OFW1 Science and Industry

Just an interim report, I'm afraid. This has been a very time-consuming round, because the Greeks sneak-attacked us as soon as I pressed Enter, taking Hyangsan, Pusan, and Ereen. The military situation is now (1365 AD) under control; I've taken back the two Korean cities, and also conquered Delphi and Pergamon (razed). But losing cities in democracy is the absolute worst case for WW, and we're very close to falling into anarchy (two rounds of WW already) even though it's too early in the war for the Greeks to talk to us. :mad:

On the brighter side, we generated a Great Leader with almost our first attack of the war, so we now have both ToE and Suffrage in Pasargadae.
 
My mistake in switching to democracy is costing us dear I'm afraid. :sad:
I can't apologise enough.

Still, a war with the Greeks was an inevitability, and falling into anarchy will give us something to think about anyway ;)

That's as close to looking on the bright side I can get :)
 
Yes, taking the long view this just adds interest to a hopelessly won game, as chessplayers say.
 
Well, I kinda had a feeling that the Greeks were getting a little restless. Great job on a GL!
 
GREEK GIFT


1340 (0): I fiddle with some of the builds out of habit, but basically everything looks good.

I spend some time evolving an elegant plan to dispose of the Romans, the Mongols, and the Chinese on this round. Then I press Enter, and the Greeks sneak-attack us. They take Pusan in Korea and Ereen in the middle of nowhere, though Altin Tepe withstands a determined attack.

We develop Scientific Method.


1345 (1): It would be fairly easy to bring the Babylonians into the war against the Greeks, but then we wouldn't be free to make peace with the Greeks as soon as possible, so I decide we can't afford to do it.

We destroy six Greek cavalry units in Korea without loss, but our garrisons there are still inadequate and we'll probably lose another city. In a skirmish outside Altin Tepe, however:
 
OFW1_1345_AD.JPG
 
And also:

CIVIIIEVOLUTION.JPG


I choose Atomic Theory and Electronics as our free techs, as usual. Replaceable Parts looks good right now, but I don't want to let a minor military crisis divert us from the right long-term course.

Hyangsan falls to a Greek attack, though Altin Tepe holds again. Bampur, held by one warrior, resists the attack of one archer--low-tech warfare in the boondocks!

The first round of war weariness hits. Only minor adjustments are necessary, but this is horribly fast.


1350 (2): We re-take Pusan, held by only a rifleman and a cav unit, and destroy two other cavalry elsewhere in Korea.

Magnetism and Military Tradition to America for incense, WM, and 11 gold. Another rip-off, but they're so backward it doesn't matter.

Shiraz completes a coal plant--not a very exciting use of your prebuild, OFW, but I want to crank out a cavalry a turn here (albeit with a huge food deficit).

We pillage the Greek saltpetre near Buto.

Electricity to the Carthaginians for Nationalism, 38 gold, and WM. I'd never do this under normal circumstances, but musketmen aren't enough against the Greek cavalry.

The Greeks draw the Romans into an embargo against us.

Pusan, Altin Tepe, and Namp'o all resist Greek attacks, though with some loss. A concentrated Greek attack on either of the first two would have succeeded.


1355 (3): We re-take Hyangsan, held only by one rifleman, and destroy six assorted Greek units for no loss elsewhere.

Cyrus arrives in Pasargadae to rush US, so:

CIVIIISUFF.JPG


As if to underline the uselessness of Universal Suffrage, the second round of WW hits. Luxury rate 0% --> 20%.


1360 (4): I merge a worker into Hyangsan to boost it up to size seven for defensive purposes.

We pick off two Greek units still in Korea. The Greeks, now facing riflemen in our front-line cities, don't attack in their turn.


1365 (5): I certainly don't like attacking riflemen in size-twelve cities with cavalry when massive artillery support isn't available. But we have to hurt the Greeks enough that they'll make peace as soon as the rules allow, so I decide to see how far we can get with such attacks before our losses become unacceptable. We assault Delphi first, and it goes well; we destroy the garrison of three riflemen, and capture a cannon, for the loss of just two cavalry. Pergamon is next, and the retreat ability of mobile units helps us enormously; we require eight attacks to defeat the garrison, again three riflemen and a cannon, but we don't lose a unit. We raze Pergamon to really get the Greeks' attention (well, more because I want the slave labour, and because it's tactically acceptable here), but they still won't talk to us. Presumably it's just too early, and anarchy looms.

I renew our gems deal with the Ottomans, sending them iron, ivory, 20 gold, and WM. I let our wines deal with the Russians lapse, since they want a small fortune to renew it and they're a major rival.

Greek frigates bombard New, repeat New, Pasargadae, and destroy its library.

We found Qom on the ruins of Pergamon.

The moment of truth. I hit Enter, fully expecting anarchy--and we get two palace expansions instead.

The Greeks muster only one attack (versus Qom), and we defeat it.


1370 (6): The Greeks still won't talk. This must be the last turn before our government collapses.

I abandon Delphi as an unacceptable flip risk, and found Ninus on the same site.

We take Troy from its garrison of three riflemen and one longbowman, in another cavalry-versus-rifles attack which fares better than it really should. Our only loss is an elite knight, used against the longbowman in a seemingly safe bit of leader-fishing.

The Greeks have had enough! Alexander is willing to negotiate. First we pick off six assorted Greek units (doing a little more leader-fishing, unsuccessfully) and abandon Troy as a flip risk, founding Issus one tile from the ruins. Then we make a slightly favourable peace, receiving 140 gold, 6 gpt, and Greece's WM.

Phew. Given that the first two rounds of war weariness came after my first and third turns, it seemed reasonable to expect the third after my fifth. I suppose the difference was that we stopped losing cities.


1375 (7): We declare war on the Chinese, take Taejon (so that now we have furs), and auto-raze Paoting.


1380 (8): We take Ningpo, and:
 
We found Tabriz, to redeem a few wasted tiles between Chengdu and Tsingtao.

We get two more palace expansions.


1385 (9): We found Arak next to the ruins of Paoting.

We declare war on the Koreans and land four cavalry units next to Pyongsong.

Numerous worker merges put our second core into superb shape.


1390 (10): And finally:
 
THE FUTURE:


Pasargadae is just about to build Wall Street, and Hoover is due in four turns in Persepolis.

Four techs we don't have are in play: Sanitation, Espionage, Communism, and Refining. (The Greeks have a monopoly on Refining.) I haven't tried to trade Scientific Method for them because I don't think tech trades are in our interest in this situation. We want a slow tech pace and we want to stay ahead in the race for the U.N., so there's no reason for us to help the AI civs by trading them our monopoly techs. We're about to complete universities in quite a few good cities, and it looks as though we'll be able to self-research all the remaining required Industrial Age techs in 30-40 turns. I doubt that our rivals can match this pace, provided we withhold our discoveries from them.

Right now I have our research rate turned down a bit so that we won't overpay for our last turn of progress on Replaceable Parts. We can research at 70% without running a deficit.

I've established efficient ship chains from Antioch via Avaris to Thebes (eight galleons), and from Pi-Ramesses to Namp'o (twelve galleons). I'd suggest that the ships in these chains not be moved away except in case of dire need.

We have two galleons around Choyr in the north, so if you feel like attacking the Romans and/or the Mongols, it should now be possible to reach their cities on that irritating northern island. Galleon 16, off Pyongyang, is sailing to join this northern squadron.

I haven't made much progress on our very-long-term project of establishing a transport fleet near Russia, but there are two galleons in Istakhr, and Hamadan and Borazjan should be able to construct more quickly when they complete their current builds.

Note that there are quite a few units in Buto, including an elite knight. Most of our other elites are in Korea.

There are three workers on unimproved desert tiles near Behistun. These three tiles should get rails and mines, after which Behistun will complete its factory fairly quickly.

Pyongsong's library should be cash-rushed next turn.

Yes, I'm actually done now. :) Over to you, mad-bax.
 
One great leader, 2 wonders completed and 2 rivals taken out of the game. I think you need to raise your game a little NP ;)

The only question I would ask is, wouldn't Hoovers be better placed on the larger continent?

I haven't had time to inspect the save yet, but obviously a very helpful set of turns.

Anyway, got it and will play tonight or tomorrow.
 
You're quite right about Hoover. I glanced at the accumulated shields in Persepolis and Shiraz at the beginning of my round, somehow assumed there was an important difference, and then never reconsidered the matter, with everything else that was happening.

I suppose we should switch Persepolis to Military Academy, accept the waste of 200+ shields [pimp], and start on Hoover in Shiraz (due in eleven turns, or ten with a food deficit). We're so far ahead on this part of the tech chart that the risk of being beaten to Hoover would be minimal.
 
This is just a quick note to say I have completed my turns. Nothing happened (at all).

I just don't have time to write up the turnlog this evening. I will post 8.00am GMT.
 
No prob, I don't have time to do anything civ related until Tuesday late or wednesday.
 
I knew I should have spent the extra half an hour to post last night. But I didn't. So I get into work this morning and close notepad, which of course contains the unsaved turnlog. I am so thick sometimes it makes me :cringe:

So I will try to give a reasonable synopsis below.

Pre-turn. Everything looks good. Hoovers is 4 turns from completion and I can't bring myself to dump the shields, so I leave it to complete.

Research on RP completes and we start 4 turn research on Sanitation. This is mainly to give our workers somewhere to live when they retire anytime soon.

The next few turns were just railing turns, and getting hydro plants in the palace core. Some towns lack markets and ducts.

When sanitation completed I was torn between Radio and steel. Steel is on the way to tanks and was attractive, but in the end I opted for Radio as the most expensive tech that would be a definite monopoly and at maximum non-deficit research would complete on my last turn.

I can't see a way of getting enough money to buy refining from the AI before having to research it ourselves.

So hopitals were started in core cities with a food surplus, and I irrigated the cattle near persepolis to give Pasargadae another mined grass to work.

Then I started to optimise the palace core for production and joined in most of the native workers. I stopped when I only had idle slaves left, so there is a fair bit of optimisation to go yet.

I built a few boats and sent them on their way to various locations ready for the Russian assault. Some of them are on short goto's I'm afraid.

I renewed a spices and dyes deal with Carthage.

A Trade embargo by the Greeks and Romans is still in force ATM.

Battlefield medicine is halfway done in Pasargadae.

River Palace has about 30 slaves in it with nothing to do right now. We got sanitation a little later than I am used to and we also had more slaves than I'm used to. I think I would join the Chinese workers into chinese towns and organise the others into pollution teams.

Similarly, Persepolis has a number of idle workers waiting around.
The way the terrain is set up at the moment it's difficult to build hospitals on this island without irrigating stuff. I think I would irrigate a little just to get that core above pop 12 for the defensive bonus.

The culture city is now making 100cpt, which is quite respectable considering the number of wonders we have built in other places.
So all in all we are in good shape.

Now the question is, when do we go to war? and do we wait for tanks? Cavalry are a highly wasteful unit ATM. 80 shields cost with most of our core cities producing around 60spt.

I would just like to apologise for not having a proper turnlog. I hope I have given enough information for OFW to play.

Here is the <<save>>.
 
Sorry about your lost-report disaster. I lost one once, back when I just typed into the reply form rather than using Wordpad and pasting.

Sanitation was clearly the right choice. Our second core is tremendously powerful now. :goodjob:

I don't think it's going to matter whether we're ever in a position to buy Refining. We seem to be researching the AI civs into the ground. I was amazed to see that we still have a monopoly on SM, never mind AT and Electronics.

I wouldn't object to merging Chinese workers into Chinese cities, but I wouldn't go beyond this. Maintenance-free labour is a precious resource, even at this point.

I think we should probably wait for tanks before making war on our major opponents, simply because artillery war is so time-consuming in RL terms. But anyone who feels like it can finish off the Romans and/or Mongols with cavalry.

OFW, almost everyone is furious with us, so we may well be sneak-attacked during your round. You might want to upgrade our units facing Greece, Rome, and what's left of Mongolia to infantry. And though it would be more work, it wouldn't hurt to get some infantry into our vulnerable cities north of Babylonia.

Bushire is about to go into disorder. ;)
 
I have downloaded the save, will play by thursday, sorry for the delay guys. Up in 2 succession games and well, I am also on OT at work and still gotta deal with RL too!

No prob with the report, you obviously have a good memory!

I don't know if I could do that good if I lost my notes.
 
Don't worry about the delay. I'm busy too.

Oh, and mad-bax, good idea getting that ironclad deployed off Pasargadae. To let our 20K city get bombarded at this point would be appalling.
 
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