Player stats, sales, and reception speculation thread

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well we are 237 pages deep and I dont know if the argument has already been made or not but is success not defined by how much money civ7 made at this stage ( before 1st expansion ) in its lifetime. but it seems we are discussing success by active player count on just PC and steam . we have no idea how much money went into development and how much profit firaxis made by the higher pricing compared to previous titles of the franchise or even other games of the same genre. i remember as an example people passionately hating d3 at launch and yet d3 was hailed as the biggest commercial success of the franchise . fans and stockholders disagreeing is nothing new .

We had a discussion about this, yes

The thing is, Civilization needs a certain amount of constant players, because its model includes selling several DLCs through history. Initial sales are not enough to sustain it. Thats were active players are important

Now, we dont have a clear active players metric, but every metric we have (concurrent steam players, stream interest, reviews, etc) seem to indicate Civ 7 needs to do something to change the current feeling the game gives to its players

Patches dont seem to affect any of those metrics positively so far
 
It looks like Firaxis are in for the long haul though. I think the danger point will be the first big XPAC. That was when Beyond Earth got canned so there's a prior example and sales of small DLC probably won't dramatically change plans. If the big one flops though I'd expect that then we'll see a shift of some sort.

Personally, the big problem with 7's current DLC model is its value for money. I have no doubt that it costs more than equivalent DLC for previous Civ games to create, but I've rarely liked more than 1/3 of the content in any XPACs for Civ. Now with Civ switching in the mix, I don't even get to play that content through most of the game. Given that there is other content like wonders it would be churlish to say I'd only pay 1/3 of the cost, but I think the point where I'd buy Civ7 DLC is at 50% of current cost.

And even then, Paradox look set to knock it out the park with new releases over the next couple of months. Not just EU5, but Surviving Mars Relaunched... I want to try some of the Stellaris DLC once that has a chance to settle in. Firaxis are having a lull while their competition (for me at least) looks like they'll be on a roll. Civ 7 DLC is dropping down my priority list.
 
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I appreciate the developers with the attempt to simplify the game for newcomers (make it easier to understand that is!) but keep it mechanically interesting for longevity and for veteran players.

Unfortunately it had the opposite impact. Newcomers actually struggle more understanding Civ7, as do veterans, from the quantity of bonuses, unnecessary complexity of mechanics and poor UI (all debatable how you like).

And on the other side they actually made it less interesting, because they created a pigeon hole effect with the legacy and ages systems - because you have a number of certain objectives you have to play towards, with a number of certain ways to play towards them, with bonuses specifically tailored for them.

Let's compare it with the alternative. If you had open-ended bonuses and no specific objectives, then you could carve your own way to Victory every time and play an essentially different game every time.
You could play an economic game without being a colonist, or you could be a colonialist with an economic / religious focus like Spanish.
There is no treasure fleet to draw your focus, and the bonuses aren't so specific as to pigeonhole you.

This is also partly why I recommend that they start shifting bonuses away from the Civilizations and Leaders at startup and towards Government choices, Wonders, special effects, city states and other circumstances.

This way you can worry less about Civilization and Leader balance and more about general game balance. The player can worry less about their strategy at the start of the game and more about their strategy as it unfolds in real time.

Civilization is really a fun series but I feel developers should step back and take a look at the bigger picture, sorting the issues there, and then with good games come more players.

I used mods to remove Eurekas and Inspirations and the whole Dark/Normal/Golden Ages system because the railroading and stereotyping of your play just to hit the necessary goals felt so annoying and BOARD GAMEY.
 
Civ 7 seems to be up in Wishlist activity. #8. There is a lot of demand to still convert if updates continue in the right direction.
Personally, it's still on my wishlist even though I don't see myself ever buying it, I am just leaving it there in case it gets to $10 or something and I have nothing else to do.
 
I'll quit the off-topic after this comment, but I never thought of Cube as the perfect representation of "the purpose of a system is what it does" removed from intelligible or stated intent. Great movie though. A very poor recent imitation is "Escape Room" which unfortunately half-explains the intent. Missed opportunity.

Back to the topic at hand, yes, part of the discussion about Civ 7 is puzzling out design intent as part of a process of understanding why many of us just can't keep playing it, and what might be done to change that. There is a kind of dark zen like mental process where 7's design intent become unintelligible, and we're left to simply wonder if the purpose of the design is just some form of punishment in lieu of a better explanation.
 
the quantity of bonuses, unnecessary complexity of mechanics
It seems to have been designed so that this doesn't matter. Making the game a bit easier than previous entries. Now that people have solved the different METAs, they're nerfing that to prevent Deity snowballing I assume to keep the modern age at least somewhat relevant. Regression to a mean.
and poor UI
A self goal that doesn't seem to be related to any intended design other than the bizarre commitment to not providing information to players, and instead having them just intuit their strategic path and then having it not matter.

So, the visually poor UI, the clumsy features (like having to click into and out of menus a couple times when queuing building orders etc.), the just alignment and font errors - that's "poor UI".

The general lack of information seems to be design intent though. The infamous UI team rumor lent a substantive contribution in that the alleged point of disagreement between the UI team and management was that the UI designers were trying to include tooltips and things which management felt - according to the glassdoor post - conflicted with the full scope of experience they wanted cross-platform, i.e.: it would be clunky on consoles.

However, given recent patch notes, it really seems like no actually they don't want people to have too much information. The design intent. I'm not being cheeky or cynical in saying that it appears as if they don't want your choices to really matter that much, and as such, they don't want you to have the information you need to evaluate trade-offs. They want you instead to pick a path, feel as if that path matters by viewing some icons that indicate boosted yields, but don't look under the hood, and carry on. This seems to be their reconciliation to casual gamers.
And on the other side they actually made it less interesting, because they created a pigeon hole effect with the legacy and ages systems - because you have a number of certain objectives you have to play towards, with a number of certain ways to play towards them, with bonuses specifically tailored for them.
I think, given what I wrote above, that the design intent was for players to look at what sort of civ they're playing and generally pick just one legacy path, and pursue it until time runs out and see who wins. I think they believed this would bring different audience members together, created braindead strategic simplicity, but giving the illusion of strategic breadth.

It's just poorly designed, though. For instance, if the idea is you'd decide, "I'm going economy in the Exploration Age," then what you'd want is a legacy path that rewards simply having the most gold or something directly related to that. Treasure ships would be a major pathway to getting gold, but there wouldn't be a discrete "amount of treasure brought home to port" as a separate victory token. So, this design ends up being very confused in intent on top of its blandness.

The religion and archeology paths are also just plain poorly designed. They honestly feel like, to me, that the designers just crashed out and quit developing the game in the final year and a half and junior programmers scrambled to just make up something that seemed to work. I'm not making that accusation, it's just that's how those two particular paths feel. Like a college programming project.
Let's compare it with the alternative. If you had open-ended bonuses and no specific objectives, then you could carve your own way to Victory every time and play an essentially different game every time.
Let's keep going with my conversation on the treasure fleet victory. If the intent was to have maxing out gold be how you achieve an economic victory, then the function of treasure fleets ought to have been simply bombing your treasury with gold. However, an alternative function of treasure fleets could have been to accumulate influence, which is historically apropos. Or, frankly, treasure fleets could have a military function. Again, the Ming treasure fleets were military monsters - on purpose.

So what you have here is an incredibly simplified objective: get gold to win, a specific feature to help you get there - treasure fleets - and finally alternative paths that leverage additional bonuses offered by these fleets.

Ideally treasure fleets are very expensive, so you need a strong gold base to get them, but they snowball - which, given the age system, would be appropriate if the snowballing mechanism is limited to the Exploration age. Snowballing multiplicative treasure fleets towards a gold deluge that gets reset on age reset, as your final sprint to victory, doesn't that seem like the intent of Civ 7's core premise? So how'd we get what we got?

I know treasure fleets really means colonial plundering fleet. Here they suffer by hiding politically incorrect history behind other history, which is a common theme in Civ 7 and it's frankly disgusting that there are agitators who make history itself a taboo that has to be blended and whitewashed.
You could play an economic game without being a colonist, or you could be a colonialist with an economic / religious focus like Spanish.
There is no treasure fleet to draw your focus, and the bonuses aren't so specific as to pigeonhole you.
Many people say that antiquity is the best age, but what they often mean is "Whenever I start Exploration, I'm immediately deterred and stop playing." I was thinking about how getting your first ocean worthy ships in Civ games is one of the highlight moments and few parts of the game are more fun. You'd think this was the whole premise of the Exploration Age, and it would be perhaps the most fun age. They somehow ruined that. I can think of what's wrong, though.
  • Cookie cutter world maps so you're not really exploring you're just accessing islands and the farther off continent you know will be there.
  • The painful heavy seas damage that causes far more pain than the Shipbuilding remedy creates joy.
  • The fact that in many cases you arrive at distant lands and their fully settled.
Here I sense the problem comes from making it "fair" so that people can compete for distant lands treasure spawners at an equal pace. But again, even casuals are not having fun with this, so pandering to somehow bring the game closer to their level of comfort wasn't the ultimate result of this design.

I suppose I understand how an early ocean worthy tech could give a player a snowball advantage, but then, isn't that what settlement limits are for? I don't know the exact solution but the one we got basically ruins the experience.
This way you can worry less about Civilization and Leader balance and more about general game balance. The player can worry less about their strategy at the start of the game and more about their strategy as it unfolds in real time.
I think the irony is that it's already designed so that you don't really have to worry about civilization or leader. These are flavor choices, with minor strategic advantage for choosing well. They're not deep strategic choices.

Giving players strategic agency seems to be the opposite of design intent. They seem to want everyone locked into a mostly balanced competition lasting well into the final stretch of the game.

Think about that, assuming that's the design intent, and then think of not only all the civs and leaders, but the countless mementos. At some point, there are so many different little bonuses you can apply that if these bonuses actually mattered, it would sincerely break the game. So the design intent must therefore necessarily be to flood you with an illusion of choice while limiting the meaningfulness of choice. It has to be.

I think they felt the illusion of choice would bring everyone together, and in having a fun social experience, ignore the lack of strategic depth. Ironically, the lack of meaningful choice, or the effort to minimize meaningful choice, has made the game cumbersome and unfulfilling, even for casuals.
 
So, there is a lot wrong here that needs to be addressed. To start with there is no 50-50 gender split in Civ 7. Looking at the leaders available on release (ignoring personas), Civ VII has 7 women as leaders out of 21 leaders (that is nowhere close to 50%). Looking at Civ VI, there are 5 women as leaders out of 19 leaders. So, to sum it up comments like this have been raging for months on end about two women being added to the game. There were exactly the same amount of male leaders as in Civ VI. I am sick of pretending that comments like yours are not in bad faith, because they are. Saying that Sid's original games would never have a 50-50 split is complete fiction as well considering Civ 2.

Looking at your next point, the last time Genghis Khan was in the base game was in Civ IV. The last time Shaka was in the base game was in Civ 3. The Civ franchise has for decades focused on bringing a lot of new leaders into its roster for the base game and then has added old favorites in as dlc or added content down the line. Harriet Tubman is a great addition to the game (and has a really cool set of abilities that very few leader options could bring to the table) and she is also not the reason why Genghis Khan was pushed to DLC. Not sure why she is being brought up here at all.

I understand this topic can stir strong reactions, and I’m not trying to make it political. I just wanted to point out that Bug Repellent’s post didn’t seem particularly aggressive to me, while you accuse him of "bad faith". You're absolutely right that a perfect 50-50 gender split doesn't exist in the series, but I’m not sure why you chose to focus only on leaders available at release. That seems like a partial view, and it overlooks a broader pattern.

Here’s a quick breakdown of female leader representation across the last games:
  • Civ IV → 52 leaders, 6 women (≈11.5%)
  • Civ V → 42 leaders, 9 women (≈21.4%)
  • Civ VI → 67 leaders, 20 women (≈29.8%)
  • Civ VII → 25 leaders (no personas): 9 women (36%)
    → 30 leaders (with personas): 10 women (≈33%)
It’s true anyway that Civ II had a near 50-50 split, but it was because they specifically chose to have exactly one male leader and one female leader for (almost) every civ, so it's a really specific situation that didn't change the Civilizations in the game (also because I'm pretty sure leaders had no gameplay impact at that time in the series, so it was just cosmetic).

Of course, we can’t say for sure whether someone like Genghis Khan was delayed to DLC for this reason in Civ VII. But it’s reasonable to assume that prioritizing certain types of leaders might push others down the queue, even if they’d be more compelling from a gameplay perspective. For example, in Civ VI, Gorgo and Catherine de Medici felt a bit out of place in terms of historical relevance and game mechanics, but if this could have helped them to push selling copies I don't see why they would have changed it.

Personally, I don’t consider gender representation a decisive factor when buying a strategy game. However, I do think it’s naïve to assume that corporations don’t take current political climates into account when making design choices. If they believe that including more (or fewer) female leaders will help sell more copies—especially in markets like the U.S., which seems really sensitive to this argument —they’ll likely adjust accordingly. It's simple and pure marketing, I think you too can agree that these factors influence how games are made (I repeat, it works on both sides; for example I feel like in the near future this trend will probably be inverted because of the actual US political situation).
 
Maybe a stretch of it in that comment, but I was confronted with the idea of "the purpose of a system is what it does" about a year ago. I resisted the idea at first, but it seems to hold true. No matter what a system is meant for, its ultimate function is what it does, and in this case I think they're onto something economically.
And I tend to agree with aelf's skepticism, if only because "suppress entrepreneurial disruption" doesn't make sense specifically with the context of "stop playing games".

If the goal was to get people to pivot to mobile-friendly experiences with more transactions per customer (allowing maximum customer milkage since people who weren't customers before can be customers now for the lowest possible price), then I would agree with "the purpose of the system is what it actually does" applying here. I just don't think Civ is necessarily at that stage yet.

Civ 7 released to consoles, it didn't release to cell phones. Its model still relies on larger DLC packages - selling Civs piecemeal is still way too high a barrier of entry compared to selling direct buffs or crafting materials or gambling drops the way a game like Diablo IV does - a game which IMO is emblematic of how you can take non-mobile franchises and pivot them to a profit approach that resembles mobile game markets.

I think it's much more likely that Firaxis and 2K are simply attempting to maximize profit value in this sector without a reasonable approach for how to expand within it.
It simply doesn't seem to have a coherent thread running through it. It begins with an argument about creating monopolies ("suppress entrepreneurial disruption") at the cost of (short-term?) profits, which is a real thing. But what's damaging profits would be the reduction in prices or increase in product value (without a commensurate increase in price) to maintain market share, not purposefully losing customers and therefore losing market share, which would be self-defeating. What would be worse is driving customers towards competitors' products instead ("alternatives like Roblox") for some vague, nefarious agenda. That's Gamergate levels of nonsense.
 
Here’s a quick breakdown of female leader representation across the last games:
  • Civ IV → 52 leaders, 6 women (≈11.5%)
  • Civ V → 42 leaders, 9 women (≈21.4%)
  • Civ VI → 67 leaders, 20 women (≈29.8%)
  • Civ VII → 25 leaders (no personas): 9 women (36%)
    → 30 leaders (with personas): 10 women (≈33%)
Apologies for the detour, but those numbers remind me of some linguistics reading I always remember. When looking into the stereotypes that women talk too much, studies showed that women typically spoke a lot less than men in most environments and that in meetings, for example, if women had about 33% of the speaking time, it was enough for people to describe the women as speaking too much, or taking up more than half of the speaking time.

On a separate note, on the actual topic, I'm in the "not enough information, but it doesn't look good" camp when going through this thread. I hope Firaxis are in this for the long run, but I have this scenario in the back of my mind in which I see it play out like Diablo 3, where the expansion basically saved the game, only for execs to decide to pull the plug and start over, despite the renewed positive sentiment and desire for another expansion, ending the game when it was finally on track.

Of course, that game had astronomical sales to begin with, despite the relatively poor sentiment about the release, and one of the more controversial features (real money auction house) could simply be turned off. So, it's not a perfect analogy, but the differences in the analogy don't favor Civ 7. Still, I'd much rather see them have two full expansions, or whatever their planned slate of DLC is this time around, and not just continue to improve on the issues, but put out expansion level content and iteration on existing systems like religion.
 
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I understand this topic can stir strong reactions, and I’m not trying to make it political. I just wanted to point out that Bug Repellent’s post didn’t seem particularly aggressive to me, while you accuse him of "bad faith". You're absolutely right that a perfect 50-50 gender split doesn't exist in the series, but I’m not sure why you chose to focus only on leaders available at release. That seems like a partial view, and it overlooks a broader pattern.

Here’s a quick breakdown of female leader representation across the last games:
  • Civ IV → 52 leaders, 6 women (≈11.5%)
  • Civ V → 42 leaders, 9 women (≈21.4%)
  • Civ VI → 67 leaders, 20 women (≈29.8%)
  • Civ VII → 25 leaders (no personas): 9 women (36%)
    → 30 leaders (with personas): 10 women (≈33%)
It’s true anyway that Civ II had a near 50-50 split, but it was because they specifically chose to have exactly one male leader and one female leader for (almost) every civ, so it's a really specific situation that didn't change the Civilizations in the game (also because I'm pretty sure leaders had no gameplay impact at that time in the series, so it was just cosmetic).

Of course, we can’t say for sure whether someone like Genghis Khan was delayed to DLC for this reason in Civ VII. But it’s reasonable to assume that prioritizing certain types of leaders might push others down the queue, even if they’d be more compelling from a gameplay perspective. For example, in Civ VI, Gorgo and Catherine de Medici felt a bit out of place in terms of historical relevance and game mechanics, but if this could have helped them to push selling copies I don't see why they would have changed it.

Personally, I don’t consider gender representation a decisive factor when buying a strategy game. However, I do think it’s naïve to assume that corporations don’t take current political climates into account when making design choices. If they believe that including more (or fewer) female leaders will help sell more copies—especially in markets like the U.S., which seems really sensitive to this argument —they’ll likely adjust accordingly. It's simple and pure marketing, I think you too can agree that these factors influence how games are made (I repeat, it works on both sides; for example I feel like in the near future this trend will probably be inverted because of the actual US political situation).
I chose on release simply because it is a baseline with easy equivalencies without needing to factor in where in the DLC cycle we are at. CIV VI had a lot of DLC interspersed before its first expansion, while Civ V had similar add-ons before its first expansion. Minimizing variance seems important when trying to make fair comparisons. The broader pattern that I am seeing here is that women have historically been underrepresented and as has been seen over the past several months, the very notion of adding just two more women in than the last game leads to post after post of people losing their minds over it. Many times these posts create their arguments off of points that have no basis in reality and no basis in the history of the Civ games (despite all of these posts claiming to be from long-time fans who just want Civ to get back to "how it used to be").

I'm not going to really engage with the critiques on Gorgo and Catherine de Medici here since I am not a historian (just a fool who is interested in history), but I will say that it is always interesting how under the microscope women leaders are under compared to their male counterparts. Looking back at Civ VI it is interesting to me that certain choices such as Philip II have never been under such scrutiny despite him having been someone who took power at the peak of the Spanish Empire and who oversaw its decline. There are many reasons associated with this some entirely his fault (such as his micromanagement and zealotry) and some not at all his fault (extensive propaganda against him and some bad luck). You could carry out this exercise with most new leaders that get selected, but somehow it is always women that are under the microscope and not men.
 
I understand this topic can stir strong reactions, and I’m not trying to make it political. I just wanted to point out that Bug Repellent’s post didn’t seem particularly aggressive to me, while you accuse him of "bad faith". You're absolutely right that a perfect 50-50 gender split doesn't exist in the series, but I’m not sure why you chose to focus only on leaders available at release. That seems like a partial view, and it overlooks a broader pattern.

Here’s a quick breakdown of female leader representation across the last games:
  • Civ IV → 52 leaders, 6 women (≈11.5%)
  • Civ V → 42 leaders, 9 women (≈21.4%)
  • Civ VI → 67 leaders, 20 women (≈29.8%)
  • Civ VII → 25 leaders (no personas): 9 women (36%)
    → 30 leaders (with personas): 10 women (≈33%)
It’s true anyway that Civ II had a near 50-50 split, but it was because they specifically chose to have exactly one male leader and one female leader for (almost) every civ, so it's a really specific situation that didn't change the Civilizations in the game (also because I'm pretty sure leaders had no gameplay impact at that time in the series, so it was just cosmetic).

Of course, we can’t say for sure whether someone like Genghis Khan was delayed to DLC for this reason in Civ VII. But it’s reasonable to assume that prioritizing certain types of leaders might push others down the queue, even if they’d be more compelling from a gameplay perspective. For example, in Civ VI, Gorgo and Catherine de Medici felt a bit out of place in terms of historical relevance and game mechanics, but if this could have helped them to push selling copies I don't see why they would have changed it.

Personally, I don’t consider gender representation a decisive factor when buying a strategy game. However, I do think it’s naïve to assume that corporations don’t take current political climates into account when making design choices. If they believe that including more (or fewer) female leaders will help sell more copies—especially in markets like the U.S., which seems really sensitive to this argument —they’ll likely adjust accordingly. It's simple and pure marketing, I think you too can agree that these factors influence how games are made (I repeat, it works on both sides; for example I feel like in the near future this trend will probably be inverted because of the actual US political situation).
This seems like much ado about nothing. So what if now a whopping 36% of civ leaders are female? Are we to take the claim that that's too many female leaders as valid criticism? Or that somehow it becomes too many if specific male leaders are not in the base game (which has been the case in past few iterations of the game)?
 
For the few people that believe that concurrent player numbers may hold any meaning: the patch, DLC release, and sale in combination seems to have brought this metric back to the levels of June to August. Potentially, it could even peak at levels this weekend that we haven't seen since May. Curious whether it will just be a one time thing or if it will be similar next weekend.
 
We have seen sales increase when there has been a sale, and we have seen player counts increase after a patch, but we have not yet seen the Steam review percentage scores increase. I am thinking that we will not see sustained increases in sales or player counts unless the review scores increase.
 
it appears as if they don't want your choices to really matter that much
And, man (if we ever conclude that is the case), is that ever antithetical to the franchise's previous "interesting choices" slogan/design philosophy.
 
Civ 7 seems to be up in Wishlist activity. #8. There is a lot of demand to still convert if updates continue in the right direction.
Yes, Civ 7 has been on the front page of the Steam store page during the Autumn sale pretty consistently this week (at least for me). With good name recognition and lots of players who've played prior versions of the game, I'm guessing quite a few people are adding it to their wishlist and, presumably, quite a few are just adding it to their cart and buying it.

Reviews from Oct 1st to right now have been 88 positive, 133 negative, equals 39.8% positive (numbers per SteamDB). I'll try and update later this week, to give more players who bought during the sale time to weigh in (and more particularly, more new buyers who spend more hours on the game time to weigh in).
 
For the few people that believe that concurrent player numbers may hold any meaning: the patch, DLC release, and sale in combination seems to have brought this metric back to the levels of June to August. Potentially, it could even peak at levels this weekend that we haven't seen since May. Curious whether it will just be a one time thing or if it will be similar next weekend.

11.7k concurrent players on what they call a huge patch doesnt seem to be that much, i consider this a failure, since they dont seem to be able to escape these low numbers

I think this is pretty much a confirmation that whatever they do, if they dont release a Classic Mode, this is the audience they will have
 
11.7k concurrent players on what they call a huge patch doesnt seem to be that much, i consider this a failure, since they dont seem to be able to escape these low numbers

I think this is pretty much a confirmation that whatever they do, if they dont release a Classic Mode, this is the audience they will have
I find it interesting the argument about player numbers seems to keep changing. Here we have the move from the fact that a decline is bad news, to an increase still being bad news.

Hypothetical question: what if they did a Classic mode as per your own exact specifications, and the player numbers didn't rise significantly. What then?
 
This seems to be:

Good news in terms of player counts.
Good news in terms of positive social media reception.
Bad news in terms of reviews worsening.

I don't think it's good enough to right the ship, but I think that would have been a tall order from a patch of this size and scope. I'd hope for a jump and then a stabilization at a slightly higher level than before.

Personally I'm very happy with how the patch changed the town and city meta but unsurprised that the reviews seem bad. The changes are subtle, and quite likely to frustrate newcomers even if they are positive. And after antiquity the game does still take a big downturn. It still isn't enough to fix the game for me, and I uninstalled from my PC after a couple of runs. Civ 7 is still for me a steam deck "play antiquity while travelling" game...
 
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I find it interesting the argument about player numbers seems to keep changing. Here we have the move from the fact that a decline is bad news, to an increase still being bad news.

Hypothetical question: what if they did a Classic mode as per your own exact specifications, and the player numbers didn't rise significantly. What then?

I think the point was that it didn’t improve enough to change the overall trend

A Classic Mode is a bit of a Hail Mary, you have to get the word out to all the people who passed on 7 because of Civ Switching/Era Resets
 
This seems to be:

Good news in terms of player counts.
Good news in terms of positive social media reception.
Bad news in terms of reviews worsening.

I don't think it's good enough to right the ship, but I think that would have been a tall order from a patch of this size and scope. I'd hope for a jump and then a stabilization at a slightly higher level than before.

Personally I'm very happy with how the patch changed the town and city meta but unsurprised that the reviews seem bad. The changes are subtle, and quite likely to frustrate newcomers even if they are positive. And after antiquity the game does still take a big downturn. It still isn't enough to fix the game for me, and I uninstalled from my PC after a couple of runs. Civ 7 is still for me a steam deck "play antiquity while travelling" game...
I genuinely think people enjoy the antiquity age because it plays the most similar to “classic” civ. Everyone’s built their empire only to see it altered arbitrarily in the exploration age and people quit.

For me, even the antiquity age takes a lot of adjusting to get used to. I miss the more purposeful city planning six had. Aside from that (and this may just be a me issue) deciding to essentially change even building names threw me off.
 
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