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Passing the Torch

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Succession Games' started by Rex Tyrannus, Feb 25, 2010.

  1. arkenstone

    arkenstone Chieftain

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2010
    Messages:
    52
    Inherited turn

    Well I looked at teches and found out we are the only ones in the world who do not have music, corperation, and teology.

    Advanced civs in order (least to greatest)

    Sitting bull
    Memed II
    Passing the torch
    Fredrick
    Pacal II

    So I traded a little and hear where my trades

    Sitting bull theology and music for I don’t remember
    Pacal II a 2 for 2 techs

    New tech. situation is us and Fredrick change and four sourse of uranium where found

    Hit enter

    Turn 1

    New York ?->destroyer
    Bactrian levee-> hermiteage
    Kohiosan spy -> worker
    Detroit library -> transport

    other mager thing that happened is that I am sending over 2 spies and a machine gunner oh yea sitting bull declared war on Pacal II and memed declared on sitting bull.

    Hit enter

    Turn 2

    Washington; jail-> Oxfornd Univercity
    Boston; machine gun-> air ship
    Timbuktu; iornworkes-> bank
    Houston library->bank

    Our priveter plundered 3 gold from memed! I also started to send transports over to see what the battle is looking like (3 machinee guns and 2 spies)

    Hit enter

    Pacal asked us to help him I am thinking going out with priveters and destroying all boats from both sides mwahahaha!

    Turn 3
    Cooperation->flight
    Seatle; library->bank
    San fran; forge-> library
    Djeene; leeve->barrackes
    Portland; corthouse->lighthouse
    Tech up date

    Us
    Fredrick
    Pacal II
    Sitting bull
    Memed II

    Okay so I went into the big war and I sunk a galleon of sitting bull but didn’t declare war though. In the war sitting bull does not stand a chance because he has no oil!

    Hit enter

    We lost a priveeter to a friget of memed’s

    Turn 4

    Boston; airship-> machine gunner
    Kosain; great place for scalorship they demand a university sure way not?
    Timbuktu; bank-> public transportation
    Mecca; library-> bank

    Gepid (sitting)

    Pacal II sitting bull
    Riflemen (1) cussiar (1)
    Cannon (1) longbiw (4)
    Grenener (4) pikeman (2)
    Knigrht (3) +60% defense.
    War elephant (2)
    Trebuchet (3)
    Chariot (2)

    Priveter attackes memed’s galleon. It win’s. declared war on memed.

    Hit enter

    Turn 5
    New york; destoyer->airship
    Chicago; market -> transport
    Kubi slah; grocer -> bank
    Dejenne; barrackes -> airship

    Gepid
    Pacal II +2 rifleman and sitting bull - 59%
    Machine gunner and 2 spies droped off near gepid.

    Hit enter

    Maya took Gepid and going south I think
    Turn 6

    Bactrian; hermatage->airship
    Timbuktu; public transportation-> theater
    Djeene; airship-> airship
    Hit enter

    Ottoman cat. Destroyed our air ship

    Turn 7

    Washington oxford university and I will not post what else that happened (time)

    Turn 9
    Flight-> artillery

    We have sort of spies (+ airships + fighters all over sitting bull)

    Pacl II threatens us!

    Rex your turn!
     
  2. arkenstone

    arkenstone Chieftain

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2010
    Messages:
    52
    Inherited turn

    Well I looked at teches and found out we are the only ones in the world who do not have music, corperation, and teology.

    Advanced civs in order (least to greatest)

    Sitting bull
    Memed II
    Passing the torch
    Fredrick
    Pacal II

    So I traded a little and hear where my trades

    Sitting bull theology and music for I don’t remember
    Pacal II a 2 for 2 techs

    New tech. situation is us and Fredrick change and four sourse of uranium where found

    Hit enter

    Turn 1

    New York ?->destroyer
    Bactrian levee-> hermiteage
    Kohiosan spy -> worker
    Detroit library -> transport

    other mager thing that happened is that I am sending over 2 spies and a machine gunner oh yea sitting bull declared war on Pacal II and memed declared on sitting bull.

    Hit enter

    Turn 2

    Washington; jail-> Oxfornd Univercity
    Boston; machine gun-> air ship
    Timbuktu; iornworkes-> bank
    Houston library->bank

    Our priveter plundered 3 gold from memed! I also started to send transports over to see what the battle is looking like (3 machinee guns and 2 spies)

    Hit enter

    Pacal asked us to help him I am thinking going out with priveters and destroying all boats from both sides mwahahaha!

    Turn 3
    Cooperation->flight
    Seatle; library->bank
    San fran; forge-> library
    Djeene; leeve->barrackes
    Portland; corthouse->lighthouse
    Tech up date

    Us
    Fredrick
    Pacal II
    Sitting bull
    Memed II

    Okay so I went into the big war and I sunk a galleon of sitting bull but didn’t declare war though. In the war sitting bull does not stand a chance because he has no oil!

    Hit enter

    We lost a priveeter to a friget of memed’s

    Turn 4

    Boston; airship-> machine gunner
    Kosain; great place for scalorship they demand a university sure way not?
    Timbuktu; bank-> public transportation
    Mecca; library-> bank

    Gepid (sitting)

    Pacal II sitting bull
    Riflemen (1) cussiar (1)
    Cannon (1) longbiw (4)
    Grenener (4) pikeman (2)
    Knigrht (3) +60% defense.
    War elephant (2)
    Trebuchet (3)
    Chariot (2)

    Priveter attackes memed’s galleon. It win’s. declared war on memed.

    Hit enter

    Turn 5
    New york; destoyer->airship
    Chicago; market -> transport
    Kubi slah; grocer -> bank
    Dejenne; barrackes -> airship

    Gepid
    Pacal II +2 rifleman and sitting bull - 59%
    Machine gunner and 2 spies droped off near gepid.

    Hit enter

    Maya took Gepid and going south I think
    Turn 6

    Bactrian; hermatage->airship
    Timbuktu; public transportation-> theater
    Djeene; airship-> airship
    Hit enter

    Ottoman cat. Destroyed our air ship

    Turn 7

    Washington oxford university and I will not post what else that happened (time)

    Turn 9
    Flight-> artillery

    We have sort of spies (+ airships + fighters all over sitting bull)

    Pacl II threatens us!

    Rex your turn!
     
  3. arkenstone

    arkenstone Chieftain

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2010
    Messages:
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    sorry i forgot to put on the save on my post sorry so haer it is!
     

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  4. Rex Tyrannus

    Rex Tyrannus 280lbs of gross stupidity

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2006
    Messages:
    2,942
    Location:
    Charlotte, NC USA
    Okay, so a couple of notes before I play.

    1) It looks like we're at war. Problem is, we're not really prepared for war. At least, we don't have enough to make quick work of Mehmed. See, we're still building our infrastructure. In 30 or so turns, we'd have had each of our new cities producing the beakers and hammers necessary to have a full war machine going. Now, if we're to make this war effective, we'll need some of those cities building units, taking them off of necessary infrastructure, and delaying the time at which they'll be effective cities that pay for themselves. I'm going to keep this a fake war, shipping over some entrenched defense for Mehmed to throw his microstacks at, but that's it. I'll build good units in our cities that already have infrastructure, but this will be anything but a full-scale mobilization.

    2) Oxford in Washington? I thought we agreed to put it in Philly. Guys, please don't build national wonders without either obtaining group consensus or, at least, thinking about the advantages one city has over another. Currently, Philly is giving us 68 beakers base. Washington is only at 28. Since Oxford gives a 100% bonus, this is a 40 beaker per turn difference. Okay, that's not gamebreakingly huge, but 40 beakers is a lot each turn to throw away.

    3) We're building airports in every city, it seems. We don't need that many airports. They give one more trade route (worth between 2 and 4 gold per turn). They give XP to air units built and they allow us to airlift. We don't have so much production that we'll need to lift more than 3-4 units per turn, so any more expensive airports is less than ideal.
     
  5. Rex Tyrannus

    Rex Tyrannus 280lbs of gross stupidity

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2006
    Messages:
    2,942
    Location:
    Charlotte, NC USA
    Well, first off, I need to start by saying that I downloaded the BUG (BTS Unaltered Gameplay) mod right before I played. This was done with assurances from Ruff Hi, one of the mod's compilers, that it wouldn't affect the save. Mainly, I wanted to use the auto-log to track the builds in our 31-city empire, but I also wanted to try out some of the other interface tools.

    I'm rather happy, except that I didn't realize that auto-log doesn't actually start working unless you press Ctrl+L (despite having set it to active and having changed the ini to auto start). Anyhow, the result is that turns 1-3 don't have build records; turns 4-7 do; and the last 3 don't because I took a several day break between sessions and forgot all about it.

    Sigh. Still had screenshots, though.

    Anyhow, we're at war, so I turned up EP on Mehmed




    This will let us take out a city defense or two. I also turned EP spending up to 10%. Science still at 60%.

    Turn 282

    Artillery comes in and I chose Biology



    Turn 285

    Sitting Bull is at war agaings Maya (along with Germany) and asks us to join in. I decline.

    Washington finishes: Airport begins: Artillery (4 turns)
    Hun finishes: Bank begins: Transport (8 turns)
    Seattle finishes: Destroyer begins: Destroyer (4 turns)
    Timbuktu finishes: Artillery begins: Artillery (2 turns)
    Djenne finishes: Airport begins: Wall Street (12 turns)
    Buffalo finishes: Courthouse begins: Artillery (6 turns)



    Turn 286

    Biology in



    Begin researching Assembly Line (5 turns)


    Boston finishes: Artillery begins: Artillery (3 turns)
    Bactrian finishes: Artillery begins: Artillery (5 turns)
    Timbuktu finishes: Artillery begins: Airport (3 turns)
    Damascus finishes: Cavalry begins: Carrier (7 turns)
    Mecca finishes: Bank begins: Jewish Temple (4 turns)
    Detroit finishes: Lighthouse begins: Drydock (14 turns)
    New Orleans finishes: Forge begins: Library (8 turns)

    Nain Singh (Great Engineer) born in Washington and I decide to found Mining, Inc there to take advantage of Oxford University.




    For the boys, Mining Inc costs 7 gold to spread, but gives 4 GPT to turn to the founding city for each city that has it. It also gives the satellite city a 1 hammer production bonus for each resource of coal, iron, copper, gold, and silver. We have a lot of those resources.

    Corporate execs are expensive and they cost gold to spread. However, the AI loves to do it for you. So the trick, boys, is to spread Mining Inc to our biggest hammer cities and then one exec to each rival. They'll then build execs and spread it for us. Hammer bonus for us. Cash bonus for us. Cash deficit for them. Minor production bonus for them (because we'll control all the resources).

    Now, corporate executives are expensive, so we don't want to just spread them everywhere, but look what they do in Timbuktu...

    Before



    After



    60 hammers. Now, that's with all the modifiers for building military, but I'll take it.

    IBT Fred and Sitting Bull both become Vassals of Pacal






    b]Turn 287[/b]

    New York finishes: Destroyer begins: Rifleman (3 turns)
    Philadelphia finishes: Transport begins: Cavalry (6 turns)
    Gao finishes: Destroyer begins: Rifleman (6 turns) <-- he'll be an infantry before he finishes
    St. Louis finishes: Spy begins: Harbor (10 turns)
    Baltimore finishes: Courthouse begins: Lighthouse (6 turns)

    Turn 288

    Washington finishes: Artillery begins: Mining Inc Executive (2 turns)
    Atlanta finishes: Fighter begins: Aqueduct (7 turns)
    Timbuktu finishes: Airport begins: Cavalry (1 turns)
    Kumbi Saleh finishes: Fighter begins: Cavalry (5 turns)
    Houston finishes: Airport begins: Cavalry (4 turns)
    Kufah finishes: Theatre begins: Harbor (40 turns) <-- let's hurry that
    Medina finishes: Drydock begins: Carrier (5 turns)

    Skirmishes break out

    While attacking, Transport decimates Ottoman Ship of the Line (Prob Victory: 99.6%)
    While attacking on the high seas near Konya, Transport (16.00/16) defeats Ottoman Ship of the Line (Prob Victory: 99.6%)
    While attacking, Transport decimates Ottoman Frigate (Prob Victory: 96.2%)
    While attacking in Ottoman territory near Ankara, Transport (11.20/16) defeats Ottoman Frigate (Prob Victory: 96.2%)
    While attacking, Destroyer decimates Ottoman Frigate (Prob Victory: 100.0%)
    While attacking on the high seas, Destroyer (27.00/30) defeats Ottoman Frigate (Prob Victory: 100.0%)

    Mehmed fights back



    I'm rather upset here. I had two machine guns camped out in a forest and Mehmed sent five cavalry at them. The first two withdrew, I killed the third, and the next two won. That doesn't seem fair. Now we have two fewer machine guns and Mehmed has two promoted Cavs. And he only lost one unit. Worse, I had a third machine gun one tile away, having been dropped off on the western coast and taken four turns to get over there. Grrr.


    Okay, that's it for my actual accounting. Here are some end of set shots...

    Carrier task force one and two, both heading to Mehmed's coast to cause damage





    Transport group one, two, and three, ready to drop troops off.







    I'm using Philly as a staging area.



    Chicago had been, but the wrong coast just takes too much time. Move all transports over to our west coast after that last one makes his drof-off.

    Top hammer cities



    Top beaker cities



    Power graph



    Victory screen



    Demographics

     

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  6. ruff_hi

    ruff_hi Live 4ever! Or die trying

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    9,095
    Location:
    an Aussie in Boston
    @Rex - re the logger ... try checking 'starts automatically' (it might be called 'silent mode' - I think we renamed the option recently).
     
  7. Arathorn

    Arathorn Catan player

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2002
    Messages:
    3,778
    Location:
    Illinois
    Sigh. Oxford doesn't help with the corporations at all. All corporations should be founded in the Wall Street city. Corporations directly provide money gold (not generic commerce), so they should always be founded in the WS city. Oxford only benefits science, which corporation HQs don't provide. Djenne should have been the Mining Inc. headquarters. Now we're going to pay a lot more to spread and maintain Mining.

    I don't know who started Oxford in Washington, either. Bad move. Very bad. It'll cost us lots more over time. Ultimately, that's a few thousand commerce mistake. We're far enough ahead at this point we can probably absorb it.

    That's two HUGE mistakes, though. They may seem small, but we should be more careful and play better.

    Biology opens up National Park. Do we have any city with enough forests to preserve and get good value out of that National wonder? We should look at that and try to make a better decision with that than we have the others.

    Arathorn
     
  8. Rex Tyrannus

    Rex Tyrannus 280lbs of gross stupidity

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    2,942
    Location:
    Charlotte, NC USA
    This is right and I'm sorry. I didn't realize that this revenue was added after the slider distributes funds. I've tested this in another game, however, and watched my beakers not increase as more execs spread the corporation. Again, I'm sorry.

    Someone less foolish than I could probably use this as an example to explain the difference in Civ between gold and commerce.
     
  9. Arathorn

    Arathorn Catan player

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2002
    Messages:
    3,778
    Location:
    Illinois
    Raw commerce is the sum total of incoming value. This comes from trade routes, worked squares (like cottages), and maybe somewhere else.

    Sliders break up raw commerce into raw science, raw gold, and raw culture.

    Raw science plus science from specialists (spies and scientists plus all specialists if in Representationism) and direct science producers (like religious buildings with university of sankore) are summed. That is then multiplied by things like libraries, universities, etc. to create total science output for that city.

    Similarly, raw gold is added to gold from specialists (merchants and prophets, I think, plus potentially settled great specialists) and gold from direct sources (like shrines or corporation HQs). That total is multiplied by buildings (markets, banks, wall street, etc.) to get total gold produced.

    Culture works the same way, with things like corporation branches (for Sid's sushi or creative constructionists) directly adding a la specialists before multipliers.

    It's important to know which things feed into which parts of which formulae. Unfortunately, Civ4 uses the stacked coins symbol for both commerce and gold, which easily leads to misunderstandings. :( Certain mods clarify that issue graphically, which I would probably use if I weren't so lazy.

    Hope that helps!
    Arathorn
     
  10. arkenstone

    arkenstone Chieftain

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2010
    Messages:
    52
    well sorry about the bad turn but i am only a 5th grader so i am learning a lot from "bigger' and "stropnger" and "batter" people then me so i am trying to do my best at learning "everything"
     
  11. IdiotsOpposite

    IdiotsOpposite Boom, headshot.

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2007
    Messages:
    2,718
    Location:
    America.
    You know, what I take from this post is that you, arkenstone, have one of the best qualities a Civver can have... a willingness to adapt and learn. That's extremely important. And don't worry about being "only a 5th grader". That matters about as much as playing the same game on a different computer would. Also, wasn't this game supposed to be where you learn from your mistakes? Well, you made a mistake, but that happens all the time. I mean, Rex just made a big mistake, I think. But you're learning from it.

    In short, you're doing fine. Don't fret.
     
  12. Rex Tyrannus

    Rex Tyrannus 280lbs of gross stupidity

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    Location:
    Charlotte, NC USA
    Hello all, Justinious played a few turns this weekend but couldn't finish. I'm working the "mom" front to get him some play time during the week. Crossing fingers.
     
  13. Arathorn

    Arathorn Catan player

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    3,778
    Location:
    Illinois
    If it doesn't work this week, that's OK. Baseball season is upon us here, and that means very full evenings and weekends.

    And, when I stop learning things playing a Civ game, I quit. But there's so much to learn and nobody is perfect. Reading and trying to improve will get us a long ways.

    But ... if nobody points out mistakes and explains "WHY", it's almost impossible to learn.

    That's my take.
    Arathorn
     
  14. Admiral Kutzov

    Admiral Kutzov Idiot Emeritus

    Joined:
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    4,900
    Location:
    Central Pennsyltucky
    lurker's comment: @arkenstone & justinious, don't worry about making a mistake at this stage. now is the time to experiment and have fun. You have half the world and are planning an invasion. ;)

    Here's something that always helped me in SG's. Look around before you start. Think about the short term goal and then the long term. bede and scoutsout taught me this (ask your dads about them). hit F1. which city has the most science? the most anvils? etc. which wonder will boost the whatever it is producing the most of? then go thru the other F keys. I don't remember what all the F keys do, but if you look at what you have, you can get an idea of where you might want to go.

    The other thing that always seems to work in all versions of civ is resource collection.

    Be clear on the difference between strategic and tactical. Strategic is deciding which city to take first. Tactics is deciding to use the cannons to wear them down before the rifles move in.

    hope this made sense. I'm an idiot. :crazyeye:
     
  15. arkenstone

    arkenstone Chieftain

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    Thanks for the tips "idiot"
     
  16. arkenstone

    arkenstone Chieftain

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    origonally posted by admiral kotzov:
    I'm an idiot. :crazyeye: [/delurk][/QUOTE]

    thanks for the tips "idiot"
     
  17. justinious

    justinious Chieftain

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2009
    Messages:
    18
    Sorry it took as long as it did! There was a lot of breaks (including Carowinds!!!:p:p:p:p:p:p:p:p:p:p) but there is action! Enjoy the movie!




    MY TURNS

    290

    zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

    291

    Assembly line comes in, so I start Fascism.

    292

    :spear::spear::spear::spear::spear::spear::spear::spear::spear::spear::spear:
    Destroyer and fighters v frigate W I N
    Destroyers v ship of the lines wwwwiiiiiiiiiiiinnnnnnnnnnnn

    293


    to Rocketry
    We got a great gen.

    294

    Pacal II and Mehmed II got great scientists

    295

    zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

    296

    Rocketry to Electricity
    BATTLE OF ANKARAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!
    BOMBARDING
    3 rifles v 3 calvary 3 flawless
    calv v treb win
    RNGod, bow down to me!
    calv v rif flawless
    rif v treb flawless
    RNGod, gimme the crown!

    297

    bombarding
    2 rif v 2 rif flawless
    rif v gren win
    to be continued...
     
  18. justinious

    justinious Chieftain

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2009
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    gren v calv win
    rif v treb taken
    Keep it

    298

    our spy got caught in Bursa

    we made church of nativity with our great prophet

    299

    zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

    300

    electricity to industriulism
    traded --------------- for radio gold map
    summary
    pics








     

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  19. Arathorn

    Arathorn Catan player

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    Some pics didn't load correctly. :(

    Where is Ankara? Why did we choose to keep it? (It's probably the right choice, I'm just wondering about the thought process)

    I want tanks. Are we deliberately avoiding that tech? Why Electricity and Rocketry instead of directly heading for tanks (and SEALs)?

    Oh well. I see it. No way Arkenstone and I can both play today, so I'm not going to rush. I'll play through the week, so Arkenstone can play next weekend.

    Arathorn
     
  20. arkenstone

    arkenstone Chieftain

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    well good report busy
     

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