Realism Invictus

[Manco Capac]

The new militia is downright scary. For someone playing regularly Monarch and less, it is clearly manageable, but for people playing EMP+, it's gonna make the early game a hell! And it was already difficult enough before... Super Archers were the sole mean to survive with a little luck (but not abusive ofc). Now, people will have to spam units at the same rate as the AI, which is a complete no-no against high level AI's with production bonuses.

 

[poisonousautumn]

Civ 5 is still an awesome game in its own right & so is Civ 4. The only thing that Civ 5 lacks to some extent is mods with quality level of Realism Invictus.

BTW to expect a level of detail reached in this mod from a vanilla game is a bit absurd IMO. Official versions are made for casual players & they also try to avoid controversial areas (such as religion & controversial leaders which are throughly covered in this mod).


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I agree, and that is why I prefer PC games (it's all about the mods). This reason is exactly why I abandoned civ 5 after a few months. I purchased every expansion and the game still had fundemental flaws that no (existing) mod is able to address. In time, if they open up more of the game to alteration, I may return. But for now, well here I am.
Civ 5 should have allowed limited stacking and used a supply system like RI to prevent the ole "carpet of doom". Also, the more complex and attractive games become the longer it takes to get good mods out it seems. I stopped modding when I could no longer design new units with Paintbrush

 

[civcivcivcivciv]

isn't there mod change civ ?

ex) i m playing germany but after i added america i change my civ germany --> america ?

 

[Sathar]

Just an observation about the new tribal forts:

I've been struggling to get Armenia off the ground, so I restarted several Huge World Map Monarch games. In at least two, including my current game, Judea took down Syria early. Like before Turn 30 early. Bit of a game changer.

Attila attacking on Turn 50 is a bit of a headache, too, but that's a separate issue and really more my problem than his

 

[Darkphoenix]

Just an observation about the new tribal forts:

I've been struggling to get Armenia off the ground, so I restarted several Huge World Map Monarch games. In at least two, including my current game, Judea took down Syria early. Like before Turn 30 early. Bit of a game changer.

Continuing the vein of anecdotal references, I decided to try a new game with Armenia after seeing this post since I hadn't tried them out before. I haven't seemed to have any problems, though admittedly it is on Monarch and not Emperor since it's my first try with the civ. While I didn't see Syria get taken down by Judea early, I'm a bit surprised that it is even possible before turn 30. Something weird had to have happened I would have thought (like the fort disappearing) for that to happen.

You don't happen to have a save from before it occurred, do you?

Attila attacking on Turn 50 is a bit of a headache, too, but that's a separate issue and really more my problem than his

Hmmm, what's your build/tech plan look like? I honestly don't see this being an issue on the Huge World Map. Your capital is on a hill, they basically have one tile they can attack from that doesn't give the +25% river penalty, your 2nd city should be positioned north of Babylon to get the Copper tile, meaning the AI would have to waste its time with more traveling to get at the more lightly defended spot, if it ever even decides to go after it.

In my current game I've taken over Babylon and Persia by turn 180, and I am debating whether to consolidate, or raze all of Arabia to the ground to eliminate rivals in the area. I've kept 3-4 units back in my capital just in case Attila attacks like you mention, but so far he's been content to let me expand.

My tech plan was Wheel, Animal Husbandry, Metal Lore (Note, this was a mistake, this should be moved to after Woodworking), Toolmaking, Woodworking.

 

[Sathar]

You don't happen to have a save from before it occurred, do you?

Sorry, no. I didn't see it happen, just Syria turning blue on/about 30. Happened in two different games (I just now took it over ) Also not unique -- the middle city of those three between the Huns and Russia was already razed by the time I got a scout up there mid-Classical. I have no idea what Africa looks like yet, though none of the minor civs have been knocked out yet as far as i know.

Hmmm, what's your build/tech plan look like?[...] Your capital is on a hill, they basically have one tile they can attack from that doesn't give the +25% river penalty, your 2nd city should be positioned north of Babylon to get the Copper tile

A little fluid.

First off, Attila doesn't always attack, which is what surprised me that time. He just spammed warriors, and the stack of five or six just overran my poor defender. I still adapting to Kmod being a bit more aggressive than before, so I just have to be more alert to having to repel an unplanned invasion a little more often than before

I generally spam settlers and a worker initially, since I find that if I wait I lose the land-grab to Babylon and/or Persia (Now I'm grudgingly adding some early warriors too, since even if Attila isn't feeling frisky, the barb spam coming out of Syria/Hittite can be a problem too). The site you mentioned is usually my third city, behind that little river just east of the copper. My first settler goes in the spot NW of Babylon to grab the double-sheep/horse/wheat -- if I don't it's gone by the time I get there and it's more of a pain to have to conquer it. Besides, it's actually a better city site than Yerevan. I generally hate to build palaces, but I seriously debate taking a clue from history and moving my capital there once I get rolling.

The site directly between Babylon and Persia, SSE of my copper city, is even better (plus iron!), but a bit too far to really be my third city, though it frustratingly overlaps my copper city. I let the neighbors found it, and it's my first conquest once the arrows start to fly.

Tech I've been experimenting a little. Usually I start wheel/AH since getting the cattle/sheep/horses herded is critical to getting my third settler and other production out in any reasonable time frame (Pastoral Nomadism!). I tried putting Archery before Wood to see how it would work but it was a miserable failure -- the militia/spears are just too good and the Armenian archers always feel like a waste of space (not so the longbows!). Besides, the faster I get the Royal Guards up the better

 

[Del_Boy]

Ok first things first. Good effort on the mod but a few things that should be corrected. Christian/jewish etc temples should not make people sick. They were in times past places of cleanliness (it is a house of worship after all) so making it give a city 1 sickness doesn't make much sense since they are not dirty places.

Secondly, when are you going to fix the A.I? It is a war mongering . I build cities too close, they declare war. I don't give them any tech, they declare war. Even when they are elated with me I can sense it is only a matter of time before they eventually stab me in the back just for the sake of having something to do. They also still cant seem to count properly. On my last game they wanted three techs for 1 of 2 stone....Really A.I designer?

Thirdly I am still getting stupid results in combat when attacking a city with a gunpowder unit (strength 9) I am being defeated by archers? Now, I don't know about you but have you ever actually seen a fight between gunpowder and non gunpowder units? I can tell you it's pretty one sided. On that note cannons need to be more powerful if you are going to have city defenses. Maybe add more collateral damage or something.

The other thing I wanted to mention is why when I play the world scenario I am only allowed to have one ruler? Doesn't really allow for much of a change of strategy.

I do enjoy this mod and cannot play normal civ 4 anymore. Keep the updates coming I'm sure you will get it right soon.

 

[Babri]

Ok first things first. Good effort on the mod but a few things that should be corrected. Christian/jewish etc temples should not make people sick. They were in times past places of cleanliness (it is a house of worship after all) so making it give a city 1 sickness doesn't make much sense since they are not dirty places.

Secondly, when are you going to fix the A.I? It is a war mongering . I build cities too close, they declare war. I don't give them any tech, they declare war. Even when they are elated with me I can sense it is only a matter of time before they eventually stab me in the back just for the sake of having something to do. They also still cant seem to count properly. On my last game they wanted three techs for 1 of 2 stone....Really A.I designer?

Thirdly I am still getting stupid results in combat when attacking a city with a gunpowder unit (strength 9) I am being defeated by archers? Now, I don't know about you but have you ever actually seen a fight between gunpowder and non gunpowder units? I can tell you it's pretty one sided. On that note cannons need to be more powerful if you are going to have city defenses. Maybe add more collateral damage or something.

The other thing I wanted to mention is why when I play the world scenario I am only allowed to have one ruler? Doesn't really allow for much of a change of strategy.

I do enjoy this mod and cannot play normal civ 4 anymore. Keep the updates coming I'm sure you will get it right soon.

Tech trading is supposed to be disabled when playing RI, it is not recommended with it being on. But I agree that AI is kind of stupid during trade deals. They value some resources really really high. Like for example they would demand your 6-7 luxuries for their incense. For some reason horses aren't considered as valuable by AI add in the base game even trading.
Wars can be frustrating at times in civ 4. In my last game I lost 4-5 mobile guards with 90+ chances of victory. This was highly infuriating when I lost 2 of my badass GG attached mobile guards to puny archers with 95+ chances of victory. The thing you can do to ensure victory when having a vastly superior army is to get extra strikes. These can help your troops to destroy weaker enemies most of the times with little to no damage.

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[Del_Boy]

Tech trading is supposed to be disabled when playing RI, it is not recommended with it being on. But I agree that AI is kind of stupid during trade deals. They value some resources really really high. Like for example they would demand your 6-7 luxuries for their incense. For some reason horses aren't considered as valuable by AI add in the base game even trading.
Wars can be frustrating at times in civ 4. In my last game I lost 4-5 mobile guards with 90+ chances of victory. This was highly infuriating when I lost 2 of my badass GG attached mobile guards to puny archers with 95+ chances of victory. The thing you can do to ensure victory when having a vastly superior army is to get extra strikes. These can help your troops to destroy weaker enemies most of the times with little to no damage.

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I guess that I'm not supposed to have tech trading on at all then. Maybe I'm breaking the game somehow by having it on. Something to think about. It's been that long since I played vanilla it's hard to remember whether the AI was ever that good with deals. I seem to remember them being just as idiotic in civ 3.

The AI seems to make some very clever feints/counter attacks at times and always catches me by surprise. But that archer rule needs changed its infuriating! I could understand it if I was fighting it with melee units or they vastly outnumbered me. I can even understand me not getting a full 100% ( losses are inevitable I guess) but the times it's been 70% and higher and they wiped me out. Catapults/trebuchets are a must then. Now I always pick the extra first strike thingy it seems to swing the odds a bit further in my favour, not sure quite how it works to be honest.

I just re-read my post and realised I came off like a bit of a dick :O Sorry about that it was not intended. It seems all it needs is a few tweaks here and there and all should be good. Does anyone know if they plan on bringing city revolts back? That was kind of fun.

 

[Babri]

Despite have 95%+ odds I was frequently loosing some battles. Then I realised that it is a bug !

So a catapult is going to face my Mobile Guard. Thats cool, I'll wipe it out easily with 100% success (as shown by the stats).

Spoiler :

But then this happens:-

Spoiler :

So apparently the stats were wrong. A longbow defended against the Mobile Guard & defeated him.

Has anyone else faced this bug?? :-/

 

[Noddahrassa]

Thirdly I am still getting stupid results in combat when attacking a city with a gunpowder unit (strength 9) I am being defeated by archers? Now, I don't know about you but have you ever actually seen a fight between gunpowder and non gunpowder units? I can tell you it's pretty one sided.

I think you have some serious misconceptions about the striking power of early gunpowder units. If you are using one with strength 9, I assume it is an arquebusier. You say you're attacking a city, so presumably there are city walls (!), and is the archer maybe a longbowman?

So then imagine being an arquebusier with a single-shot, funnel-mouthed 16th century gun attacking a nice city wall with a bunch of trained longbows taking cover there. This is not shoes you want to be in, believe me.

 

[NFSlugger13]

Babri,

I don't think that's a bug you're seeing. The same thing happened to me multiple times in the past, and there's actually a reason for it.

The odds are being calculated based upon your unit's stats with all the aid being provided to it by the rest of your stack. From the position indicated in your picture, the odds would be correct if you could attack directly from your stack's tile to the enemy in an adjacent tile.

However, your unit would have to step away from the stack (losing all aid) before actually striking the defending unit. This necessarily changes the odds.

It would be nice if the programming accounted for this change, but until then I'd just keep it in mind when attacking.

 

[Noddahrassa]

I started this weekend my first 3.25 game, and chose Austronesia on Emperor (huge world map). I have to say that the game is very interesting, different, and the Austronesians are extremely powerful (maybe overpowered even).

I just entered the Medieval Era, and am about to become tech leader, which I never managed on an emperor game so early. Even more striking: I have not had a single military confrontation of any kind. I mean thereby that I haven't even fought a single barbarian unit yet. Not a single battle. Nada.

There are no barbs on the Indonesian islands, somehow I never came around to using slavery, so no revolts, and nobody is attacking me. I thought about attacking the Khmer just for the sake of army training, but I do not really need more cities at this time (have 12 at the moment), still have plenty of sweet spots on Borneo and the Philippines to settle peacefully, and the war would probably needlessly wreck my economy as I have plenty of foreign trade routes with the Khmer and am getting my pigs from them.

The combination of advantages Austronesia gets is awesome. For one, you can build cargo ships with fishing, so one can start contacting the neighbors early. The +3 diplomatic relations trait ensures that everybody is fond as hell of me, wouldn't even think about attacking me, and opens their borders for me (Genghis Khan opened his borders and is trading me horses! How cool is that?). This in turn means foreign trade routes, at least 100% research bonus for every tech, and the possibility to explore even further and make even more contacts. I managed to sail as far as the Balearic Isles with my first ship (the Egyptians had founded a Suez canal city), and got stuck only there because the Berbers wouldn't open borders to let me out into the Atlantic.

Wonder-wise I managed to get the Moais, the Colossus and the Hanging Gardens, and I have an engineer in store for the Sankore University which I will soon be able to build. I also founded Zoroastrianism and converted the Khmer, Koreans, and both Chinas. Some nasty great engineer stole the Great Lighthouse which would have helped me a lot, unfortunately, but I got at least a nice bunch of money for it.

I'm starting to slow down a bit now, however. Possibly I have over-expanded, or maybe I just don't have enough useful mines available to pump out hammers. It is really difficult to have viable production cities, because there is hardly any room for farms to provide the excess food for the mines. I'm longing for shipyards, which will make coast squares yield a food surplus.

So all in all, a very interesting game. I realise that Austronesia was always a "problem civ" for the AI, and probably got boosted that much so that they can play a role on the world map, but if it's the player civ then the bonuses are nearly too much.

 

[Babri]

Babri,

I don't think that's a bug you're seeing. The same thing happened to me multiple times in the past, and there's actually a reason for it.

The odds are being calculated based upon your unit's stats with all the aid being provided to it by the rest of your stack. From the position indicated in your picture, the odds would be correct if you could attack directly from your stack's tile to the enemy in an adjacent tile.

However, your unit would have to step away from the stack (losing all aid) before actually striking the defending unit. This necessarily changes the odds.

It would be nice if the programming accounted for this change, but until then I'd just keep it in mind when attacking.

So you mean I need to move my whole stack next to the enemy stack to benefit from aids? And fort aid bonuses only work when the enemy army is adjacent to your fort?

 

[civcivcivcivciv]

there s bug

worldbuilder

i can't change city name other civ

if i change other civ's city name

then my capital name changed

 

[Sathar]

So you mean I need to move my whole stack next to the enemy stack to benefit from aids? And fort aid bonuses only work when the enemy army is adjacent to your fort?

Short answer: Yes.

Since all attacks (not counting some bombardment) are from one square into an adjacent square, the square you are attacking from is the one that provides the aid.

It took a while to train the habit (I still forget some times!) that whenever attacking something more than one square away, first move the unit adjacent (with the stack, if you want the help) and recheck the odds. Even without aid, something like a river crossing can still make enough of a difference that I rethink the attack. Additionally, if any movement is involved, the game may not choose the same path I would, and potentially leave my weakened victorious unit some place it doesn't want to be.

 

[keldath]

hey guys,
supreme mod indeed.

very nice.


question - may i have the sdk you are using?

 

[sami_snow]

the Austronesians are extremely powerful (maybe overpowered even).

yes, along with spain I think they are very overpowered. you can round the cape of good hope extremely early and get tech flow from the whole world very easily. but the AI doesn't know how to play them

 

[HannibalBarka]

yes, along with spain I think they are very overpowered. you can round the cape of good hope extremely early and get tech flow from the whole world very easily. but the AI doesn't know how to play them

I also agree on this. I think tech transfer should work only when trade routes are possible, else Austrenesia would be "directly" benefiting from english discoveries in the classical era for example which is just not possible. They will still benefit indirectly though (tech is searched by english, "transferred" to say greeks, then to persian, than to indian than to austronesian).
I actually find tech rate too fast on Emp and +.

 

[Joker.ru]

I also agree on this. I think tech transfer should work only when trade routes are possible, else Austrenesia would be "directly" benefiting from english discoveries in the classical era for example which is just not possible. They will still benefit indirectly though (tech is searched by english, "transferred" to say greeks, then to persian, than to indian than to austronesian).
I actually find tech rate too fast on Emp and +.

+1 on trade route requirement