PTW succession game

[jb1964]

Pre flight in 1290 AD
Not sure what troops are headed to what transport quite yet.

IBT – Agree to RoP w/ the Zulu
Turn 1, 1295 AD
Baghdad, factory
Load units onto caravel and send then to former Persian lands.
7 Cav units begin a trek over Zulu land to join in the fray.
Every other civ is in a democracy. I’m interested how the dynamics of this dog-pile will turn out once the people start getting bent.

IBT – Renew RoP w/ Vikes. Celts MPP w/ Spain
Turn 2, 1300 AD
Building factories and infrastructure.

IBT – Uh oh, the Otters have just completed Suffrage. If this cascades us out of ToE I’ll freak. Plenty civs cascade to ToE but no finishers. Babs will cascade after our turn so lets hope they haven’t accumulated 600 sheilds.

Turn 3, 1305 AD
Well, the Zulu are blocking our entry into this war by not letting us sidestep Tugela. I'm willing to bet the Babs will be opening that door for us shortly. Shaka realy has some sad, little units.
RR tracks going down all over.
Isabella is socking away some coin (~850g).
Well, here comes the moment of truth for ToE

IBT – Celts sink a Bab inronclad. Redlined Otter Sipahi are returning from Bab territory and more are charging forth. Otters are taking Bab cities. Zulu ancient age units are getting slaughtered in front of our waiting cavalry.
We loose our furs from France. Peeps are happy so we won’t be renewing w/Joan.
ToE is ours! [dance] We get Atomic Theory and Electronics.

Turn 4, 1310 AD
Mecca gets to building Hoovers and we burn the leader to rush it. I guess if we’re going to have Hydro plants waiting in the wings we should get to building factories.
Can’t bring galleys up to jump the cavalry into Bab territory due to Bab ironclads.
MM Mecca to avoid starving our heroic citizens.

IBT – Celts have 5 ironclads coming into the area to land a galleon. England declares war on the Spanish so expect the Celts to declare on England. Ottomans declare on the English! Lizzy's in for a world of hurt. Yep, Celts jump on next.
Hoover’s is ours. We loose incense.
Time for a break. Will finish up tomorrow.

Turn 5, 1315 AD
Ottoman’s and Spanish have Atomic Theory.
Ozzy will give us 8969g for Electronics which would go a long way towards funding our research and rushing builds. Isabella was willing to pay in incense which we can purchase for a far lower sum and we don’t need it at this time. I’ll see what they’ll pay next turn.
Cavalry kill a Bab infantry in a fort w/ 4 retreats and no losses.

IBT – Lost our supply of silks from England.

Turn 6, 1320 AD
Osman is researching Electronics. He’s only willing to pay us 7884g (394gpt + 4g) which we’ll take to fund Combustion.
Atomic Theory to England for 217gpt + 16g.
Research at 90% w/ Combustion coming in 6 turns at +444gpt into treasury.
Cav kill another Bab infantry in the open. Vet cavalry takes out elite infantry in the face of low odds. Six cavalry run into the hills above Zariqum to attack next turn. Going to need to bring in infantry to hold.
Zulu city of Tugela is protected by a musket.

IBT – England wants an MPP. We trade Lizzy our TM for WM and 8g.

Turn 7, 1325 AD
Was about to attack Zariqum and felt I was about to get our cavalry killed so they’re now headed into Beb territory to start some pillaging.

IBT – Two of our marauding Cavs are attack in Bab territory and we have one retreat and on victory.

Turn 8, 1330 AD
Laying down RR’s and modifying some irrigated tiles to bump production in size 12 cities.
Wounded cavs retreat, the rest push towards disconnecting resources.
Research down to 80% w/ Combustion in 3.
Spain is up Combustion and Espionage. Not trading Electronics to Spain was a mistake.
Vikings will give Combustion (2250g), Espionage and Incense for AT. Instead we trade Spain ivory, gems, 98gpt, 11g and WM for Combustion and Espionage.
Ozzy is sitting on 1500g

IBT – Our cav units in the mountains of Babylonia get slaughtered. I wasn’t watching the IBT so I’m not sure what happened. I guess attacking the city would have been a better option.

Turn 9, 1335 AD
Babs have a destroyer in the water. Great.
Mass Production in 5 turns.
Celts can trade luxuries for AT but the cash would be handier. Beside, our peeps are plenty happy right now.
Ozzy is socking away 432gpt and now has 1932g banked. This is the guy that’s paying us 394gpt. Yikes.
If another lux is needed France has 6 furs and is very far behind in technology.
The Celts have relieved the English of the management of Brighton, Warwick and Newcastle (Good beer!). We might want to be leery of any more long term agreements w/ Lizzy.

IBT – The Zulu have joined w/ the Otters to kill England. I doubt the Zulu will ever land on English territory.

Turn 10, 1340 AD
Moving workers across the channel to throw down RR’s.
Consider all current build orders as placeholders.

 

[rrau]

got it

 

[jb1964]

rrau, a critique of how I left things would be appreciated. Actually, that's an open invitation for everyone.

I'm unhappy with how I participated in the Bab war. In a case like this do we even send troops or do we send in what we can looking to score a GL?

Also, your thoughts on the trades I made given we're going for a spaceship victory.

 

[DJMGator13]

We're not really geared for war, especially when they are defending with Infantry. Until tanks infantry are almost unbeatable, unless you have a stack of artillery to soften them up first.

Personally I would probably sit back and watch the show. Maybe make a few destroyers of our own to patrol the waters. Eventually BAB will make peace with everyone, starting with the ones on the other continent who are not actively fighting the war. As long as we keep units out of BAB territory and we are not losing units we should have no problem with WW. They declared on us that gives us War Happiness.

I'd keep pluging away at the techs. If the dogpile is still active when we learn Fission, then we could win Diplo alot sooner than space. We want to make sure we don't waste time researching any dead-end techs. Trading for them is OK, but don't research them.

 

[RowAndLive]

@jb, I'm not sure about that trade with Spain in turn 9, giving away $ instead of getting an extra incense to possible trade away. Otherwise the trading looked good. Also, I can't comment on the loss of the cavs, since I missed the recent situation by my skip. I'd agree with gator though, on sitting back. We've met our requirement and killed a few units (it their terr no less), so we're not pay the price for shirking. I'm amused that the dogpile spilled over onto England. Since she is the weakest on the continent, and the Babs are so big, it's not a suprise. I expect that the Ottos will the the only ones to do real damage to Babylon. That means that next time the Ottos will be even bigger, and a bigger pain for us. We need to get research up, and then start building mucho infantry.

I'd be happy to take the diplo win instead of space, since we can't make the date, but will go with the team.

@gator & jb - both nice jobs!

@rrau - awesome avatar!

 

[jb1964]

I would have never tought about picking up an extra lux to turn around and sell. Interesting. A good idea if you have a market for it.

Space at any date or diplo is fine by me.

 

[rrau]

turn 0 (1340)

MM Antioch to keep from rioting - don't have enough $ to rush market.
MM Gordion to keep from rioting & switch slow build infantry to market
MM Susa.

Hmm - looks like WW is setting in. Will trade France medicine for furs, WM, 59g, and 1gpt

go back and MM again

Hey just realized something, you can change build orders from the F1 screen (I saw an italicised build order and clicked on it and it brought up a list of things to build) Probably if it was a snake, it would have bit me after all this time. Well that's my something new that I learned for the day

@ jb1964 - The trades looked fairly good, but Ozzy's probably getting his excess gpt from Spain (and maybe a GA if he triggered one with his UU). If I'm going to trade an expensive tech away, I tend to trade it all during one turn (even if it's for peanuts) to keep the AI from getting the benefit from trading it around. For some reason, when AI's trade with each other, I've noticed they'll lower their research rate to pay gpt for a tech which they won't do for the human. If I don't want one AI to get a huge benefit, I think it's worth taking a lower value deal if they are anywhere near tech parity. (now I wouldn't be giving all techs away to zulu or iroquois who can't come up with gpt to pay for it - I'm not that benevolent to the AI's )

Finally to the game again:

ibt

a Bab infantry moved into view near Tugelia.

turn 1 (1345)

keep stack by Tugelia intact. If the infantry survives Zulu's attack with mace, longbow, impi and musket might try to take out with elite next turn.

Had a warrior standing in the countryside by Medina, moved and upgraded him. Also loaded an AW to bring back to upgrade after dropping an infantry in Utica.

ibt

turn 2 (1350)

bombard bab destroyer entering our territory
rush market in Antioch

ibt

turn 3 (1355)

turned off governer options in capital

ibt

renew rop with spain
Learn Mass production, start Motorized transport

turn 4 (1360)

Ozzy has already sold MP around to everyone that has anything to trade except the Vikings . Trade vikings Mass Production for Incense, WM, 75g, and 49gpt
Switch research to Radio in 8 (100%) as AI's will probably go for Motorized transport and flight before radio (hopefully)
Rushed some courthouses

ibt

Missed most of the autoplay of the AI's on the ibt due to phone call (came right after I hit the return button)
Built Intelligence agency
Lots of WLTK days

turn 5 (1365)

ibt

Vikings request audience - want MPP - no thanks, but buy new WM for 4g

turn 6 (1370)

ibt

lost our wines and dyes

turn 7 (1375)

rush market in Gordium
Spain learned flight - can't afford it and keep up research. Also, can't recoup the money from Ozzy. Will wait and hope we're first to Radio.
Turn research to 90% (still radio in 5)
Buy dyes from spain for 918g (bargain vs increasing lux to 10%)

ibt

renew rop with ozzy
England and Zulu signed Peace Treaty
I think Zulu are close to losing Tugela

turn 8 (1380)

Spain and Ottos now know both Radio and Amphibious warfare. Otto's fairly broke. Spain very rich. I think we should be the first to radio and be able to trade it for other techs. (and maybe another lux from Spain)

Will go help zulu out by Tugela - softened up the infantry for them. Will keep remainder of stack in place.

ibt

Scandanavia wants to renew alliance vs Babs, no.
Celts wants to renew alliance, no
England wants to renew alliance, no
France wants to renew alliance, no
Iroquois want to renew alliance, no
Ottos want to renew alliance, no
Zulu wants to renew alliance, no
Tugela barely holds against Babs

turn 9 (1385)

Adyab (1 tile island pop 7) has granary to complete next turn, change to a market in 11
Check and all alliances vs Babs are expired.
Peace with Babs. We receive WM and 218g
Trade Babs Atomic Theory for 300g and 13gpt (clean them out)
No improvement in happiness with peace, so rush markets in some of the most unhappy cities.
Zulu RoP expires soon, call our troops home

ibt

built enough banks to start Wall Street

turn 10 (1390)

Change Mecca from infantry to Wall Street in 5 (or could go to Damascus and be done in 3 - currently building battleship due in 1, but I don't know if we'll need now that we aren't at war - next player decides)

Notes:

several workers fortified in Mecca - almost all territory railroaded - Maybe join to cities as needed to boost production.

WE ARE AT PEACE

Learn Radio in 2 (we're down flight and amphibious war - hopefully one of the AI's learns Motorized transport before we learn radio - I guess I could have stuck with it instead of switching to Radio, but didn't lose any beakers making the switch)

RoP with Zulu ends this ibt, have some troops almost to our territory.

 

[DJMGator13]

Getting peace was good especially if we were getting WW. We don't need Amp Warfare or Adv Flight. We also may want to start thinking about a UN prebuild. We need the UN for either victory condition.


Roster
RowAndLive - up
DJMGator13 - on deck
Zarth - MIA - hasn't been online since early Aug. hope everything is OK
jb1964 -
rrau - just played

 

[RowAndLive]

Sorry, I've been watching for new posting messages at the top, and haven't seen any, so I didn't check this last page until today. Got it.


EDIT: I've played 3, and should be able to get this finished tonight or tomorrow. Sorry for the delay.

 

[RowAndLive]

1390 – 0
Horse interdicting Otto spices now forts on oil in N of Otto lands.
Horse interdicting Otto saltpeter now forts on oil in S of Otto lands.
Ottos will pay 358g for ivory.
Sell gems to France for WM, 23g + 5gpt.
Sell gems to Vikings for 12g + 30gpt.
Drop research to 80%, keeping radio in 2, but now +525gpt.
Keep Damascus on B-ship & Mecca on wall street

IBT: Vikings & Spain MA vs England. Vikings declare on English. 2 Spanish ironclads appear at Sidon, 3-4 Otto frigates go in against Babs at Shuruppak. Bab B-ship at Shuruppak. Ottos conquer Shuruppak & Nimrud.
Zulu offer ROP for 6g – no.
Pollution @ Medina.
Damascus Bship > Bship in 3. Kufah Colosseum > inf in 3. Balkh univ > court in 10 to prevent propaganda, otherwise bank & factory.

1395 – 1
8 tiles of pollution in Babylonian terr.
Bship toward Anjar. Get inf out of Zulu terr.
Sell Zulu our TM for WM + 7g. Sell TM to Iroquois for WM + 6g. Sell France our TM for WM + 15g. Sell TM to England for WM + 4g. Taking all of their money.
No one has radio yet.

IBT: Sell ROP to Vikings for 3g +1gpt, & they turn polite. Zulu ask for ROP & MA vs Babylon – we gift them out TM. Bab 2/4 Bship sinks Otto Frigate at Tyre.
Radio > Motor Transport.
Medina inf > civ defense in 3 (need to build settler & arty soon). Najran cathedral > inf in 3. Tyre market > inf in 30.

1400 – 2
Bship through Anjar. 1 inf each (back from Zulu) to Persepolis, Tarsus and Susa. Rod from Mansura to galleon, bound for Tyre.
Ottos will buy Radio for Amphib, Flight, WM, 875g + 83gpt. Spain gives silks, wines, WM, 53g +27gpt for Radio. (Cheap, and we’re happy & don’t need the luxes, but better to keep the loot from going to Osman). Vikings give WM, 46g +20gpt (also need flight) for radio. France gives WM, 19g +5gpt for communism. Sell TM to Babylon for WM + 18g. Sell WM to Iroquois for 5g.
Hurry inf in Taif for 120g. Upgrade cannon at Anjar to arty for 20g. Upgrade MI in Fez to guerilla for 50g. MI from Merw to Anjar & upgrades to guerilla for 50g. Rush court in Tabuk for a few gold.

IBT: 1 Celt ironclad dies & 1 goes red first promoting & then sinking Bab Bship.
Bab & France sign peace. WLTC day all over. Oxford falls to Vikings.
Baghdad comm. Dock > inf in 3. Aleppo duct > inf in 9. Taif inf > airport in 54. Tabuk court > inf in 13.

1405 – 3
Pike from Aleppo to Anjar & upgrade to inf for 60g, guerilla from Anjar to Aleppo. Nate (warrior) to Taif & upgrades to guerilla for 60g(?). Archer in Fez upgrades to guerilla for 70g. Galleon to Tyre, Rod E to fort, spear to Tyre & rests. Guerilla from Susa to Pasargadae & rides transport to Hama & forts.
Babylon will give WM, 65g +49gpt for electronics or Amphib, but not espionage (but close, must be researching).
Plant a spy in Babylon for 105g. Plant spy in Otto Empire for 96g. Would need 3254g to plant propaganda in Muscat. Can expose agent for 250g.
Build airfield & 2 radar towers near Bayt Ras.
<save>
Upgrade last remaining MI & cannon.
Move research to 100% for MT in 4, still +406gpt.
Turn all specialists except @ Susa into taxmen to get +415gpt.

IBT: England & Celts sign peace.
Damascus Bship > inf in 2. Kufah inf > inf in 3. Aden court > univ in 34. Sidon harbor > rax in 20.

1410 – 4
Spear in Tyre to Taif & upgrade to inf. Guerilla from Taif to Tyre. MM cities to keep Medina from starving.
Sell WM to: Babylon for WM +40g, Zulu for WM + 20g, Ottos for 6g, France for WM +21g +1gpt, Spain for 6g (Spain has MT but wants everything), Vikings for 10g, gift to Celts.

Ottos have MPP with Spain. Spain & Vikings have MA vs England.

Military Comparison:
Inf Cav Art Gue Other BB DD IC Frig Bomb
Us 42 17 05 14
Ottos 74 16 11 00 01 00 05 11 01
Babs 75 05 10 00 00 01 02 00 00

Babs & Ottos are both Communist.

IBT: Mecca Wall Street > airport in 3, Medina Civ Def > Bomber in 2, Najran inf > destroyer in 3, Antioch Library > inf in 13, Basra Comm Dock > inf in 3, Khurasan hospital > inf in 3, Fustat stock exch > inf in 3. The folks add statues to the palace porch.

1415 – 5
Move stuff.

IBT: Babs & Iros at peace.
Damascus inf > inf in 2, Baghdad inf > inf in 4, Arbela lib > market in 13, Yamama market > inf in 12.

1420 – 6
MM for MT in 1, with +778gpt.
Upgrade galleon to transport for 40g. Upgrade 2nd galleon to transport for 40g.

IBT: Zulu & Spain MA vs England & Zulu declare. France requests MPP & ROP – we gift our WM. Viking destroyer passes in through Suhar straits.
We enter the Modern Age! MT > Fission in 28.
Medina bomber > tank in 2, Kufah inf > tank in 3.

1425 - 7
Readjust research to 80% for Fission in 11 at +112gpt.
Ottos already have Fission, but won’t trade. Sell Babs electronics for WM + 197g + 37gpt. Sell electronics to Celts for WM +8g +22gpt. Sell electronics to England for WM +126g +108gpt. Sell Steam to Iros for WM +22g +3gpt. Sell Zulu ToG for WM +98g. Sell Ottos WM for WM +1g.
We successfully steal Fission from Ottos carefully for 3174g.
MM research to 90% for Computers in 10 @ +132gpt (vs 9T @ +8gpt).
Switch Mecca from airport in 1 to UN in 12.
Change Damascus from inf in 1 to tank in 1, Najran from Destroyer in 1 to tank in 1, Khurasan from inf in 1 to tank in 1, Basra from inf to tank in 1, Fustat to tank in 2, Baghdad to tank in 3.
Join 5 workers to Mecca to get UN in 10.
Gifts: medicine to Zulu, sanitation to Iroquois.

IBT: Celts wants embargo vs Babs – we gift him our WM.
Damascus tank > tank in 2, Najran tank > tank in 3, Basra tank > tank in 4, Khurasan tank > tank in 3, Mosul fcty > tank in 4.
Pollution at Basra.

1430 – 8
Tank from Khurasan to Fustat. Bomber to Mosul. Pollution cleaned up. Tanks to Fustat.

IBT: Ottos stacking up pollution.
Medina tank > tank in 2, Fustat tank > tank in 4.
Pollution at Basra.

1435 – 9
Gifts: industrialization to France, radio to Celts (now polite), radio to England (now polite), 10g to Vikings, 10g to Spain. (Can’t be sure if opponent will be Babs, preferably, or Ottos).
Pollution cleared. Tanks to Fustat. Bomber to Hama.

IBT: Ottos & Babs at peace. Celts & Babs at peace. Pollution near Mecca.
Damascus tank > Manhattan in 12 (in case Mecca gets bombed), Baghdad tank > tank in 4, Kufah tank > tank in 3, Aydab market > lib in 20.
Ottos begin UN in Istanbul. Lost our furs from France.

1440 – 10
France wants a tech for furs, which we can live without. Pollution cleared.
Investigate Istanbul for 186g to see:
UN due in 16. 25pop=9h/3c/7u/5clowns/1tax, 53spt, 59fpt, 40gpt, 32bpt, 1 tank, 1 arty, 9 inf (mostly on happiness duty), Note this is Communism, and if he switches to demo, it could be an issue for the race to UN.
Move interdicting horse to cover his 1 of 2 biggest shield tiles at Istanbul. The other is the mountain with the 2 workers. Pounce when possible to slow UN / Manhattan build.

The ottos are building tanks at same rate as us: 4 to 2 on 1st turn, 9 to 7 on 3rd turn, but we just changed Damascus. Give it thought. He has 77 inf to our 46, 11 arty to our 5, 7 cav to our 17.
Also keep a watch on points as UN approaches – it may still be Babs.

Gator is UP!

 

[DJMGator13]

Hey guys I'm going to need to skip or swap. Got another hurricane bearing down on me and again the current forecast puts it right over me. This storm is huge. Charley was nothing compared to this. The wind footprint is larger than the whole state of Florida.

 

[jb1964]

OK Gator,

I'll swap w/ you. I just took a look at Frances. Yikes! That thing is huge.

Ever consider moving to Ohio? If you're in the engineering field I'm sure I could help. And when the tornados come we can retreat to a basement.

Since Zarth is MIA I'm going to consider him an autoskip.

Stay safe.

 

[RowAndLive]

Upstate NY is nice too. We have a corporate campus in Melbourne that has the hurricane hassles too. Depending on your field, there are engineering jobs here too, and the payrolls are higher to offset those wonderful state taxes...

Hopefully jb can wrap this one up. Unless we skip the vote and the world goes nuclear, I certainly don't expect to see this one again.

 

[rrau]

Hope you can finish this one, or I'll need a skip (maybe). I'm supposed to go on vacation to S.C. from the 4-11th. We'll have to see where the hurricane goes.

 

[RowAndLive]

OK,
jb1964 is UP (& hopefully will finish)
R&L is On Deck

 

[DJMGator13]

Thanks guys, I'll keep you updated on the storm. Right now they are telling us to expect about 18 hours of hurricane force winds. I'm still hoping something will make it turn, but this monster has tropical storm force winds 185 miles out and Florida only about 120 miles across.

I'm almost done boarding up so there is a small chance I might get to play some tomorow evening, I'll check in to see where we are at. But I"m still in the early stages of GOTM34.

 

[RowAndLive]

Good Luck, Gator!

 

[jb1964]

I would like some advice as to how to go about securing a diplomatic win.

In all my games my diplo experiences number 2. One, first, was a loss and the second one was more of a conquest that a diplo win.

So, with that, who's our likely competition for SG of the UN and how do I make him lower than whale poop in the eyes of the rest of the world?

 

[rrau]

I would get Dianthus's mapstat utility if you don't already have it. Check it the turn before building the UN and see who our rival will be (should be the largest civ other than us). Then dow on them and sign MA with other civs against them they will either vote for us or abstain as they will not vote for someone they are at war with.

 

[RowAndLive]

Our opponent will definitely be either the Ottos or the Babs. The Babs are just now crawling out from under a long-lasting dogpile, but have the next most points. The Ottos have been relatively benevolent, but have not been giving away techs as much as we have. We've also been consistant, for example with France, over longer stretches of time.

My hope was to do 2 things:
1 - keep the Ottos from building before we do. This shouldn't be a problem, as we had a head start, have a backup build in a second city in case we lose our primary, and are trying to interdict the 2 bigh spt tiles at Istanbul.
2 - MM to ensure that we get our build done before the Ottos pass the Babs in total points. They are growing faster, but we may be able to do it. It wouldn't hurt to know if gifting them a tech would help or not. Input?

If these 2 things happen, then the Babs will be the opponent, and the recent dogpile coupled with continued gifting of techs & money should seal it for us.