Odd game

[grumpylad]

Playing as Sheaim, founded AV and declined to take the role of Hyborem because I had a cunning plan, or so I thought. As I had founded the Order I decided to rush build Mercurian Gate in a small city built for that purpose.

My plan was to match the summoners of the Sheaim againest the angels of the Mercurians, I declared war on the Infernals zapped them as they had popped up right next to my SOD and took over Dis. So far so good.

Next turn nothing happened, no Gate wonder etc and no war against Basium I can kind of understand it, No Infernals so no Mercurians, This raises the question that if they former are destroyed do the later disappear?

Keep up the great work, btw looking forward to watching the trees grow in .21. What next watching paint dry?

 

[jwin]

I believe that without the infernals, the gate can't be built. I had a game where I had almost completed it, someone else killed the infernals, and it said I could no longer complete the gate.

 

[Nikis-Knight]

Correct, but if the Infernals are destroyed, the Mercurians do not disappear, you can keep playing with/as them.

 

[Frozen-Vomit]

I think it would be cool for the Mercurians to leave after the Infernals are destroyed. The civ which summoned Basium would get back all cities the mercurians have - but all angelic units would disappear. Makes sense flavourwise as i remember reading somewhere that Basium only cares about the Infernal and nothing else.

The problem would be when you change to the Mercurians - maybe just give them a victory condition with killing the Infernals, but that sounds pretty easy with the poor starts the Infernals get.

I guess I will also post this in the Balance Thread.

 

[Kael]

I think it would be cool for the Mercurians to leave after the Infernals are destroyed. The civ which summoned Basium would get back all cities the mercurians have - but all angelic units would disappear. Makes sense flavourwise as i remember reading somewhere that Basium only cares about the Infernal and nothing else.

The problem would be when you change to the Mercurians - maybe just give them a victory condition with killing the Infernals, but that sounds pretty easy with the poor starts the Infernals get.

I guess I will also post this in the Balance Thread.

We talked about this. I dont remember who it was but some folks on the design team wanted this as well.

For a concept standpoint it sounds good. My disagreement is how it works in play. Specifically I have the following concerns:

1. If the player invests the time to create the Mercurians only to lose them because someone else defeats the Infernals it will be a letdown.

2. If the player and the Mercurians expand nicely the combination of their empires could cripple the economy of the player that is left. Turning a win condition into a loss for something the player should be rewarded for.

3. It incents the player (human player teamed up with the mercurians) to leave the infernals alone so that he can keep his teammate.

 

[Frozen-Vomit]

We talked about this. I dont remember who it was but some folks on the design team wanted this as well.

For a concept standpoint it sounds good. My disagreement is how it works in play. Specifically I have the following concerns:

1. If the player invests the time to create the Mercurians only to lose them because someone else defeats the Infernals it will be a letdown.

2. If the player and the Mercurians expand nicely the combination of their empires could cripple the economy of the player that is left. Turning a win condition into a loss for something the player should be rewarded for.

3. It incents the player (human player teamed up with the mercurians) to leave the infernals alone so that he can keep his teammate.

Hmm,

What about blocking the angle creation process and take away all existing angels with the destruction of the Infernals.

The Angels themselve leave as their job is done but the normal civilization stays. Maybe take away all traits from them as well but I'm not sure if this is already implemented with the leave of Basium.

 

[Nimbus]

Hmm,

What about blocking the angle creation process and take away all existing angels with the destruction of the Infernals.

The Angels themselve leave as their job is done but the normal civilization stays. Maybe take away all traits from them as well but I'm not sure if this is already implemented with the leave of Basium.

would you really want to play a game as basium if you knew that before you could win a game all of your angel units would leave and maybe some of your traits? what about the units that angels upgrade into, how do you get those without angels? Not a game I would look forward to finishing.

 

[Kael]

Hmm,

What about blocking the angle creation process and take away all existing angels with the destruction of the Infernals.

The Angels themselve leave as their job is done but the normal civilization stays. Maybe take away all traits from them as well but I'm not sure if this is already implemented with the leave of Basium.

You will be weakening the civ in responce to something they should be rewarded for. Still pushing efficient players into a place where they will leave the infernals around instead of killing them.

 

[Frozen-Vomit]

would you really want to play a game as basium if you knew that before you could win a game all of your angel units would leave and maybe some of your traits? what about the units that angels upgrade into, how do you get those without angels? Not a game I would look forward to finishing.

I still was talking about when you not play as Basium

 

[Nimbus]

I still was talking about when you not play as Basium

I understand that but as long as Basium is human playable, I think any changes to them should consider how it would effect the human player also. As a non-human civ the change you proposed would add a very interesting dynamic to the game. But as a human civ I would avoid them like the plague.

 

[MagisterCultuum]

The Mercurians should not leave the world if Infernal is gone but the world is still full of conjured and/or barbarian demons. Also, Basium's wrath is not only against the demons but those who summom them, as shown at the end of this civilopedia entry. If The Infernals are gone but every player is loyal to the Ashen Veil, his task is far from done.