Piffle Communication Thread

[1889]

I also asked for a chat. Hopefully Dutch or Theo can get some info out of themabout how they intend to win without upsetting Epsilon. Innovia could tip the scales in such a situation.

 

[1889]

THey say,

Btw that's my MSN IM address

On 8/18/07, Team Piffle <teampiffle@gmail.com> wrote:
Hello Innovians,

You can reach me at bawhomp@yahoo.com for discussions.
In the meantime, we're going to ask to renew our silks deal ingame.
Whomper

I'd like to talk to them before we renew the silk deal.

 

[1889]

To be sent to Piffle just as they recieve the save:

Dear Piffle,

I can see from your offer that like Innovia you expect generosity in your trading partners. It is an indication of how useful we could be to each other. However in Innovia friendship must come first. Your extra wine for our last silk and no open border has not yet been accepted. Perhaps we can clear some things up in our chat.

Until then,
1889 (also my MSM ID) and Team Innovia

 

[Theoden]

Chat with Piffle involving me, 1889, Lord Parkin, Killercane and Whomp.

Spoiler :

1889 says:
Parkin and Theo are about also. I sent invites.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
hi there...
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
got it this time
1889 says:
Wow I actually did it!
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
well done...
1889 says:
Uh...Whomp is busy right now.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
okay, no problem
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
offline, it appears...
Mikkel says:
Hi..
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
hi there
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
how's life?
Mikkel says:
that's a complicated question as usual I guess
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
heh
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
that's good, I hope...
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
things are generally fine in my neck of the woods
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
busy, but fine...
1889 says:
Complications are never good.
Mikkel says:
where is your neck of the woods actually?
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
I'd disagree there, 1889... some can be good.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
New Zealand
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Christchurch, specifically...
Mikkel says:
life would be boring without complications
Whomp says:
Gentlemen
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
indeed. complications involving females can be particularly interesting.
1889 says:
Life would be boring without excitment, not the same as complications.
Whomp says:
Had to attend to honey do's
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
good evening, whomp...
1889 says:
Hi Whomp.
Mikkel says:
hi whomp
Whomp says:
How is everyone?

John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
fairly fine...
Whomp says:
Lord P my sister moved to Wellington recently
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Ah, ok... that's cool. I'll be visiting Wellington the weekend after this one, actually.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
(University holidays for the next 2 weeks, starting tomorrow.)
Whomp says:
Very nice
Whomp says:
She really likes living there
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Yep, it's a nice place.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Where's home for you by the way?
Whomp says:
Chicago
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
ah, right
Whomp says:
She met her husband in New York
Whomp says:
he worked for NZ econ. development
Whomp says:
I did a haka for at their wedding reception
1889 says:
Small world huh? Just like the MTDG.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
cool..
Whomp says:
So true
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
yep...
Whomp says:
So to b'ness
1889 says:
(1889 displays his poor conversational skills.)
Whomp says:
Hehe
Whomp says:
Can I bring in Killercane?
1889 says:
Of course.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
go ahead...
Mikkel says:
sure

Whomp was added to this conversation. Handwriting is no longer supported because not all participants can view handwritten messages. Handwritten messages will be sent as text.

Whomp says:
Hi Case
Casey says:
whats going on
1889 says:
Hello Kane.
Whomp says:
I have the bright minds of Innovia here
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
heh
Casey says:
they of the sneaky camel archer
1889 says:
First off, Innovia was unable to accept Piffle's trade deal as offered.
Whomp says:

Whomp says:
ok
Whomp says:
So where do we stand
Whomp says:
the lines seem to be drawn
1889 says:
Not at all. I explained a bit in my email response.
1889 says:
We clearly have much that can benefit eachother and little to gain from propegating poor relations.
1889 says:
Do either of you disagree?
Whomp says:
We're a bit concerned how the discussion of walking through your lands went. If I recall our warrior blocked Magadan from a barb
1889 says:
Sorry Whomp I'm not sure what you mean.
Casey says:
nope. i suggested we work together some time ago with mikkel, and nothing came of that.
Casey says:
but we are all ears
1889 says:
Casey, I looked over that chat a few days ago.
1889 says:
Lots of sugestioins but few concrete plans.
1889 says:
The only real sugestion was that we abandon Aloha and trade exclusivly with Piffle.
Mikkel says:
as i remember it that chat seemed to open up possibilities, it was just that the time wasn't right for any concrete deals
1889 says:
It was rather one sided and never explained what benefit it would provide Innovia.
Casey says:
there was no follow up on your part. the benefits were techs to you IIRC.
1889 says:
At the time of that chat you still had a number of turns of a peace treatty with Epsilon, so options were limited.
Casey says:
but thats a long time ago anyways, we can always start fresh. hell i cant remember that far back . epsilon is the one we must both overcome
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
I find that surprising coming from piffle...
Mikkel says:
well, the team declined the kind of coorperation that you were suggesting back then, that's why nothing happened.... doens't mean that we don't have new options now
1889 says:
Yes, did you have some plan to distance yourselves from Epsilon?
Whomp says:
It's obvious they're the runaway here
1889 says:
We keep seeing the tech deals and are wondering why?
Whomp says:
As we see techs and military
Whomp says:
We've been backed into a corner with no other trading partners, no?

Mikkel says:
but don't you think trading with Epsilons fuels their lead?
Casey says:
who are we going to trade with, loco?
1889 says:
Why not end the war with Aloha? I havn't herd much action on that continent for a few centuries.
Casey says:
of course it fuels their lead, which is why we want/wanted to become trading partners with you guys.
Mikkel says:
well, the reason you're meeting reluctancy among others to trade with you is because you trade with epsilon...
Whomp says:
Aloha won't accept terms
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
and what are the terms?
Whomp says:
They asked for something ridiculous
Casey says:
BCLG says there will be no peace, they cannot win so they are just going to bog us down
Whomp says:
Case do you remember?
Casey says:
they want settlers or something to repopulate their little neck of the woods
Casey says:
i dont think we will be paying THEM
Whomp says:
right
Whomp says:
two settlers and gold or tech...
Mikkel says:
that's certainly understandable that you won't accept
Whomp says:
that's not happening
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
still, also understandable that Aloha would want a little compensation...
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
they've been rather taken to the woodshed after all...
Whomp says:
No doubt
1889 says:
War weariness not a proiblem for you at all? I understand not wanting to pay the loosers, but it can be worth the cost.
Mikkel says:
yes, but they aren't really in a position to demand much unless WW is bad for Piffle?
Whomp says:
They haven't hit us
1889 says:
Working out peace with Loco has ben quite beneficial.
Casey says:
what did you get out of that deal
Casey says:
and why did you nix the pyramids?
Mikkel says:
nothing, straight up peace IIRC
Whomp says:
that won't happen with aloha
Casey says:
well you guys could declare on aloha if deals permit, that would go a long way towards us working together
Whomp says:
especially with the military you're giving them
Whomp says:
it would shock the world in their backdoor
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Here's the thing. From my point of view, if you guys are actually serious about wanting to take down Epsilon and not just saying that for the sake of saying it or misinforming us, then we actually all need to work together. ALL of us - the whole four other nations. From my analysis of the demographics, that's the only way we'd stand a chance.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
So if you're serious, then peace with Aloha is the only option. Asking us to declare war on Aloha sounds plain stupid to me, from Innovia's perspective.
Mikkel says:
completely agree with lord parkin there
Whomp says:
As I said it seems lines have been drawn already
1889 says:
Loco and Aloha still produce science. They can get techs for us, even if it is rather slow.
Mikkel says:
besides, we are not exactly in a positoin to declare on aloha with a clean reputation at the moment
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
We're not the ones drawing most of the lines though...
Whomp says:
We won't give settlers to Aloha
Casey says:
because we wont make peace with people who have vowed war forever? Do you want to supply settlers and the gold for us to make peace with Aloha??
Mikkel says:
no, but we could try to convince them otherwise
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
That's not what I said... I'm sure alternative arrangements could be negotiated.
Whomp says:
That would be a start
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
The important thing is the peace, how it is achieved is secondary.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
But we could try to help out there.
Mikkel says:
I'm sure aloha would listen to reason for the greater good of annoying epsilon..
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
(If you were serious about starting to move against Epsilon.)
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Indeed.
1889 says:
brb
Mikkel says:
or... we can choose to watch while epsilon crushes Loco and becomes even stronger
Casey says:
Mikkel says:
I'm sure aloha would listen to reason for the greater good of annoying epsilon..
Casey says:
i posed that to them, and they dislike us more, according to them.
Casey says:
so you guys have some work to do to make peace
Casey says:
interesting international negotiations we have going here
Mikkel says:
i didn't expect them to hate you more, honestly
Mikkel says:
that means we have to convince them a LOT
Whomp says:
Well we've destroyed them economically and coastal
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
I'm not too surprised. But I suspect that they would probably be more inclined to listen to Innovia (who have been friends for many years) as opposed to the nation who is currently taking them to the park.
1889 says:
My wife thinks she's pregnant.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Perhaps, but they can always recover given time. And in any event, a war against Epsilon would be stronger with a little bit of extra help than without.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Wow, really?
1889 says:
Well, when a man and a woman are in love...
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Heh. Congratulations, then.
Whomp says:
Nice 1889!!
Casey says:
congrats if true!
Mikkel says:
good news for you indeed!
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
brb
1889 says:
The war with Aloha is a matter for Piffle and Aloha. We have made our sugestioins and will do what we can to help, but peace there is not the game breaker.
Whomp says:
Is it not for Innovia?
Whomp says:
If we align with Epsilon how do you contend with that?
Whomp says:
Two strong economies vs. 1
Whomp says:
and 1 likely to disappear soon
Mikkel says:
why would you do that... epsilon will surely win
Whomp says:
We realize our fate
1889 says:
If they are truly intransigent on the peace araingment we can leave them to their own devices with a clean consiuns[sic]
Mikkel says:
but surely in a loco-innovia-piffle vs epsilon war you would have a good chance of getting the spoils
Whomp says:
We'd need peace with Aloha for that to work
Whomp says:
we're not going to be left on a tech island by ourselves
1889 says:
I thought war with Aloha was not causing you any harm?
Whomp says:
It's not but why start two fronts?
Mikkel says:
because it neccesary? and besides aloha shouldn't be a danger to you any time soon
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
I guess we could try to do what we can to arrange peace with Aloha.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
If you would join against Epsilon, you would surely not be left on a 'tech island' as you say.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
I would think that mutual technology trading would be an obvious part of such an alliance.
Mikkel says:
off course we'll do what we can to help with the peace through our relations with them... just don't expect us to declare war on them
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Indeed, agreed.
Whomp says:
that's fair
Whomp says:
We'd need to know soon
1889 says:
Aside from that issue how are your current plans working? How are you going to get out of your tech alliance with Epsilon?
Whomp says:
That's why we'd need to know soon
1889 says:
Why are you about to renew some long term deal?
Whomp says:
We're in negotiations
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Yes, but that doesn't answer the question. Is there a way for you to realistically get out of whatever arrangements with Epsilon you might have (technological, military etc)?
Casey says:
we have some plans. we have been trying to determine how to beat them for 2000 years so we were bound to come up with some good options.
Casey says:
but it will be easier with an ally.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
or three.
1889 says:
So how long do we have? How long have you already stalled ? how much longer can you stall/
Mikkel says:
so if we could convince you that there would be two or three allies ready you could be able to stop trading with epsilon soon?
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
And moreover, cut off all ties with them?
Whomp says:
That would go over big with Piffle
1889 says:
Loco is already at war with Epsilon, no problem allying with them. and their economy is still in good shape Aloha is insignificant as an ally.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Perhaps, but still better to have them at least neutral than as an enemy... if we're going against Epsilon we don't need any extra problems.
Mikkel says:
yeah, worst case scenario is that they'll cut us off as well for coorperating with the "enemy"
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
I don't think they'd do that, unless they're hell-bent on suicide as a nation...
Mikkel says:
not an impossibility given their current politics...
Casey says:
But it has to be a realistic proposal. We would be giving up Aloha land, commerce, and production by forgoing war. If Loco holds out better than Aloha, we have a leg up on Epsilon. How would we be compensated for that in a peace arrangement?
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
You mean with Aloha?
1889 says:
What are you giving up by forgoing war with Aloha?
Mikkel says:
cities...
Mikkel says:
though im not sure more cities would make any positive return for you economically at the moment
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Why the need for compensation? The threat of Epsilon is growing, and if we don't do something about it soon then they may well run away with the game. By going to war in a world alliance, it is likely that Piffle will be the strongest nation once Epsilon has been taken down. Isn't that quite an incentive in itself?
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
No, Aloha can do better with the cities than Piffle can.
Mikkel says:
and again... we're not requiring you to make peace with Aloha, we're just asking you to join against epsilon
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
exactly
Casey says:
Well thats what we want as well, cooperation with you guys against them after we take over Aloha.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
But by taking over Aloha, you delay the attack on Epsilon, and weaken potential future allies in that same war.
1889 says:
I thought you stopped advancing against Aloha long ago though?
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Any delay is good news for Epsilon as they grow stronger, so it is bad news for all of us.
Whomp says:
Well you can talk to Aloha but I'm pretty pessimistic they'd take peace...I know BCLG, Robi D and Robboo too well
Mikkel says:
but surely continuing it as a phony war is possible?
1889 says:
Well work on it and in the mean time how about renewing the Open borders. Its nothing more than we did for you long ago.
Mikkel says:
it would a long way in convincing us of your good intentions
Whomp says:
We're concerned about the intel you're giving our enemy.
Casey says:
Realistically, I think (and me alone mind you) if Aloha ponies up 2-3 scientists and some gpt, say 50, we would be much more amenable to peace with them.
Mikkel says:
so are we...
Whomp says:
You'd need to sign an agreement that guarantees our OB is for your eyes only
1889 says:
They can't possably launch an invasion of Piffle LOL
Whomp says:
It would be tough without a ship to build
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Easily done... I don't believe we've passed any information from Open Borders on to any other nation anyway.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Casey says:
Realistically, I think (and me alone mind you) if Aloha ponies up 2-3 scientists and some gpt, say 50, we would be much more amenable to peace with them.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Realistically, I don't think that you could get ANYONE to agree to such a deal.
Whomp says:
It's a starting point
Whomp says:
always go big first

John - Lord Parkin - emp has left the conversation.

Casey says:
well you guys could help them out with that, and we could share the spoils
1889 says:
You said the war was dragging on because of Aloha's unreasonable demands. Shouldn't getting them to drop their demands be good enough?
Casey says:
so not that bad of a deal

John - Lord Parkin - emp has been added to the conversation.

John - Lord Parkin - emp is already in this conversation.

1889 says:
Wait, now you want our alliance to start of by us paying you to make peace with them?
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Hmph? Did I miss a few lines?
Whomp says:
Bear in mind if Loco is gone and Aloha is gone it puts you on that island
Whomp says:
Without a deal

Casey has left the conversation.

Whomp says:
I'd be concerned about Loco's existence
Whomp says:
It's a matter of time with Aloha and it will not be easy
1889 says:
brb

Casey has been added to the conversation.

Whomp says:
Holy cow the weather here is insane
Casey says:
there we go
Whomp says:
It's been thunderstorming for what seems like two weeks here
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
brb
Whomp says:
k
1889 says:
Yes, what a summer it thunderstormed here once. Thats pretty unusual.
Mikkel says:
here it's just extremely humid... quite annoying
Whomp says:
here too
Whomp says:
Emp is from NZ. Where do you guys live?
Mikkel says:
Denmark
1889 says:
Alaska
Whomp says:
I know Casey's place and he's probably going to get all my weather
Casey says:
its been thundering pretty much the last few hours, i thought a bomb had gone off
Casey says:
it was so loud
Whomp says:
someone in my building had a glass table on their deck and it sliced through the building next door's roof
Whomp says:
eek
1889 says:
Yes storms are something else, but nothings quite lick the storm of war (Lame segway)
Whomp says:
OK haha
1889 says:
Back to your last remark about Loco and Aloha's demise.
Casey says:
heh
1889 says:
You said that leaves us alone, So you feel that we need you more than you need us?
Whomp says:
My presumption is that will happen at some point
Whomp says:
Kind of
Casey says:
i have full confidence we can make a good run at beating epsilon by ourselves or at least make them limp across the finish line
1889 says:
Well its Epsilon and Aloha right now though right?
Casey says:
and not to be brash but yes I think you need us more than we need you. If Loco is eliminated (probable) and Aloha is eliminated (probable), then it is just the 3 of us. since we have worked with epsilon from the beginning, I think we can be in the position to keep that up vs. Innovia or join with you vs. them. I really think we are the wildcard. I know I would rather fight Dave McW with help.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
We are all wildcards.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Don't make the assumption that we need you. Innovia can get by without you. However, your chances of defeating Epsilon are vastly increased if you have our aid.
Mikkel says:
yes, but if Loco survives I think you would be more inclined to coorperate
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
that too
Whomp says:
i
Casey says:
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Don't make the assumption that we need you. Innovia can get by without you. However, your chances of defeating Epsilon are vastly increased if you have our aid.
Casey says:
i couldnt agree more
Whomp says:
i'd be concerned about Loco's chances
Mikkel says:
well, it depends on how soon we act...
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Yes. Loco can't hold up forever, but if Epsilon is distracted or deterred then I'd suspect that they'll be able to hold their ground.
Mikkel says:
if they lost their economic security (you) I don't think they'd continue ripping Loco to pieces
1889 says:
Personally I kind of doubt Loco will servive so maybe we can both agree to help them fight Epsilon for what ever damage it could do to our common foe. (the only thing we can agree on so far)
Mikkel says:
yes, no doubt that Loco makes a fine meat shield for the time being
Whomp says:
It's no shock Davemcw is taking turns
1889 says:
"meat shield" <- haha
Whomp says:

John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Loco will not survive indefinitely without aid, that's true. But I believe they can do a fairly good job of delaying things, especially with help.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Mmm... meat...
Mikkel says:
I thought it was a completely normal expression
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
sort of... perhaps a little uncommon/unusual though...
Whomp says:
I like and will use it
Casey says:
I think GeorgeOP was a meat shield for you in Civivor eh, Emperor?
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Partially. Partially he was just very, very lucky.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
He should have been gone about 20 turns before he was
Mikkel says:
Well, playing warhammer tabletop games like me, you use that expression often
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
1 wounded Archer generally doesn't have much chance of holding off 3 impis
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
<1%, but he got it
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
heh
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
not to worry though
Whomp says:
you guys are rocking in that game
Whomp says:
anyhow should we recap?
Casey says:
and i was even gonig to help him out, Darkness & Co. doesnt realize that YOU are the Epsilon in that game but they keep suiciding into me
Casey says:
sounds good
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
actually we're far from it, most of our score comes from pop/territory... in tech we're fairly average and in power we're only a little above
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
okay
Whomp says:
1. OB
1889 says:
2 work on Aloha
Whomp says:
Only with some guarantee
Whomp says:
Yes on 2.
Whomp says:
Then we can hammer out the Epsilon problem
1889 says:
3 mutual aid to Loco (a sugestion that needs much work still)
Whomp says:
Yep
1889 says:
Sounds good then.
1889 says:
Keep dry.
Whomp says:

Whomp says:
Thanks for the king crabs btw
Whomp says:
they're pretty cheap at the grocery store here
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Yeah, keep well.
Casey says:
its been great guys, i think we can hammer out some deals
1889 says:
You bastards, we can hardly get them up here.
Whomp says:
Haha
Whomp says:
That's just wrong
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
heh
Whomp says:
Like $8.99/lb
Whomp says:
ok let's try to circle back by monday?
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
I don't think I'll be around this time on monday (I'll be working next week), but will still see what I can do
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
I'm sure that others will be available anyway
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
nice having the chance to talk to all of you guys this time.
Whomp says:
Sounds good and PM or email too
Mikkel says:
I'm not usually available this late, but a few hours earlier it should be likely that im around
Whomp says:
No probs
1889 says:
Talk to you then-ish. Good-bye all.
Whomp says:
Bye all. Happy Civving
Mikkel says:
bye all and good night (or whatever is appropriate for your time zone)
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Bye. Have a good evening / morning / afternoon / night, depending on your time zone.

1889 has left the conversation.

Mikkel says:
emp - are you logging it?
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
I got booted for a while due to my internet connection
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
best if you do it, I'm missing most of the first half
Mikkel says:
okay, will do
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
cool

 

[1889]

Chat with Piffle:

Whomp, Killercane(Casey) vs. Theoden(Mikkel), Emperor(John) and 1889 as himself.

Spoiler :

Never give out your password or credit card number in an instant message conversation.

1889 says:
Hey Whomp, its 1889 of Innovia. Got time to discuss the game?
Whomp says:
Hi
Whomp says:
I just finished a little pitboss turn
Whomp says:
brb
1889 says:
sorry here I am.

Mikkel has been added to the conversation.

John - Lord Parkin - emp has been added to the conversation.

1889 says:
Parkin and Theo are about also. I sent invites.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
hi there...
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
got it this time
1889 says:
Wow I actually did it!
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
well done...
1889 says:
Uh...Whomp is busy right now.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
okay, no problem
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
offline, it appears...
Mikkel says:
Hi..
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
hi there
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
how's life?
Mikkel says:
that's a complicated question as usual I guess
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
heh
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
that's good, I hope...
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
things are generally fine in my neck of the woods
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
busy, but fine...
1889 says:
Complications are never good.
Mikkel says:
where is your neck of the woods actually?
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
I'd disagree there, 1889... some can be good.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
New Zealand
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Christchurch, specifically...
Mikkel says:
life would be boring without complications
Whomp says:
Gentlemen
1889 says:
Life would be boring without excitment, not the same as complications.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
indeed. complications involving females can be particularly interesting.
Whomp says:
Had to attend to honey do's
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
good evening, whomp...
1889 says:
Hi Whomp.
Mikkel says:
hi whomp
Whomp says:
How is everyone?

John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
fairly fine...
Whomp says:
Lord P my sister moved to Wellington recently
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Ah, ok... that's cool. I'll be visiting Wellington the weekend after this one, actually.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
(University holidays for the next 2 weeks, starting tomorrow.)
Whomp says:
Very nice
Whomp says:
She really likes living there
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Yep, it's a nice place.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Where's home for you by the way?
Whomp says:
Chicago
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
ah, right
Whomp says:
She met her husband in New York
Whomp says:
he worked for NZ econ. development
Whomp says:
I did a haka for at their wedding reception
1889 says:
Small world huh? Just like the MTDG.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
cool..
Whomp says:
So true
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
yep...
Whomp says:
So to b'ness
1889 says:
(1889 displays his poor conversational skills.)
Whomp says:
Hehe
Whomp says:
Can I bring in Killercane?
1889 says:
Of course.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
go ahead...

Casey has been added to the conversation.

Mikkel says:
sure
Whomp says:
Hi Case
Casey says:
whats going on
1889 says:
Hello Kane.
Whomp says:
I have the bright minds of Innovia here
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
heh
Casey says:
they of the sneaky camel archer
1889 says:
First off, Innovia was unable to accept Piffle's trade deal as offered.
Whomp says:

Whomp says:
ok
Whomp says:
So where do we stand
Whomp says:
the lines seem to be drawn
1889 says:
Not at all. I explained a bit in my email response.
1889 says:
We clearly have much that can benefit eachother and little to gain from propegating poor relations.
1889 says:
Do either of you disagree?
Whomp says:
We're a bit concerned how the discussion of walking through your lands went. If I recall our warrior blocked Magadan from a barb
1889 says:
Sorry Whomp I'm not sure what you mean.
Casey says:
nope. i suggested we work together some time ago with mikkel, and nothing came of that.
Casey says:
but we are all ears
1889 says:
Casey, I looked over that chat a few days ago.
1889 says:
Lots of sugestioins but few concrete plans.
1889 says:
The only real sugestion was that we abandon Aloha and trade exclusivly with Piffle.
Mikkel says:
as i remember it that chat seemed to open up possibilities, it was just that the time wasn't right for any concrete deals
1889 says:
It was rather one sided and never explained what benefit it would provide Innovia.
Casey says:
there was no follow up on your part. the benefits were techs to you IIRC.
1889 says:
At the time of that chat you still had a number of turns of a peace treatty with Epsilon, so options were limited.
Casey says:
but thats a long time ago anyways, we can always start fresh. hell i cant remember that far back . epsilon is the one we must both overcome
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
I find that surprising coming from piffle...
Mikkel says:
well, the team declined the kind of coorperation that you were suggesting back then, that's why nothing happened.... doens't mean that we don't have new options now
1889 says:
Yes, did you have some plan to distance yourselves from Epsilon?
Whomp says:
It's obvious they're the runaway here
1889 says:
We keep seeing the tech deals and are wondering why?
Whomp says:
As we see techs and military
Whomp says:
We've been backed into a corner with no other trading partners, no?

Mikkel says:
but don't you think trading with Epsilons fuels their lead?
Casey says:
who are we going to trade with, loco?
1889 says:
Why not end the war with Aloha? I havn't herd much action on that continent for a few centuries.
Casey says:
of course it fuels their lead, which is why we want/wanted to become trading partners with you guys.
Mikkel says:
well, the reason you're meeting reluctancy among others to trade with you is because you trade with epsilon...
Whomp says:
Aloha won't accept terms
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
and what are the terms?
Whomp says:
They asked for something ridiculous
Casey says:
BCLG says there will be no peace, they cannot win so they are just going to bog us down
Whomp says:
Case do you remember?
Casey says:
they want settlers or something to repopulate their little neck of the woods
Casey says:
i dont think we will be paying THEM
Whomp says:
right
Whomp says:
two settlers and gold or tech...
Mikkel says:
that's certainly understandable that you won't accept
Whomp says:
that's not happening
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
still, also understandable that Aloha would want a little compensation...
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
they've been rather taken to the woodshed after all...
Whomp says:
No doubt
1889 says:
War weariness not a proiblem for you at all? I understand not wanting to pay the loosers, but it can be worth the cost.
Mikkel says:
yes, but they aren't really in a position to demand much unless WW is bad for Piffle?
1889 says:
Working out peace with Loco has ben quite beneficial.
Whomp says:
They haven't hit us
Casey says:
what did you get out of that deal
Casey says:
and why did you nix the pyramids?
Mikkel says:
nothing, straight up peace IIRC
Whomp says:
that won't happen with aloha
Casey says:
well you guys could declare on aloha if deals permit, that would go a long way towards us working together
Whomp says:
especially with the military you're giving them
Whomp says:
it would shock the world in their backdoor
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Here's the thing. From my point of view, if you guys are actually serious about wanting to take down Epsilon and not just saying that for the sake of saying it or misinforming us, then we actually all need to work together. ALL of us - the whole four other nations. From my analysis of the demographics, that's the only way we'd stand a chance.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
So if you're serious, then peace with Aloha is the only option. Asking us to declare war on Aloha sounds plain stupid to me, from Innovia's perspective.
Mikkel says:
completely agree with lord parkin there
Whomp says:
As I said it seems lines have been drawn already
1889 says:
Loco and Aloha still produce science. They can get techs for us, even if it is rather slow.
Mikkel says:
besides, we are not exactly in a positoin to declare on aloha with a clean reputation at the moment
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
We're not the ones drawing most of the lines though...
Whomp says:
We won't give settlers to Aloha
Casey says:
because we wont make peace with people who have vowed war forever? Do you want to supply settlers and the gold for us to make peace with Aloha??
Mikkel says:
no, but we could try to convince them otherwise
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
That's not what I said... I'm sure alternative arrangements could be negotiated.
Whomp says:
That would be a start
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
The important thing is the peace, how it is achieved is secondary.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
But we could try to help out there.
Mikkel says:
I'm sure aloha would listen to reason for the greater good of annoying epsilon..
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
(If you were serious about starting to move against Epsilon.)
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Indeed.
1889 says:
brb
Mikkel says:
or... we can choose to watch while epsilon crushes Loco and becomes even stronger
Casey says:
Mikkel says:
I'm sure aloha would listen to reason for the greater good of annoying epsilon..
Casey says:
i posed that to them, and they dislike us more, according to them.
Casey says:
so you guys have some work to do to make peace
Casey says:
interesting international negotiations we have going here
Mikkel says:
i didn't expect them to hate you more, honestly
Mikkel says:
that means we have to convince them a LOT
Whomp says:
Well we've destroyed them economically and coastal
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
I'm not too surprised. But I suspect that they would probably be more inclined to listen to Innovia (who have been friends for many years) as opposed to the nation who is currently taking them to the park.
1889 says:
My wife thinks she's pregnant.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Perhaps, but they can always recover given time. And in any event, a war against Epsilon would be stronger with a little bit of extra help than without.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Wow, really?
1889 says:
Well, when a man and a woman are in love...
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Heh. Congratulations, then.
Whomp says:
Nice 1889!!
Casey says:
congrats if true!
Mikkel says:
good news for you indeed!
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
brb
1889 says:
The war with Aloha is a matter for Piffle and Aloha. We have made our sugestioins and will do what we can to help, but peace there is not the game breaker.
Whomp says:
Is it not for Innovia?
Whomp says:
If we align with Epsilon how do you contend with that?
Whomp says:
Two strong economies vs. 1
Whomp says:
and 1 likely to disappear soon
Mikkel says:
why would you do that... epsilon will surely win
Whomp says:
We realize our fate
1889 says:
If they are truly intransigent on the peace araingment we can leave them to their own devices with a clean consiuns[sic]
Mikkel says:
but surely in a loco-innovia-piffle vs epsilon war you would have a good chance of getting the spoils
Whomp says:
We'd need peace with Aloha for that to work
Whomp says:
we're not going to be left on a tech island by ourselves
1889 says:
I thought war with Aloha was not causing you any harm?
Whomp says:
It's not but why start two fronts?
Mikkel says:
because it neccesary? and besides aloha shouldn't be a danger to you any time soon
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
I guess we could try to do what we can to arrange peace with Aloha.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
If you would join against Epsilon, you would surely not be left on a 'tech island' as you say.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
I would think that mutual technology trading would be an obvious part of such an alliance.
Mikkel says:
off course we'll do what we can to help with the peace through our relations with them... just don't expect us to declare war on them
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Indeed, agreed.
Whomp says:
that's fair
Whomp says:
We'd need to know soon
1889 says:
Aside from that issue how are your current plans working? How are you going to get out of your tech alliance with Epsilon?
Whomp says:
That's why we'd need to know soon
1889 says:
Why are you about to renew some long term deal?
Whomp says:
We're in negotiations
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Yes, but that doesn't answer the question. Is there a way for you to realistically get out of whatever arrangements with Epsilon you might have (technological, military etc)?
Casey says:
we have some plans. we have been trying to determine how to beat them for 2000 years so we were bound to come up with some good options.
Casey says:
but it will be easier with an ally.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
or three.
1889 says:
So how long do we have? How long have you already stalled ? how much longer can you stall/
Mikkel says:
so if we could convince you that there would be two or three allies ready you could be able to stop trading with epsilon soon?
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
And moreover, cut off all ties with them?
Whomp says:
That would go over big with Piffle
1889 says:
Loco is already at war with Epsilon, no problem allying with them. and their economy is still in good shape Aloha is insignificant as an ally.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Perhaps, but still better to have them at least neutral than as an enemy... if we're going against Epsilon we don't need any extra problems.
Mikkel says:
yeah, worst case scenario is that they'll cut us off as well for coorperating with the "enemy"
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
I don't think they'd do that, unless they're hell-bent on suicide as a nation...
Mikkel says:
not an impossibility given their current politics...
Casey says:
But it has to be a realistic proposal. We would be giving up Aloha land, commerce, and production by forgoing war. If Loco holds out better than Aloha, we have a leg up on Epsilon. How would we be compensated for that in a peace arrangement?
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
You mean with Aloha?
1889 says:
What are you giving up by forgoing war with Aloha?
Mikkel says:
cities...
Mikkel says:
though im not sure more cities would make any positive return for you economically at the moment
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Why the need for compensation? The threat of Epsilon is growing, and if we don't do something about it soon then they may well run away with the game. By going to war in a world alliance, it is likely that Piffle will be the strongest nation once Epsilon has been taken down. Isn't that quite an incentive in itself?
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
No, Aloha can do better with the cities than Piffle can.
Mikkel says:
and again... we're not requiring you to make peace with Aloha, we're just asking you to join against epsilon
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
exactly
Casey says:
Well thats what we want as well, cooperation with you guys against them after we take over Aloha.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
But by taking over Aloha, you delay the attack on Epsilon, and weaken potential future allies in that same war.
1889 says:
I thought you stopped advancing against Aloha long ago though?
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Any delay is good news for Epsilon as they grow stronger, so it is bad news for all of us.
Whomp says:
Well you can talk to Aloha but I'm pretty pessimistic they'd take peace...I know BCLG, Robi D and Robboo too well
Mikkel says:
but surely continuing it as a phony war is possible?
1889 says:
Well work on it and in the mean time how about renewing the Open borders. Its nothing more than we did for you long ago.
Mikkel says:
it would a long way in convincing us of your good intentions
Whomp says:
We're concerned about the intel you're giving our enemy.
Casey says:
Realistically, I think (and me alone mind you) if Aloha ponies up 2-3 scientists and some gpt, say 50, we would be much more amenable to peace with them.
Mikkel says:
so are we...
Whomp says:
You'd need to sign an agreement that guarantees our OB is for your eyes only
1889 says:
They can't possably launch an invasion of Piffle LOL
Whomp says:
It would be tough without a ship to build
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Easily done... I don't believe we've passed any information from Open Borders on to any other nation anyway.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Casey says:
Realistically, I think (and me alone mind you) if Aloha ponies up 2-3 scientists and some gpt, say 50, we would be much more amenable to peace with them.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Realistically, I don't think that you could get ANYONE to agree to such a deal.
Whomp says:
It's a starting point
Whomp says:
always go big first

John - Lord Parkin - emp has left the conversation.

Casey says:
well you guys could help them out with that, and we could share the spoils
1889 says:
You said the war was dragging on because of Aloha's unreasonable demands. Shouldn't getting them to drop their demands be good enough?
Casey says:
so not that bad of a deal

John - Lord Parkin - emp has been added to the conversation.

1889 says:
Wait, now you want our alliance to start of by us paying you to make peace with them?
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Hmph? Did I miss a few lines? ^o)
Whomp says:
Bear in mind if Loco is gone and Aloha is gone it puts you on that island
Whomp says:
Without a deal

Casey has left the conversation.

Whomp says:
I'd be concerned about Loco's existence
Whomp says:
It's a matter of time with Aloha and it will not be easy
1889 says:
brb

Casey has been added to the conversation.

Whomp says:
Holy cow the weather here is insane
Casey says:
there we go
Whomp says:
It's been thunderstorming for what seems like two weeks here
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
brb
Whomp says:
k
1889 says:
Yes, what a summer it thunderstormed here once. Thats pretty unusual.
Mikkel says:
here it's just extremely humid... quite annoying
Whomp says:
here too
Whomp says:
Emp is from NZ. Where do you guys live?
Mikkel says:
Denmark
1889 says:
Alaska
Whomp says:
I know Casey's place and he's probably going to get all my weather
Casey says:
its been thundering pretty much the last few hours, i thought a bomb had gone off
Casey says:
it was so loud
Whomp says:
someone in my building had a glass table on their deck and it sliced through the building next door's roof
Whomp says:
eek
1889 says:
Yes storms are something else, but nothings quite lick the storm of war (Lame segway)
Whomp says:
OK haha
1889 says:
Back to your last remark about Loco and Aloha's demise.
Casey says:
heh
1889 says:
You said that leaves us alone, So you feel that we need you more than you need us?
Whomp says:
My presumption is that will happen at some point
Whomp says:
Kind of
Casey says:
i have full confidence we can make a good run at beating epsilon by ourselves or at least make them limp across the finish line
1889 says:
Well its Epsilon and Aloha right now though right?
Casey says:
and not to be brash but yes I think you need us more than we need you. If Loco is eliminated (probable) and Aloha is eliminated (probable), then it is just the 3 of us. since we have worked with epsilon from the beginning, I think we can be in the position to keep that up vs. Innovia or join with you vs. them. I really think we are the wildcard. I know I would rather fight Dave McW with help.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
We are all wildcards.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Don't make the assumption that we need you. Innovia can get by without you. However, your chances of defeating Epsilon are vastly increased if you have our aid.
Mikkel says:
yes, but if Loco survives I think you would be more inclined to coorperate
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
that too
Whomp says:
i
Casey says:
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Don't make the assumption that we need you. Innovia can get by without you. However, your chances of defeating Epsilon are vastly increased if you have our aid.
Casey says:
i couldnt agree more
Whomp says:
i'd be concerned about Loco's chances
Mikkel says:
well, it depends on how soon we act...
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Yes. Loco can't hold up forever, but if Epsilon is distracted or deterred then I'd suspect that they'll be able to hold their ground.
Mikkel says:
if they lost their economic security (you) I don't think they'd continue ripping Loco to pieces
1889 says:
Personally I kind of doubt Loco will servive so maybe we can both agree to help them fight Epsilon for what ever damage it could do to our common foe. (the only thing we can agree on so far)
Mikkel says:
yes, no doubt that Loco makes a fine meat shield for the time being
Whomp says:
It's no shock Davemcw is taking turns
1889 says:
"meat shield" <- haha
Whomp says:
hahaha
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Loco will not survive indefinitely without aid, that's true. But I believe they can do a fairly good job of delaying things, especially with help.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Mmm... meat...
Mikkel says:
I thought it was a completely normal expression
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
sort of... perhaps a little uncommon/unusual though...
Whomp says:
I like and will use it
Casey says:
I think GeorgeOP was a meat shield for you in Civivor eh, Emperor?
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Partially. Partially he was just very, very lucky.
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
He should have been gone about 20 turns before he was
Mikkel says:
Well, playing warhammer tabletop games like me, you use that expression often
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
1 wounded Archer generally doesn't have much chance of holding off 3 impis
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
<1%, but he got it
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
heh
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
not to worry though
Whomp says:
you guys are rocking in that game
Whomp says:
anyhow should we recap?
Casey says:
and i was even gonig to help him out, Darkness & Co. doesnt realize that YOU are the Epsilon in that game but they keep suiciding into me
Casey says:
sounds good
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
actually we're far from it, most of our score comes from pop/territory... in tech we're fairly average and in power we're only a little above
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
okay
Whomp says:
1. OB
1889 says:
2 work on Aloha
Whomp says:
Only with some guarantee
Whomp says:
Yes on 2.
Whomp says:
Then we can hammer out the Epsilon problem
1889 says:
3 mutual aid to Loco (a sugestion that needs much work still)
Whomp says:
Yep
1889 says:
Sounds good then.
1889 says:
Keep dry.
Whomp says:

Whomp says:
Thanks for the king crabs btw
Whomp says:
they're pretty cheap at the grocery store here
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
Yeah, keep well.
Casey says:
its been great guys, i think we can hammer out some deals
1889 says:
You bastards, we can hardly get them up here.
Whomp says:
Haha
Whomp says:
That's just wrong
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
heh
Whomp says:
Like $8.99/lb
Whomp says:
ok let's try to circle back by monday?
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
I don't think I'll be around this time on monday (I'll be working next week), but will still see what I can do
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
I'm sure that others will be available anyway
John - Lord Parkin - emp says:
nice having the chance to talk to all of you guys this time.
Whomp says:
Sounds good and PM or email too
Mikkel says:
I'm not usually available this late, but a few hours earlier it should be likely that im around
Whomp says:
No probs
1889 says:
Talk to you then-ish. Good-bye all.

 

[Theoden]

I think we got the chat covered now! Funny crosspost...

 

[1889]

Yes, watch out Dutch, my typing is improving.

I'll summarize and start some action on it later tonight maybe.

 

[dutchfire]

Nice work guys, kept me busy reading this during another hour of class

Congrats 1889

 

[1889]

Well they aren't going to be any help. Their plan is to stay alive and hope that Epsilon gets dragged into a costly war with us that will let them squeak out a space victory. They won't help us defeat Epsilon because then they are in a race to space with us being undistracted. Also if they did turn on Epsilon they would be the back stabbers and may get the brunt of Epsilons wrath.

The problem is that its just crazy enough to work since we are about to declare on Epsilon.

 

[Provolution]

You mean Piffle will win with a space victory, with us going down in a war?

 

[Provolution]

Next time edit the chat, we do not need the female carousing dialogue to prove you are fond of women, live in New York, Chicago and Cristchurch, we all live in a global village, and I am in contact with droves of nationalities each month, so please spare me the personal things hehe

 

[1889]

No way thats all valuable stuff to the trained eye.

Clearly our best shot is for Parkin to find Whomp's sister and see what she knows of Piffle's plans. Maybe she likes crab legs too, I actually know a guy...

 

[1889]

I was board so I sent some emails.

Greetings Team Piffle,

Well we finally heard from Aloha. We got them to drop all of their demands at least. They are willing to accept straight peace but I think you'll want something more than that. 2-3 GP and 50 GPT is imposable for them though. I think that's about all we can do for now until you two find a little common ground on the terms.

Let us know what you decide,
1889 of Team Innovia

 

[1889]

The time wasting continues. Anybody with any idea of how this came become something useful?

>I have posted your message in the team forum. Speaking for myself
> only and not for the team, I'm not exactly sure what you are
> proposing. What is it that we are supposed to decide? Peace with
> Aloha, I gather. Is that it, or is there more to your proposal?
>
> Sorry if I missed something somewhere. But maybe a recap would help?
>
> Thanks,
> Conroe

my reply

Yes, in a recent chat I was asked by Whomp and Killercane to try and mediate peace between Piffle and Aloha.

 

[Theoden]

Seems to me that they haven't really tried to get that straight up peace. Maybe they forgot how they "lied" to us and are now getting confused internally. Or am I being too suspicious?

I can't think of much to write besides restating that we got Aloha to acceot straight peace and that they agreed to that as well in the chat...

 

[Lord Parkin]

Did anything more come of this?

 

[1889]

No, the whole pointless story is posted here.

 

[dutchfire]

Maybe send them a new letter?

 

[1889]

If nobody else feels like it I'll do it when I get back. I think we first need a three way chat to see if Piffle and Aloha are ready to get along. Before we let them in on the tech alliance I think we need and end to the Piffle/Aloha war, I feel Piffle owes us their map and I'd expect open borders down the road also.

 

[1889]

Does anyone know a nice way to say "ya right!" It may be fun, but we could never eliminate Epsilon and I certainly don't trust Piffle enough to throw myself into something this ambitious. As the war progressed we'd just get more and more nervous about how the post war situation would settle up and which side of that mess Epsilon would choose to side with.

Innovia and Aloha,

We would like to discuss I.K.E.A. (International Konquering of Epsilon Agreement). Attached is a pic of the majority of Epsilon lands. We hope to attack from all 4 directions if that is amenable.

Tech
Piffle researches Fission and builds Manhatten until 1 turn left, and accrues gold to finish Manhatten on the turn they receive rocketry to rush nukes.
Innovia researches Rocketry. We trade Fission and Rocketry across (Fission probably beforehand).
Aloha helps each team with research or does combustion???

Attack
Points one and two will be Innovia invasion
Point 3 is Aloha.
Point 4 is Piffle (along with Sunset Fortress probably)
Nukes will be hitting all 4 locations the turn before and maybe inland to cut roads as well. Some dickering around with nukes shows that Camel Archers have no problem with the heavily injured infantry expected, so likewise Cossacks should have free reign.

Epsilon tech progress
They are currently finishing Electricity and then going for Industrialism. It doesnt look like they will be able to build tanks until plastics with the oil situation so they shouldnt get that far.

Dividing Epsilon land is up for discussion.

Let us know what you think, and we can make some changes to the plan. We probably need to make some tech timelines. Current thinking is this will go down in 25-30 turns or sooner.

Piffle