Old Civ 2 player new to BtS - comment my save

[oynaz]

Hi guys. I am an old hand at Civ2, and I have jumped straight into Civ4 BtS. There are a lot of new content, and I think I am a bit overwhelmed. I have an interesting game going on as the Vikings on a Terra map, and I would like to see some comments on the posted save game. Some of you guys are quite sharp at this, so it could be fun.

In this game, I found myself with little land, and almost no production. I quickly created the Moai Statues, and relied heavily on slavery. As well, I went straight to Astronomy, and colonised the huge new continent (Terra map). I have quite a precense there, with 9 good cities, some of them potentially very strong, but the maintenance is bleeding me dry. I am definitely guilty of overexpanding.

As I see it, I have a couple of paths from here:

1) Get a lot of courthouses, and get a Forbidden Palace on the new continent as quickly as possible

2) I have Permanent Alliances enabled, so I might want to consider granting the new continent independence, and strike up a Permanent Alliance as soon as I have researched Communism. However, a civ on the new continent without heavy maintenance cost can potentially be a superpower in very few turns, so it might be a risky strategy.

Your thoughts?

 

[Silence101]

Hi guys. I am an old hand at Civ2, and I have jumped straight into Civ4 BtS. There are a lot of new content, and I think I am a bit overwhelmed. I have an interesting game going on as the Vikings on a Terra map, and I would like to see some comments on the posted save game. Some of you guys are quite sharp at this, so it could be fun.

In this game, I found myself with little land, and almost no production. I quickly created the Moai Statues, and relied heavily on slavery. As well, I went straight to Astronomy, and colonised the huge new continent (Terra map). I have quite a precense there, with 9 good cities, some of them potentially very strong, but the maintenance is bleeding me dry. I am definitely guilty of overexpanding.

As I see it, I have a couple of paths from here:

1) Get a lot of courthouses, and get a Forbidden Palace on the new continent as quickly as possible

2) I have Permanent Alliances enabled, so I might want to consider granting the new continent independence, and strike up a Permanent Alliance as soon as I have researched Communism. However, a civ on the new continent without heavy maintenance cost can potentially be a superpower in very few turns, so it might be a risky strategy.

Your thoughts?

I can't look at you're save because I'm at work... but I was thinking, you could probably rebuild your palace on the new continent which would reduce matinence costs for the cities there... (it sounds like, from your post, that the majority of your cities are there.) I've honestly never tried moving the capital to another continent, but I think it should work. If not, the Forbidden Palace option is a nice idea. If the cities on the new continent make up the majority of your Civ, I probably wouldn't grant independence... that might cause more harm than good in the long run.

 

[Nickzilla]

On the save you posted, you are playing as the Native Americans... Did you post the right one?

Just confused since you were talking about vikings on Terra.

But I do play a lot of terra, so I'll tell you what pays for me when it comes to overseas colonies.

Firstly, implement state property while you're gaining your initial foothold. This will cut your costs while making the colonies productive enough to pay for themselves. I'd build two or so cities in coastal hot spots to ship reinforcements to and then take local barbarian towns since they're usually in good places. (If barbs are off, just ship more settlers over) I really don't advise using vassals on the new world, but they're an option for the little islands and scatterings of land that sometimes show up near the poles, if only to control the resources that are there.

New world colonization is a big investment, but it can turn the tide of a game completely if it's done successfully.

 

[oynaz]

Haha. Wrong save

I will post the right one when I get home from work. Thx for the replies, though.

 

[oynaz]

This should be the correct save

 

[Coast]

Yeah, I can't look at the save either right now.. but special rules come into play in BTS for 'overseas colonies'. They cost a -lot- more in maintenance, and it's not alleviable by things like the forbidden palace. Move yer palace, and you'd only be paying that 'overseas colonies' maintenance for your original cities - and four is much, *much* more reasonable. The penalties increase as you have more cities on an 'away' continent, but four is a good number.

Y'might even create a colony/vassal of your original lands and just explode over the new world. With that much space, all by your lonesome.. you can expect to avoid wars and you'll always have an old world ally.

 

[Nickzilla]

Okay, I took a look at your new one and 'ed at how many cities you had over there. Looking at your starting position it is obviously a necessity but still.

Sadly saving your economy isn't as simple as switching to state property as I suggested since you don't have communism yet. I think you should make getting that technology your first priority, so switch paths from steam power to communism. Once your mainland cities have finished their economy aiding buildings (courthouses, markets, grocers, banks, custom houses, etc) I think you should have them building research until you finish communism. Switch any city specialists you have to scientists and try to boost your beaker output until you get communism and ergo, state property.

The reason I'm putting over state property so much is because it will cut your distance maintence costs completely. In case you didn't know, city upkeep is decided on three factors. A) your number of cities and B) The distance of your cities from your palace (or forbidden palace/versailles) and C) Colonial expenses. If you cut B out of the equation you (in the case of this game) will save a little over 70 gold per turn on distance expenses, which will ease a lot of your economic pressure.

After state property is implemented, you may need to keep it for the rest of this game. If you don't want to, then it'd be wisest to change when you have your forbidden palace up and running over there and your colonies are finally making more money than they lose.

I can't think of much advice besides that so... good luck!

 

[marowaker]

In case you didn't know, city upkeep is decided on three factors. A) your number of cities and B) The distance of your cities from your palace (or forbidden palace/versailles) and C) Colonial expenses.

If you have 3.13, then C) will disapear with state property as well.

 

[oynaz]

Truly? State Property would net me about 300 gold per turn then

And that is not even counting the four extra cities I am planning.