a huge advantage over the others.

 

[DynamicSpirit]

From reading Sirian's guide to map scripts, I think it is guaranteed we'll have an island for ourselves, even though we might be reached by galleys (or not). If this month's map were "Archipelago" instead of "Islands", then it we couldn't be sure about it. Unless the map was hand-modified to that point, which wouldn't make sense to me.

Oooh, ta for the correction! You're right, looks like we are guaranteed our own island. I didn't know there was a separate 'islands' setting and so assumed 'islands' meant 'archipelago'. I would've had a real surprise when I opened the game and started exploring !

*goes away to completely revise strategy*

 

[Ribannah]

I think I will move the Scout sw/sw since that seems to be the most likely alternative founding tile.

 

[Gyathaar]

SO do those settings actually, well, work? I thought that they were included but internally disabled.

I am not sure on all of these settings.. but the AIs certaining get higher health and happiness bonuses (I checked this)

 

[CivSetä]

Looks interesting, I haven't tried Ragnar before. I'll settle on place and try to grab both Great Lighthouse and Colossus, shouldn't be too hard on monarch. Two hills means not so much production, but we have growth potential to whip trading post early. And I think we can find some metals or horses to speed things up a little bit.

 

[The Mad Swede]

Moving the scout SE will only allow him to move one square (on to the hill). While this would open up some tiles, another alternative would be to move him SW then SE (where I suggested moving the settler). Better yet you could move directly S from the settler's position, showing more coast tiles. This would leave the settler free to found on the first move if nothing better is visible.

Hmm, that is exactly what I meant. I just didn't write it. I always confuse east and west for some reason...

 

[Erkon]

I have been looking around for information regarding drafting (could be useful in this game), but I couldn't find anything, so I spent some time with worldbuilder and came up with this list:

Units you can draft with Nationhood:

1 population
Warrior
Axeman
Pikeman
Maceman (Berserker)
Musketman
Rifleman

2 population
Infantry

3 population
Mechanized Infantry

 

[Mastiff_of_Ar]

Anyone want to set up a test game? I'll do one tonight...

 

[Gnejs]

Units you can draft with Nationhood:

1 population
Warrior
Axeman
Pikeman
Maceman (Berserker)
Musketman
Rifleman

2 population
Infantry

3 population
Mechanized Infantry

Very interesting. Drafted Berserkers will be very useful, much more so than Muskets. I guess the Berserkers still get combat I and Amphibious even when drafted?

It would be fun to try a Nationalism beeline and set up a Globe theatre city for drafting Berserkers like crazy. Berserkers get to keep the Amphib even when upgraded, so all those drafts will continue to be useful.

 

[DaviddesJ]

I guess the Berserkers still get combat I and Amphibious even when drafted?

Yes, they do.

 

[Jastrow]

First a question...

What is "safe" for certain events in Monarch on such a map? Are:

Great LIghthouse in 500BC
Alpha in 250BC
Collosus in 250 AD

Safe, or not?


Also, a file is attached... Generated with the correct parameters (non-disclosed paramters set to random). Regenerted until I saw Jungle close-by to try and match lattitude. Edited start location a bit in worldbuilder. It is not identical to the start, but if you settle in place, you will get the same 21 squares as if you settle in place in the actual game (assuming I am reading the fog right).

Note that there are no hidden resources within the fat-cross in this test. I still suspect that there will be one in the real game, but I wanted to test without any.

 

[slowrider]

Ran some test games to get an idea of when the AI pops wonders. I ran 10 games with random island settings and got the following average and (minimum/maximum) turns for the AI to finish the early to mid wonders.

Buddism 25 (13-49)
Hindu 43 (20-69)
Judism 85 (65-105)
Confu 135 (114-162)
Christ 172 (150-197)
Tao 203 (173-244)
Islam 243 (220-265)

Stonehen 106 (75-148)
Oracle 106 (92-132)
Gr Wall 140 (87-195)
Gr Light 161 (137-197)
Pyramids 172 (109-272)
Temp of Arm 155 (129-205)
Parth 196 (138-260)
Hang Gard 197 (172-216)
Great Lib 215 (201-236)
Colossus 220 (161-239)

Circumnav 251 (220-273)

 

[DaviddesJ]

Ran some test games to get an idea of when the AI pops wonders. I ran 10 games with random island settings and got the following average and (minimum/maximum) turns for the AI to finish the early to mid wonders.

Would you be willing to run the same test with the Challenger settings? I'd really be interested in the difference.

 

[slowrider]

Would you be willing to run the same test with the Challenger settings? I'd really be interested in the difference.

Sure ... that would be interesting but I'm not sure how. On the custom game settings it shows the AIs at noble but it's greyed out and I'm not sure how to change it to settler. Let me know how to do it and I'll give it a shot.


An unrelated question ... do the free combat I and Amphibious promotions count as level 2 for purposes of needing a level 4 for the Heroic Epic?

 

[cabert]

Sure ... that would be interesting but I'm not sure how. On the custom game settings it shows the AIs at noble but it's greyed out and I'm not sure how to change it to settler. Let me know how to do it and I'll give it a shot.

can't help, sorry

An unrelated question ... do the free combat I and Amphibious promotions count as level 2 for purposes of needing a level 4 for the Heroic Epic?

no
but this is more of a good thing : next promotions are not far away

 

[slowrider]

Question regarding trade routes ... when you meet a new civ and can get the associated foreign trade routes, do you have to reveal their cities to have access to trade routes with those cities or can you just meet them tangentially and move on to meeting other civs?

 

[Jastrow]

Question regarding trade routes ... when you meet a new civ and can get the associated foreign trade routes, do you have to reveal their cities to have access to trade routes with those cities or can you just meet them tangentially and move on to meeting other civs?

The requirement is not only that the city be known, but that a PATH along the coast is known that connects the cities... I am not sure if YOU mush know it, or if either you or your trading partner knowing it is good enough.

 

[slowrider]

Regarding my trade route question I went into worldbuilder and found the following:

When you meet a new civ you don't have to actually "see" a city to establish a trade route with it. That is assuming that you have open borders and there's a unblocked connections and you have sailing, etc.

In my test game once I met a new civ and established open borders I started getting trade routes with some of their cities I hadn't seen yet.

This may seem a little off topic but I was thinking pre-game strategy regarding an aggressive "meet the neighbors" approach and wasn't sure how completely I needed to explore their territory before moving on to more searching.