Player stats, sales, and reception speculation thread

[Gorbles]

The point is easy to understand, it's a simple feature that should have been implement with a simple fix, that's it. Arguing as you did about the fact that it's simple for real or not has no sense.

But the developers have said it isn't as simple as we might think. So you're decreeing that it is / should be, from a position of what, exactly?

If you can't understand that I knew Ed Beach didn't hire just a single intern to produce all the game I really can't help you about this man

If I can't take you literally, but also can't infer from your posts additional meaning, that's a you problem I'm afraid! I've kinda got to pick one. Everyone does.

If you don't want people to think that that isn't on some level your impression of Firaxis' development of the game, then you need to phrase it better

I don’t know, and frankly, I’m not trying to figure that out.

And yet, you made the intern crack. So on some level you've attempted to!

What I am saying is that, from an objective standpoint, many parts of the final product are messy and carelessly done — and that’s exactly where the “intern” metaphor came from. So again, what's the point of your message?

That any solutions mean that "why" is important. I mistakenly assumed you were trying to get at the why, instead of just describing the state of the product (which we're all pretty familiar with, so it seemed too basic a point to labour for as long as you did).

But fair is fair. If you just wanted to say "the product launched in a bad state", I get that. You took a very roundabout method to get at that rather simple observation, in my opinion.

 

[CliffCo]

Have you considered why a lot of people that don't like the game in your opinion are simple minded people who can't cope with change, rather than enlightened like yourself? Isn't that perhaps a tad convenient as an explanation?

You are in danger of being just as toxic as those you criticise you realise. What your displaying is bigotry, and it is as uninformed and presumptive as those you're so frustrated to keep hearing from.

I never said they were simple minded. Some of it is obvious from numerous posts i've seen on social media .

 

[CliffCo]

I didn't play long but it was enough time to know the game is not for me.

If a person doesn't like a game, it doesn't automatically make them a hater or mean that they didn't understand the game.

No, but if you have only played it for a few hrs, then you haven't learned the mechanics, you're just basing your opinion on a fraction of what the game has to offer. One example was a post on FB a while back where they were stating all the things they didn't like or that didn't work, butwhat he stated just wasn't factual as he hadn't played the game long enough and i oresume was basing many of his grievences on things he had read online rather than experienced for himself.

 

[bumpyglint]

But the developers have said it isn't as simple as we might think. So you're decreeing that it is / should be, from a position of what, exactly?

"I'm decreeing it" from having a the minimum required basic coding skills for it?

It's also pretty obvious that something like "move in a direction you haven't explored yet" is extremely simple to implement—it's not rocket science (if you had basic skills about this you'd know it). That’s exactly why this kind of mechanic has existed in previous games for years. The only new wrinkle is having to click sometimes a button to extend vision, which is, again, trivial to code.

The challenge the developers were discussing in the polls wasn’t about how hard it is to code it —because it’s very easy, assuming a halfway decent code base (this could be the only real problem, but this would only confirm AGAIN the fact that the base code created is horrible). The real question was about how it should be implemented—if I remember correctly, it was mostly about the timing or conditions for when that button should be clicked.

If I can't take you literally, but also can't infer from your posts additional meaning, that's a you problem I'm afraid! I've kinda got to pick one. Everyone does.

If you don't want people to think that that isn't on some level your impression of Firaxis' development of the game, then you need to phrase it better

I'm 100% sure no one except you thought that I thought an intern developed alone Civ VII (yeah discuss again about "how you would like my confidence" about basic stuff like this).

And yet, you made the intern crack. So on some level you've attempted to!

That was a joke that stressed how bad their code is; it's not a joke about what happened for real, it should be clear now

That any solutions mean that "why" is important. I mistakenly assumed you were trying to get at the why, instead of just describing the state of the product (which we're all pretty familiar with, so it seemed too basic a point to labour for as long as you did).

But fair is fair. If you just wanted to say "the product launched in a bad state", I get that. You took a very roundabout method to get at that rather simple observation, in my opinion.

You mistakenly assumed a lot; I didn't' talk about how "the product launched in a bad state", I was explaining in my opinion why the reviews are worse now after the patches compared to before—that was the actual topic before this detour.

 

[user746383]

Yes but have you considered that if you take everything you say exceptionally literally with no consideration for hyperbole, sarcasm, irony or nuance and then process it in tokens like an assembler would would then there are clear logical errors and you sound, frankly, ridiculous.

 

[Kev1916]

But the developers have said it isn't as simple as we might think. So you're decreeing that it is / should be, from a position of what, exactly?

Aye, you have a link?

Last note from Devs we’re they were awaiting (?) feedback re the best use for scouts ie finding discoveries or exploring the map

 

[kaspergm]

No, but if you have only played it for a few hrs, then you haven't learned the mechanics, you're just basing your opinion on a fraction of what the game has to offer. One example was a post on FB a while back where they were stating all the things they didn't like or that didn't work, butwhat he stated just wasn't factual as he hadn't played the game long enough and i oresume was basing many of his grievences on things he had read online rather than experienced for himself.

I'm sure a lot of the people who left positive reviews right after release have also gotten wiser with time and now dislike the game.

 

[Siddorm]

I once played a game called Need For Speed: Heat. I played it for about 4 hours, and I did not like it, so I stopped playing it. I don't know much about the game because I did not learn much about it because I did not like it.
This example is meant to illustrate this more general point: people that don't like a game typically don't know much about it; they simply know that they don't like it. This does not mean they are lying, or ignorant, or whatever.
I think it is more interesting to hear about a game from people that like it than from people that don't like it, because the people that don't like it, don't like it.

 

[Kev1916]

I'm sure a lot of the people who left positive reviews right after release have also gotten wiser with time and now dislike the game.

Lol , maybe thou there just not clever enough to understand the “new” mechanism

 

[CliffCo]

I'm sure a lot of the people who left positive reviews right after release have also gotten wiser with time and now dislike the game.

Possibly so, but i wouldn't go so far as to call them wiser. i'm sure some of them went back to Civ 6 or 5 because they don't like change, not because 7 is a bad game.

 

[sixty4half]

Lol , maybe thou there just not clever enough to understand the “new” mechanism

Thread 'Things missing' https://forums.civfanatics.com/threads/things-missing.698365/

Some of them aren't

 

[Gorbles]

That was a joke that stressed how bad their code is; it's not a joke about what happened for real, it should be clear now

Yes, I get that.

I'm 100% sure no one except you thought that I thought an intern developed alone Civ VII (yeah discuss again about "how you would like my confidence" about basic stuff like this).

I believe that some people would unironically believe it, but that's besides the point. The point is it gives a marker for how you actually feel about the state of the code, and that that's the comparison you went for vs. unrealistic publisher deadlines (which the games industry is more notorious for).

"I'm decreeing it" from having a the minimum required basic coding skills for it?

You're a C++ game engine developer? I'm impressed! I'm just a regular SaaS fullstack monkey. Well, above average (toot toot), but there are tons of folk in my space. Engine development is one of the most specialised programming disciplines that exist. It's almost at the "COBOL keeps banks online" level (but not quite).

It's also pretty obvious that something like "move in a direction you haven't explored yet" is extremely simple to implement—it's not rocket science (if you had basic skills about this you'd know it). That’s exactly why this kind of mechanic has existed in previous games for years. The only new wrinkle is having to click sometimes a button to extend vision, which is, again, trivial to code.

Again, you're saying things that you have no way of knowing for sure. Or heck, knowing at all.

The real question was about how it should be implemented—if I remember correctly, it was mostly about the timing or conditions for when that button should be clicked.

And your assumption is that this has zero impact on the code complexity? This isn't a leading question, I'm just making sure I'm guessing correctly here.

Yes but have you considered that if you take everything you say exceptionally literally with no consideration for hyperbole, sarcasm, irony or nuance and then process it in tokens like an assembler would would then there are clear logical errors and you sound, frankly, ridiculous.

Good thing I'm not doing that, then

Aye, you have a link?

Last note from Devs we’re they were awaiting (?) feedback re the best use for scouts ie finding discoveries or exploring the map

I don't have a link, but bumpyglint is familiar with the same developer conversation given that he's referenced the same comments.

Phone makes it harder, too. Would it help in a thread about player count and statistics if I provided it?

 

[Leucarum]

I'm sure a lot of the people who left positive reviews right after release have also gotten wiser with time and now dislike the game.

I left a positive review, and while I've not grown to dislike Civ7 - I still enjoy it - I'd definitely say I'm more critical now... I might hold back on a positive review. I'd be curious how many more folks are similar...

 

[sixty4half]

I left a positive review, and while I've not grown to dislike Civ7 - I still enjoy it - I'd definitely say I'm more critical now... I might hold back on a positive review. I'd be curious how many more folks are similar...

I don't like how long the game takes. I'm used to games ending around T200, not T350.
I don't like the Disaster Patch. I liked the way disasters were when the game shipped. I miss my 16+ yield rural tiles.

I still enjoy the game but there are things I don't like.

 

[Leucarum]

I don't like how long the game takes. I'm used to games ending around T200, not T350.
I don't like the Disaster Patch. I liked the way disasters were when the game shipped. I miss my 16+ yield rural tiles.

I still enjoy the game but there are things I don't like.

I do think the patches have improved things. Disasters were a micromanagement nightmare, and modern is mostly irrelavent rather than completely irrelevant...

 

[CliffCo]

I don't like how long the game takes. I'm used to games ending around T200, not T350.
I don't like the Disaster Patch. I liked the way disasters were when the game shipped. I miss my 16+ yield rural tiles.

I still enjoy the game but there are things I don't like.

You don't have to start in the antiquity era and you can adjust game speed if you're wanting shorter games.
Disasters were far too frequent even on the lightest setting, if you want more frequent disasters have you tried adjusting it in game options?

 

[sixty4half]

I actually try Exp and Mod Age Starts in about 25% of my games because of that! The problem is those modes aren't fully fleshed out, and the new growth curve causes issues too, as all your settlements start below the good spot on the curve.

I always played with Moderate Disasters. I agree the micromanagement was a problem but they fixed that with the Repair All option. Moderate Disasters are way less than they used to be. They even feel less that the 25% reduction that was advertised. Extreme Disasters might be to much though. I just really miss having a tile between 2 volcanoes or a Volcano next to a Nav River hit massive yields.

 

[Kev1916]

I don't have a link, but bumpyglint is familiar with the same developer conversation given that he's referenced the same comments.

Phone makes it harder, too. Would it help in a thread about player count and statistics if I provided it?

K , so they may not have made your statement after all
“But the developers have said it isn't as simple as we might think. ”
Or you not sure were or when if they said it .

Cool quick check on my phone shows a discussion re Scouts - they’re holding off until the community decides to push in an exploration mode or a discovery mode .
Will try get the link
It’s from YouTube also on cough Facebook
“Auto Explore is coming to Civ 7 and the developers are giving the players a say in how it will function through voting and providing feedback.”

No mention of it being difficult

 

[CliffCo]

I actually try Exp and Mod Age Starts in about 25% of my games because of that! The problem is those modes aren't fully fleshed out, and the new growth curve causes issues too, as all your settlements start below the good spot on the curve.

I always played with Moderate Disasters. I agree the micromanagement was a problem but they fixed that with the Repair All option. Moderate Disasters are way less than they used to be. They even feel less that the 25% reduction that was advertised. Extreme Disasters might be to much though. I just really miss having a tile between 2 volcanoes or a Volcano next to a Nav River hit massive yields.

In 6 i liked settling near volcanoes as we had a person that once promoted mitigated damage from them, but we still lost population.
would be nice if they add dams to Civ7 but i don't know how they would work now we have navigable rivers

 

[Askia Muhammad]

Sad that so many are jumping on the hate bandwagon, it deserves better reviews.

I’m sure some of the negative reviews are coming from people who haven’t played it or haven’t played it long enough to fully learn the new mechanics, others just wanted a remake of an earlier version and don’t like change.

You can’t really say “it deserves better reviews” I think this is the issue some have been having here on the forums. It’s pretty clear that those that are enjoying the game are in the minority, yet any mention of negativity and those who aren’t enjoying the game are told they are wrong, are sinking the ship that is the franchise, and the game is amazing and deserved better reviews.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion and review but one cannot dictate what the reception should be when data indicates it is trending the other direction