Quo's Combined Tweaks v7.0.19 BETA

[Ridesdragons]

when are you experiencing crashing?

 

[Opera]

I really like playing with your mod, especially compared to the other big changers. Are you going to do changes to the religious beliefs some time or should I look for an additional mod for them?

One particular gripe I have is your changes for the Aztec and Brazil. I'm not convinced why you went with them as they seem quite complex for no added gain. Why not give Brazil the camps at Printing Press directly? I can understand the thought behind having to complete a project and such but in essence, it's just a needless hurdle.

 

[Puer]

There is a tooltip bug.
Australia, wanted to build a Harbour next to city center:

Spoiler :

Used mods:
AI + (v10)
cqui (nightly)
BES
Diplomatic Total
Quo's Combined Tweaks
Smoother Difficulty

 

[Vansteel]

Won't let me start a game when I have it enabled. Goes back to the Main Menu every time I click on 'Start Game'

 

[Graf Zorba]

I do like your mod, especially your terrain adjustments and the better pantheons. I do have two suggestions for improvement:
– Oral tradition giving 2 cult to all plantations is too strong, considering how much early culture can get you ahead.
– Oasis giving +1 food to surrounding tiles is enough in my opinion, since +2 can lead to rather ridiculous cities: http://imgur.com/a/28FNm

 

[Ridesdragons]

I do like your mod, especially your terrain adjustments and the better pantheons. I do have two suggestions for improvement:
– Oral tradition giving 2 cult to all plantations is too strong, considering how much early culture can get you ahead.
– Oasis giving +1 food to surrounding tiles is enough in my opinion, since +2 can lead to rather ridiculous cities: http://imgur.com/a/28FNm

culture is pretty nice early game for getting a partial-scientific advantage. however, you have to consider:
1. plantations can only be built on certain resources, mostly only luxury resources, and only a few of which will actually be near you, and one resource (bananas, the only non-luxury resource that utilizes it) requires you to be at the equator, in the jungle. compared to the pastures pantheon, which only gives 1 culture, but to pastures, which are primarily built on basic resources (cow, sheep, and strategic resource horse), which are all fairly common (as australia it seems it's pretty much omnipresent lol), I get a much greater culture boost than the one or two plantations that may-or-may-not appear in my area. also, there's the face that plantations are unlocked at irrigation, which is locked behind pottery.
2. picking this means not picking a different pantheon. there are some much better pantheons out there, especially if you start near some neat stuff. religious settlements is one of my personal favourites, although this mod makes it seems not really worth it oftentimes lol.

oasis giving 2 food isn't really a problem, and your picture isn't really ridiculous at all. you took a grassland (2 food) with an oasis (2 food) and put a farm (1 food). I can get more food on plains without the oasis by surrounding it with farms. you want ridiculous, have 3 oases right next to each other, you'll end up with 1 6 food 3 gold tile. however, such a tile would need to be either a desert or a tundra/snow tile, since the tiles around it would also have to be those tiles in order to house an oasis. also, all this does is make the tiles self sufficient unless you have multiple oases nearby each other, and even then, the bonus is mostly kept in small areas (1 6-food tile, 3 4-food tiles, the rest are 2-food tiles). remember, each citizen needs 2 food to survive. if you made them so they only gave 1 food, desert cities, unless expertly placed, would not longer be viable (and arguably even with the oases they aren't since if you're in a fast desert and you aren't australia, you've got a bunch of tiles that provide food and gold and that's it, no hammers or anything else. unless they are hills, or you've built petra).

 

[isau]

isau updated Quo's Combined Tweaks with a new update entry:

Quo Combined Tweaks v3.08.1 BETA

This release introduces a new concept and reason to stockpile Luxury resources: Resource Expos.

Resource Expos are somewhat similar to "Corporations" in Civ 4 BTS and "Monopolies" in the Civ 5 Vox Populi mod.

• You establish an Expo by being the player with the most copies of a Luxury Resource in the world (with a minimum of 3 copies).
• The Expos you currently have active can be seen in the Building list in the Capital City. (It is set up this way instead of with...

Read the rest of this update entry...

 

[isau]

Sorry guys, I see there are tons of comments/questions about the mod I missed recently. Things have been crazy for me the past 2 weeks. Catching up with some of them.

I really like playing with your mod, especially compared to the other big changers. Are you going to do changes to the religious beliefs some time or should I look for an additional mod for them?

One particular gripe I have is your changes for the Aztec and Brazil. I'm not convinced why you went with them as they seem quite complex for no added gain. Why not give Brazil the camps at Printing Press directly? I can understand the thought behind having to complete a project and such but in essence, it's just a needless hurdle.

There were two things I specifically wanted to do to Brazil and Aztecs:

• I strongly felt Brazil needed a way to reliably improve Rainforests, because their UA depends on Rainforest for a Housing bonus, but it's pretty much never practical to keep Rainforests around in cities that large, which negates the bonus. There is no particular reason the Brazilwood Camp had to be unlocked by a project, but I personally like it. That said, I could consider adding more to the project. The original design concept was actually "You unlock Brazilwood camps after hosting 3 Carnivals, but that proved too difficult to code." So maybe the "Brazilian Revolution" could instead be one MEGA carnival with worldwide effects that also unlocks the improvement, where you get all the current benefits plus a one-time huge burst of Great People Points.
  
• For the Aztecs, I specifically wanted to tone down Builder spam in the early game. But -1 worker charge all game long is extremely punishing. I could have just tied the restoration to +1 it to a technology or civic but it seemed like a lost opportunity. It's possible that the -4 food in city that builds it is too much. I may be willing to make other changes to this national wonder. One early idea was "Gives you [some bonus] but forces you into war with all city states on your continent."
• Beyond all this, these two abilities were also the first time I messed with objects placeable on the map, so part of the design decision was basically centered on having limited time to figure all that out while also designing something unique on the code side.

There is a tooltip bug.
Australia, wanted to build a Harbour next to city center:

Spoiler :

View attachment 466849

Used mods:
AI + (v10)
cqui (nightly)
BES
Diplomatic Total
Quo's Combined Tweaks
Smoother Difficulty

Thanks for pointing that out. Looks like it's just missing text tag in my xml files. Added to list for fixing.

I do like your mod, especially your terrain adjustments and the better pantheons. I do have two suggestions for improvement:
– Oral tradition giving 2 cult to all plantations is too strong, considering how much early culture can get you ahead.
– Oasis giving +1 food to surrounding tiles is enough in my opinion, since +2 can lead to rather ridiculous cities: http://imgur.com/a/28FNm

I agree about the +2 culture in Oral Tradition being too strong. It was changed in a recent release to "+1 culture per plantation, and grab 4 extra tiles when you plant a city" (basically 1/2 power version of Russia's UA.)

I disagree about Oasis. Oasis are basically semi-reliable Natural Wonders without the other bonuses Natural Wonders give. It's true if you find one you can sometimes make a good city, and with Petra an amazing one. But given all the downsides of being near Desert I think it's worth it. The idea was to make deserts (and occasionally Snow) worth fighting over. You can occasionally create amazing locations with Oasis if you get Petra and you're someone like Spain who can improve Desert tiles. But I like that it's possible to have some amazing locations. IMO if I change anything here, it will likely be Petra and not Oases. Note that I did already tune Oases once before, removing them Tundra, because those stacks did become a little too good.

 

[isau]

I really like playing with your mod, especially compared to the other big changers. Are you going to do changes to the religious beliefs some time or should I look for an additional mod for them?

I missed your question about Religions. They are on the list of "would like to explore" updating. The issue with them is they are a real pain to test, although much less so now that we have real mod tools. When I wrote the Pantheon code I didn't even have Firetuner, which made testing an interesting process indeed.

That said, do you or anyone else have any ideas on which beliefs are underperformers that need a boost? The balance issue with Religions, unlike Pantheons, is that not everyone gets them, so you have to make it so players aren't forced to chase them to compete, but they are still good enough to want.

 

[zak15]

It's quite hard and I'm quite bad at judging, but I'll give it a go and kind of evaluate how I see them.

I think the follower beliefs are good as they are, I wouldn't change any of them. I won't be giving my opinions on fixes, just starting the conversation I guess. We see which ones we like and which ones are just kind of useless and need buffing/replacing. Maybe after 10-20 posts we can get some good ideas to change religion.

Founder

Papal primacy is very strong as long as you can defend the city states from the AI or other players.

Church Property and Tithe basically do similar things, both fine.

World Church just doesn't seem very good to me. You'd need too many people for a small amount of culture.
Pilgrimage is similar to world church. Just not enough unless you're really owning a lot of enemy cities. And in that case, you're probably on your way to an easy religious victory if it's on.

Lay Ministry and Stewardship don't feel like they would be a lot so I don't take them. But I imagine making that +2 each would be hugely overpowered. Any boost there would make them "get this to win", especially Stewardship's 2 science.

Buildings

Buildings are balanced imo.

Enhancer

I like the idea of Crusade and Defender of the Faith. I think they're fairly balanced.

Holy order is good, makes spamming easy.

Missionary zeal isn't great imo. Maybe you can use it to really rush your units across and get your religion in before they can get theirs going, but it needs something else. Maybe extra spread instead, or extra combat strength on top of the movement it already has.

Itinerant preachers and scripture is okay. Monastic isolation is is decent.

____________________

So which ones do we actually like? Which ones do we think we should buff or just completely change?

 

[Puer]

Does anyone know if this mod is compatible/recommended with CQUI (latest nightly)?

 

[isau]

Does anyone know if this mod is compatible/recommended with CQUI (latest nightly)?

It should be, yes. I do all my testing and playing with CQUI enabled. I make most of my design decisions based on what will maintain compatibility.

Should also be compatible with most mods that add units, maps, civs, wonders, natural wonders, resources, etc. Mainly not compatible with mods that make major gameplay rules changes. In most cases stacking with one of those mods will just result in one mod or the other not functioning rather than a crash. That said I am going back through and improving some of the older code to eliminate possible crashes caused by clashes between mods that make changes to tile yields. So for now the only major mod type I'd avoid combining with would be anything that also makes changes to sea tiles.

 

[Puer]

Glad to hear, I will start next game with latest CQUI + Quo's Combined Tweaks v 3.08.1 BETA.

One strange thing I noticed - there is no victory message/video/picture end of the game? Game just keeps going on, even there is no AI players in game
It was second game I finished game with a victory (first was Religious victory and second was Domination) and there is no notification... Has anyone seen any victory message?

Spoiler :

Spoiler :

 

[isau]

Glad to hear, I will start next game with latest CQUI + Quo's Combined Tweaks v 3.08.1 BETA.

One strange thing I noticed - there is no victory message/video/picture end of the game? Game just keeps going on, even there is no AI players in game

View attachment 467884 View attachment 467885

Spoiler :

View attachment 467884

Spoiler :

View attachment 467885

LOL well that's a new one. It might be caused by a script conflict somewhere. Does this only happen with Domination victories?

 

[Puer]

It was second game, I finished game with a victory (first was Religious victory and second was Domination) and there is no notification... I have never seen one. Not sure if it's related to this mod.

I'm using following mods:
AI + (v10)
BES (seems that this one is causing perfomance issues)
Diplomatic Total 20161223
Quo's Combined Tweaks (latest non-BETA)
Smoother Difficulty

I'll re-install the game and will use following mods for next game:
Quo's Combined Tweaks
AI + (v10)
cqui
Diplomatic Total
Slower Tech

Will provide feedback if this issue re-occurs.

 

[qadams]

Really enjoying your mod, isau, thanks for making it! I have just one minor correction to offer: on the introduction screen when the game opens, you have Cavalry spelled incorrectly as Calvary. Not that it matters much, but you may want to change that at some point.

 

[isau]

Really enjoying your mod, isau, thanks for making it! I have just one minor correction to offer: on the introduction screen when the game opens, you have Cavalry spelled incorrectly as Calvary. Not that it matters much, but you may want to change that at some point.

I'll put that on the list to fix. Glad you enjoy the mod!

 

[Xaviarlol]

Isau just wanted to say that you've done a fantastic job with this mod. Love the scope of the changes.

 

[Puer]

Feedback:
Playing as China/Qin Shi Huang.
Workes initially had 3 charges. After I built Pyramids, workes have 5 charges.
I expected 4 charges, because Pyramids provide +1 charge not +2, right?

Quo's Combined Tweaks v 3.08.1 BETA.

 

[zak15]

That's strange, cause they should have 4 charges in the first place.

@Xaviarlol I love both of you guys' mods. It's just frustrating that some things overlap so I end up taking things apart. Great mods though, some collaborative work between you two might be great in the future, hint hint