Polynesia

[crdvis16]

I'm currently playing a Polynesia game and two things jump out at me:

1) Melee ships being able to improve sea resources is really awkward. Triremes take a while to get to and by the time you get one out you've probably already improved the majority of your area resources. It puts you into this weird mode of wanting to delay making fishing boats in order to use the UA but you just end up weakening yourself by delaying.

2) God of the Sea is tough to found with. I settled cities pretty rapidly and prioritized getting my fishing boats out and ended up with something like 12 fish/atolls supplying faith and just barely founded around t104. I would have thought 12 faith-giving tiles would have been ideal to found with god of the sea. Maybe God of the Sea could be tweaked to give a little more faith and a little less food?

 

[Stalker0]

I'm currently playing a Polynesia game and two things jump out at me:

1) Melee ships being able to improve sea resources is really awkward. Triremes take a while to get to and by the time you get one out you've probably already improved the majority of your area resources. It puts you into this weird mode of wanting to delay making fishing boats in order to use the UA but you just end up weakening yourself by delaying.

2) God of the Sea is tough to found with. I settled cities pretty rapidly and prioritized getting my fishing boats out and ended up with something like 12 fish/atolls supplying faith and just barely founded around t104. I would have thought 12 faith-giving tiles would have been ideal to found with god of the sea. Maybe God of the Sea could be tweaked to give a little more faith and a little less food?

It’s not trireme improving your first cities, it’s caravels Improving your new world cities, and destroyers repairing all of pillaging your cities took in the last war. Honestly this ability is the weakest aspect of Polynesia’s kit they have plenty of good stuff, and this ability still comes in handy

 

[crdvis16]

It’s not trireme improving your first cities, it’s caravels Improving your new world cities, and destroyers repairing all of pillaging your cities took in the last war. Honestly this ability is the weakest aspect of Polynesia’s kit they have plenty of good stuff, and this ability still comes in handy

Yeah, maybe it's just a bit of a noob trap as it currently stands. I agree that the rest of their kit is plenty strong though, especially the UI.

I get that it can be helpful later in the game for melee ships to be able to improve/repair sea resources but the production or gold cost of fishing boats at that point in the game becomes fairly negligible so it feels pretty weak. Like, if that part of the UA was simply removed it wouldn't be very noticeable.

If it were up to me I'd probably change Polynesia so that embarked units could improve sea resources instead of melee ships (like the old Japanese bonus) so that it is essentially available from the start and becomes an important part if the UA. If needed, Moai could be nerfed slightly to compensate (maybe remove the +1 production).

I'd also change God of the Sea to be "+1 faith, +2 food in coastal cities" instead of "+3 food in coastal cities".

 

[ElliotS]

Yeah, maybe it's just a bit of a noob trap as it currently stands.

I think we're overusing the term noob trap. Any suboptimal decision isn't a noob trap. Deciding to wait an era to improve your resources isn't a noob trap, it's just sub-optimal play.

I get that it can be helpful later in the game for melee ships to be able to improve/repair sea resources but the production or gold cost of fishing boats at that point in the game becomes fairly negligible so it feels pretty weak. Like, if that part of the UA was simply removed it wouldn't be very noticeable.

If it were up to me I'd probably change Polynesia so that embarked units could improve sea resources instead of melee ships (like the old Japanese bonus) so that it is essentially available from the start and becomes an important part if the UA. If needed, Moai could be nerfed slightly to compensate (maybe remove the +1 production).

It's not meant to be a major part of their UA. It was added because it was more thematic and better here than Japan and the code already existed.

There's really no reason to re balance a whole civ because of wanting part of a UA to be more important. It's a cherry on top, enjoy it for what it is.

 

[pineappledan]

I think we're overusing the term noob trap. Any suboptimal decision isn't a noob trap. Deciding to wait an era to improve your resources isn't a noob trap, it's just sub-optimal play.

It's not meant to be a major part of their UA. It was added because it was more thematic and better here than Japan and the code already existed.

There's really no reason to re balance a whole civ because of wanting part of a UA to be more important. It's a cherry on top, enjoy it for what it is.

^This

 

[crdvis16]

Yeah, perhaps it's a bit nit-picky. Probably bigger fish to fry.

 

[Omen of Peace]

Are Polynesia ships supposed to be able to cross ocean from the start?
I thought it was only embarked units, but I see Polynesian Dromons in ocean, and re-reading the UA I find it ambiguous.

 

[Coffee Monopoly]

Yeah, it's definitely intended for ships as well as embarked dudes.

 

[JamesNinelives]

Yeah, it's definitely intended for ships as well as embarked dudes.

I am now imaging all of my embarked units as guys chilling on inflatable tubes with baseball caps pulled down over their faces (i.e looking cool).

I am very amused ^^.

 

[wtb_skillv2]

Hi, first time posting but been playing this mod for quite some time now. Amazing work. Concerning Polynesia, I'd give moai the ability to connect the resources under it so there would be no gaps around the coastline. Not sure if this has been discussed before but just for the easthetic reasons this is what was always bugging me while playing this civ.

 

[andersw]

Hi, first time posting but been playing this mod for quite some time now. Amazing work. Concerning Polynesia, I'd give moai the ability to connect the resources under it so there would be no gaps around the coastline. Not sure if this has been discussed before but just for the easthetic reasons this is what was always bugging me while playing this civ.

Most ofthe special improvements either dont go on resources or in some cases remove the resources.
It makes those weaker but probably? more balanced.
Polynesia suffer on pangea, or even worse great plains (no seas).

 

[JamesNinelives]

Most ofthe special improvements either dont go on resources or in some cases remove the resources.
It makes those weaker but probably? more balanced.
Polynesia suffer on pangea, or even worse great plains (no seas).

I don't know any unique improvements that remove resources? Which are those?

It is true that the UIs that can be built earlier and more often (e.g. Encampment, Moai, Eki) tend not to give access to resources under them. Whereas those that are rarer/unlock later do (e.g. Kasbahs, also Chateaus?). Which makes sense in terms of balance.

 

[azum4roll]

Only Kasbah can be built on resources (and connect them).

 

[andersw]

I don't know any unique improvements that remove resources? Which are those?

It is true that the UIs that can be built earlier and more often (e.g. Encampment, Moai, Eki) tend not to give access to resources under them. Whereas those that are rarer/unlock later do (e.g. Kasbahs, also Chateaus?). Which makes sense in terms of balance.

I could be wrong but I think Eki removes/prevents spawn of resources.

 

[Legen]

I could be wrong but I think Eki removes/prevents spawn of resources.

And I'd not be surprised if Brazilwood Camps happened to do the same. Especially since it comes with its own luxury on the tile.

 

[JamesNinelives]

Only Kasbah can be built on resources (and connect them).

Thanks, I didn't realise that.

I could be wrong but I think Eki removes/prevents spawn of resources.

Honestly, that seems a real disincentive. You can build a lot of Ekis, which means a lot of potential resource loss.

 

[andersw]

Thanks, I didn't realise that.


Honestly, that seems a real disincentive. You can build a lot of Ekis, which means a lot of potential resource loss.

Yes but the Eki improvement is quite strong with adjacancy bonus and a resource on top of that would (I guess) be a bit much.

 

[JamesNinelives]

I just checked and the Eki doesn't remove resources, it removes features which is fine . That just means forest or jungle! Resources still appear as normal, the Eki just doesn't connect them.

 

[Melchizedek]

What do people do for monopolies with Polynesia? It seems rare that my resources don't spawn just where Moai's are suitable. Also, aren't religion and defense (yes, +20% is nice, but you have to organize several independent forces) a bit awkward when your cities are scattered about so much? I like Polynesia, and they have some near capabilities, but I also wonder if they are a bit weak right now compared to other civs.

 

[CrazyG]

What do people do for monopolies with Polynesia? It seems rare that my resources don't spawn just where Moai's are suitable.

You can settle cities directly on the resource, and usually I only connect enough to get a monpoly, the rest are Moai.

Moai are very, very good and can carry you. You don't need to spread your cities out too much, at the start of the game play like a normal civ and get a religion, then spread out more and use the ocean embarking in classical/medieval to meet all the city states.