Passive agressive Vassal domination

[slowcar]

If we plunder ghengis enough we should be able to pillage his iron even without seeing it. I'll see to get some reinforcements to his area, would be very bad if he could take our axe/spear out. And with iron he can as well build axes, we are lucky that he is too stupid

Strangling Huayana looks quite good.
I agree on alphabet first, we don't have too many trade partners though as they are all angry about our little worker steal madness
After a short detour to literature i think we should start pursuing feudalism to get our vassal business running. Monarchy can be traded. What do you think?

I can play tomorrow i think

 

[shyuhe]

research route sounds good. Alphabet-literature-feudalism (assuming monarchy and iron working trade in here somewhere). Our vassals are going to hate us this game because they're going to be mostly a minimum of -6

Is there anything we can do to hinder Mehmed or Louis at all in this game? Our eastern front looks like it's all under control.

 

[slowcar]

I played my turn.

Our mongolian plunder party pillages the floodplain farms and finally finds ghengis iron source.
: Hatshe declares on Ghengis. I wonder what exactly she was smoking. Both are judaistic
At least we now have a friend as she is now pleased with us.
Ghengis has quite some army and i am pretty sure he will send them all over if we stop to "siege" his capital. The AI tends not to move out of its capital if units are within 2 or 3 tiles. Very funny if you want to capture it - move your troops away and all but the standard garrison will go on pillage duty, follow you or do other crazy stuff yesterday my target moved his great general archer out of his capital when i did this
Anyhow, back to topic:
Hatshe and Ghengis are on the same powerlevel (says the power graph) so it should be relatively save to release Ghengis troops in direction of Hatshe. I fear we would get his whole stack marching on our cities otherwise which could prove problematic. As Hatshe declared it should be a fair guess that Ghengis won't be able to capture the judaistic holy city Elvistown.
I did not move the troops though as i wanted to see if Hatty has some secret army so it may be too late for this
Here a screen of the situation:

Our incan one-man-show hunts down a score of copper-miners and cuts Huayanas metal supply. Pyramids are built somewhere.

Louis says that confuzianism is mighty. If we were spiritual we could maybe follow his argumentation. As we are not we politely decline. French and their strange habits...
A single mongolian sword on its way to Cumae is dispatched.

10 turns too early the Temple of Artemis has been built, too bad. We get some money to research though. As we got a 100% bonus with marble this is a fair deal imo even though the wonder would have been better.
We have a barb city north of Antium (maybe move the archer there to fortify) and we got hold if a dschungle gem hill near reims. By the time we get iron working we can mine it for a in our cities:

Cyrus built a wonder in his capital, maybe it was Artemis. Not good for Cumae. I still think it is a crap city as it won't be able to grow further until we build a lighthouse or discover CS. I have a libary ordered there to counter the cultural pressure.

Alphebet in in 6 rounds. Rome is still on growth, once it reaches its designed size it can produce like mad, currently building on the Parthenon.
A problem is that we have only one friend, Hatshe. We can probably get Iron Working and st. else for CoL without breaking our Alphabet monopol, but no cross trading as the rest of the world hates us
I think its fine to trade with Hatshe and keep her as a friend , if she is more advanced then the rest of the world she won't share her techs with the others. If we get Parthenon built our GL will soon spawn a GS (no trouble here as long we keep Alphabet as monopoly) which can bulb philosophy -> trade for monarchy and something else maybe? We are not very good on research, let's hope we can aquire feudalism soon and start our vassal domination program

I don't think we should start more wars at the moment - at least not as long as Ghengis SoD is still existant - or our want-to vassals will fear our enemies. Still some way to go until feudalism though. Ghengis and Hatty are still at war - but could make peace any time now. Maybe we should try to move our pillage party?

Mutineer
Slowcar - Just played
shyuhe- Up
Tatran - getting ready
negyvenketto

 

[shyuhe]

Well, not a very eventful set.

Alphabet is completed at 100% research. I trade it for IW with Hatty, and I also ask her to stop trading with Cyrus since the deal would otherwise be too one-sided (it was that or IW + sailing) Now only Huayna likes Hatty enough to trade with her.

Literature is also in (I think the GL will help us get to feudalism faster, especially since we can't trade except with Hatty). The parthenon is almost complete in Rome, and I've ordered up the GL in Antium. Antium's borders are pushing both Mehmed and Louis' cities. However, Louis has too much on his hands - he's probably coming after us and he has iron too. But we have iron in Rome praets are out on the eastern front and I think we should build 2-3 for the west too. I have a few axes out pillaging Khan's villages to the east. Both Khan and Huayna settled the outer portions of the continent but they're not very good cities since they have no workers around

Research is currently on monarchy, and feudalism should be next after that. Mehmed also has monarchy but he hates us.

Cumae's culture is holding up for now - I debated building a monument or temple to help prevent a flip but it seems ok so far. Hatty has also taken peace with Genghis after having a city razed by Genghis. Poor girl.

I also founded the gem-cow-rice city next to Rome, as it seemed criminal to not use the gems. Plus, it'll give us one more and one more from the rice. Feel free to re-arrange the tiles for rome once the gems and rice are online as it can grow one more size (or more if we're going to start whipping).

Khan's SOD hasn't moved, and Huayna hasn't really sent anything out either. I have no idea what they're wasting their hammers on...

 

[Tatran]

ok, playing. Report in a few hours.

 

[Tatran]

70 BC (2)
Rome has finished the Parthenon.

20 AD (8)
Monarchy is known, start to research Feudalism.

Everyone is at least annoyed with Hatshepsut and us, so I made some deals with her.

50 AD (10)
Antium has completed the Great Library.
Rush library in Neapolis.

65 AD (11)

80 AD (12)
Some Great People have been born.
First, Norbert Rillieux (Great Engineer) in faraway land. Paris has the Pyramids +
Great Wall. The Hanging Gardens are probably going to Louis.
Second, Mo Tzu (Great Prophet) and Gaius Marius (Great General) are both born in Antium.
Antium has finished the Kong Miao.
Rush settler in Pisae, rush granary in Ravenna.

IBT 95 AD
The Egyptians have captured Beshbalik.

110 AD (14)
Rush library in Pisae.

125 AD (15)
Antium starts the Hanging Gardens (32 turns). Maybe we shouldn't waste hammers
on this wonder. The National Epic is a good alternative + someone (Louis?) has
a Great Engineer.

 

[slowcar]

I am full of expectation, eagerly awaiting feudalism to see if we get to vassalize somebody

Any info about Hattys troops? She did not manage to kill a single plundering archer in my turns, surprised that she captured a city from Ghengis. We should watch out to make her not too strong.

I think National Epic should wait unti we have our first GS from the GL, it happened to me quite often that i got an artist instead. With a few Great Scientists we should manage to beat the AIs on Liberalism, maybe with fast Cavs?

 

[Mutineer]

I can not look on save, but I am a bit confused.
Do we have litherature and are we building GL?

We have marble, but not stone, we should concentrate on marble based wanders.

If not we should argently switch back to plan.

 

[shyuhe]

Antium has the GL. So that's one less thing to worry about

 

[negyvenketto]

Got it. Will play this evening.

 

[negyvenketto]

I expected a boring turnset, but collected some experience points towards our second Great General instead
The first is sleeping in Antium, by the way, what's the plan with him?

Started with some diplomacy, agreed

Rejected

They are having some fun

HC keep building archers, couldn't capture barb city with them

The suprise

They are coming to die

I forgot about our scout near sout border, sorry to lost it.
In the meantime I refused Mehmed

But I kept Hatty happy

The current status around Antium

Khan is going out

Building Praet in Neapolis, next could be some and we can eventually grab the horse

Will get a GS or GP next turn. I think GS would give us Sailing (or Compass if we research Sailing ourselves), GP: Monotheism or shrine.

Spoiler :

Turn 175/660 (125 AD) [02-Apr-2007 18:39:00]
Pisae finishes: Barracks

IBT:

Turn 176/660 (140 AD) [02-Apr-2007 18:45:55]
Pisae begins: Granary (90 turns)

IBT:

Turn 177/660 (155 AD) [02-Apr-2007 18:51:09]
Rome finishes: Library
Ravenna grows: 3

IBT:

Turn 178/660 (170 AD) [02-Apr-2007 18:55:04]
Rome begins: Praetorian (5 turns)
Cumae finishes: Praetorian
Neapolis finishes: Archer
Pisae grows: 2
Apache's borders expand

IBT:

Turn 179/660 (185 AD) [02-Apr-2007 18:57:02]
Cumae begins: Hindu Temple (12 turns)
Neapolis begins: Praetorian (17 turns)
Archer promoted: City Garrison I
A Mine was built near Pisae

IBT:

Turn 180/660 (200 AD) [02-Apr-2007 19:00:00]

IBT:
Louis XIV(France) declares war on Mutineer Passive-Agressive II(Rome)

Turn 181/660 (215 AD) [02-Apr-2007 19:01:50]
A Winery was built near Apache

IBT:

Turn 182/660 (230 AD) [02-Apr-2007 19:04:47]
Rome finishes: Praetorian
Pisae's borders expand
Ravenna grows: 4

IBT:

Turn 183/660 (245 AD) [02-Apr-2007 19:09:28]
Rome begins: Axeman (4 turns)

IBT:
While defending in French territory near Rheims, Scout loses to: French Swordsman (5.28/6) (Prob Victory: 0.1%)

Turn 184/660 (260 AD) [02-Apr-2007 19:14:54]
Antium grows: 7

IBT:

Turn 185/660 (275 AD) [02-Apr-2007 19:17:06]
While attacking in Roman territory at Antium, Praetorian defeats (3.44/8): French Axeman (Prob Victory: 66.2%)
While attacking in Roman territory near Ravenna, Praetorian defeats (8.00/8): French Archer (Prob Victory: 99.0%)

IBT:

Turn 186/660 (290 AD) [02-Apr-2007 19:21:12]
While attacking in Roman territory at Antium, Praetorian defeats (5.44/8): French Swordsman (Prob Victory: 96.2%)
While attacking in Roman territory at Antium, Axeman defeats (3.60/5): French Spearman (Prob Victory: 99.0%)
Rome grows: 8
Rome finishes: Axeman
Ravenna grows: 5

IBT:
A Mine was destroyed near Pisae
A Mine near Pisae was destroyed by Incan Archer

Turn 187/660 (305 AD) [02-Apr-2007 19:26:03]
Rome begins: Praetorian (5 turns)
Praetorian promoted: Combat I
While attacking in Roman territory at Antium, Praetorian defeats (6.56/8): French Axeman (Prob Victory: 71.5%)
Axeman promoted: Shock
While attacking in Roman territory at Antium, Axeman defeats (3.50/5): French Swordsman (Prob Victory: 76.9%)
Pisae grows: 3

IBT:

Turn 188/660 (320 AD) [02-Apr-2007 19:29:22]
While attacking in Roman territory at Pisae, Praetorian defeats (8.00/8): Incan Archer (Prob Victory: 99.4%)

IBT:

Turn 189/660 (335 AD) [02-Apr-2007 19:32:44]
Praetorian promoted: Combat I
Praetorian promoted: Shock
While attacking in Roman territory at Antium, Praetorian defeats (4.16/8): French Axeman (Prob Victory: 88.0%)
While attacking in Roman territory at Antium, Praetorian defeats (0.32/8): French Swordsman (Prob Victory: 89.3%)
While attacking in Roman territory at Antium, Praetorian defeats (6.88/8): French Spearman (Prob Victory: 99.1%)
While attacking in Roman territory at Antium, Praetorian defeats (2.40/8): French Spearman (Prob Victory: 98.7%)
Neapolis grows: 4
Apache grows: 2

IBT:

Turn 190/660 (350 AD) [02-Apr-2007 19:37:33]
A Mine was built near Ollantaytambo
Praetorian promoted: Combat I
While attacking in Roman territory at Antium, Praetorian defeats (2.88/8): French Swordsman (Prob Victory: 89.3%)
While attacking in Roman territory at Antium, Praetorian defeats (8.00/8): French Spearman (Prob Victory: 99.1%)

The save

 

[slowcar]

GS should have philosophy on his list, sailing and optics are later on his list if this is still up to date. which would be excellent. taoism still unclaimed?

the war with the french is not too bad i think, as long as they don't have war elephants we can deal with them quite well, axes and praets are a very nice combi. And goint to war slows their tech-pace.
With feudalism in we should try to get peace with them though as our vassals will be frightened about our enemies if we have wars with the whole world going.

I wonder if ghengis is willing to capitulate before hatty takes him down. Without iron we will be in bad shape for her war phants.

negyvenketto after reading your log i am pretty sure you are a blessed follower of the RNGod!
Awesome fighting stats against the french!

 

[negyvenketto]

GS should have philosophy on his list, sailing and optics are later on his list if this is still up to date. which would be excellent. taoism still unclaimed?

Yes, but we don't have Meditation, after researching that, Philosophy will be the one.

I wonder if ghengis is willing to capitulate before hatty takes him down. Without iron we will be in bad shape for her war phants.

Maybe we can make peace with him enable him to concentare on 1 enemy only.

negyvenketto after reading your log i am pretty sure you are a blessed follower of the RNGod!
Awesome fighting stats against the french!

Last time I lost an axe with high odds, maybe this is the compensation

 

[Mutineer]

well, Mostly was growing cities or preparing them to grow.
Turn 1 traded alphavint to cyrus foir gold, setting research to 100%.
Got GP, spend it on theology, we do want to build Sistine chapel, we REALY want to.

Got Pheodalism, revolted to MOnarchy/Vassalage.
Next reseached prerequisites for Theology, sailing and set research for Dramma. I would advice to try for MUsic next.

Sell Litherature for gold.

Building Heroic Epic in capital and settle 2 military instractors there.
Next turn it will be ready and we need to start to Mass pump higly expirience praets from it.

Chengis ready to vassal, but afraid of our enemies.

Capac is not ready yet.

Please note, our enames are not only civs we are in war I think, but every civ we are a worst enemy.

There are 2 posible solution, try to make cyrus and Maxmed more friendly or Pump a lot of Praets to Push our power rating up(UU useally have relative higher power rating, pumping them is useally a good way to push our rating up.

I am really do not want to pump Maxmed or Cyrus up with tech for free, as they are most advanced.

I want to comment on good job we doing keeping Chengis and Capac pillaged. I startted on Franch, advice not to make peace untill we really pillage him. Need reinforsments, as current pillage brigade is a bit damaget.

Near capac, we do not have enogth units to take barbarian city yet. I hope when our Capital come online we will pump enogth Praet to raise Barb city and found our own. Some Longbows raise power level a lot two.

Franch send Galey with sword to our Gem city, watch for that.



save:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/84898/Mutineer_Passive-Agressive_II_AD-0575.CivWarlordsSave

 

[Mutineer]

darn screen shots by some reason do not show reasons. Chengis: We afraid of your Enemies.
Capac, we are doing fine on our own.

 

[Tatran]

Hatshepsut has Feudalism too and is still at war with Genghis.
That's not good. Maybe we should make peace with Louis or
Mongolia will be soon a vassal of Egypt.
Or we give Hatty something to make peace with Genghis.

 

[Mutineer]

Making peace with Franch will not stop Khan to be afraid of our powerfull enamies.

 

[Tatran]

Huayna and Genghis are both equal in power. So Genghis must be
afraid of Louis.

 

[Mutineer]

Powerfull enemies are not only civ we are in war. Every civ which comsidere as a worst enemy is considered. So, making pease with Lois would not:
Remove him from enemy or stop other more powerfull civs been our enemies. IN addition, we just need to grow our power higher then next civ Mahmed. His power higher then ours, not Louis.

In addition, Louis grow a lot of cottagess, pillaging them was a good source of money my turn and job is not finished yet.

Additional notes:

It is time to start building cotttagess.
I have 3 small cities on 0 grow, as they do not have food excess. We neeed to start build cottages around them and work them. Just keep in mine future chain irrigation when doing it.

Research wise, we need currency somehow. For some time we can research on pillage and oocasional selling some tech, but now is time to sort out self economic.

PS: try to avoide using slavery now, except in emergencies.

Most of our cities have very low food excess and we need to grow population. With HR we can keep them happy.

 

[Mutineer]

On additional note:
I do not think there is any danger of Chengis surrender to Hatty just yet. She is not 2 times his land/population. Only if she manage to take some of his cities she migth become.

On start of my turn Chengis was doing fine on his own, it is just on last turn his reason change. I kill couple of his archers.