Realism Invictus

Is anyone else still having issues with the same event recurring every few turns? Normally it's the crashed airplane, but in this game, I get a volcanic eruption in my capital's BFC literally every 10 turns or so, which destroys about 3-5 improvements each time. That is a serious drawback, having to spend half the game with that land unimproved. Even though I think that's a sensible event every few centuries or so, for it to happen that frequently is implausible and also pretty debilitating in the game. I might play with events off next time, but am asking since someone had mentioned this problem not too long ago.
 
Also, can someone help me figure out why there is a consistent 33% discrepancy between the actual cultural output and what the numbers themselves add up to for the Greeks in this save? Look at each of their cities, and you'll find that the actual cultural output is one third higher than the base x multipliers adds up to. Plus, it looks like the City Square ---> Print Shop ---? Newspaper, etc., line isn't actually obsoleting, but previous buildings in that series are still being factored into that count. Either way, I'm still not sure how the output number ends up being so much more, consistently, when buildings, civics and traits are already factored in.

Not asking Walter since he says he's through with this mod now, but if anyone else can help me figure it out I would appreciate it.
 

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Also, can someone help me figure out why there is a consistent 33% discrepancy between the actual cultural output and what the numbers themselves add up to for the Greeks

1. 33% is similar to the effect of compound interest. 100 +10% = 110, 110 +10% = 121, 121 +10% = 134,01%. At the same time, 10% of the effect is, for example, "art". But this is unlikely.
2. Some miracles give a "general imperial" "+" to culture from non-specialized buildings (court, etc.).
3. According to the results - M.B. did you not take into account the effect of just the arts + some other limited buildings?

=I get a volcanic eruption in my capital's BFC literally every 10 turns or so=

Well, from the point of view of realism, this is quite normal. Once every 7 years is the average frequency of eruptions of Klyuchevskaya Sopka (the largest active volcano in Eurasia). But unpleasant, yes.
 
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1. 33% is similar to the effect of compound interest. 100 +10% = 110, 110 +10% = 121, 121 +10% = 134,01%. At the same time, 10% of the effect is, for example, "art". But this is unlikely.
2. Some miracles give a "general imperial" "+" to culture from non-specialized buildings (court, etc.).
3. According to the results - M.B. did you not take into account the effect of just the arts + some other limited buildings?

=I get a volcanic eruption in my capital's BFC literally every 10 turns or so=

Well, from the point of view of realism, this is quite normal. Once every 7 years is the average frequency of eruptions of Klyuchevskaya Sopka (the largest active volcano in Eurasia). But unpleasant, yes.

Thanks for answering.

1. I was under the impression that all base numbers were taken as a whole and summed together, then multiplied once by the sum of all multipliers (each of them being "like terms" which have to be combined before the expression is simplified, in order to come up with the correct calculation)? If you look at other units in the game, like research points and trade wealth, that's how it works. How is culture an exception (or am I simply misunderstanding something)?

2. Sorry, I'm not following you here. By "miracles" are you referring to some kind of triggered random event? All of the flat base culture summed correctly from what was visible.

3. And good point, regarding the art eras, since they apply universally but aren't necessarily built within any city you're looking at. Still though, they are in increments of 10%, and the discrepancy on the calculated total was 33%, for multiple cities I looked at, so it likely should have been a multiple of 10% instead.

It would be a really big deal though if the City Square line was merely discontinued rather than obsoleted by subsequent upgrades, and that does appear to be the case, because even though the nominally obsoleted buildings show "obsolete" in the city screen, their culture modifiers still get factored into the total count.

--

Regarding the eruptions, I sometimes wonder why Kamchatka is so sparsely developed and populated, when it looks so beautiful and is not too far away from one of the most densely populated regions of the world. I had never heard of that volcano (and am honestly surprised that its frequent eruptions don't make any headlines that I've noticed), but maybe that has a lot to do with it. In any case, I'm going to think twice before settling near mountains in-game now.
 
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I'm going to think twice before settling near mountains in-game now.
I have always - at least since I restarted this game with R: - done "my best " to keep away from mountains. Never-the-less, then sometimes the terrain is too good to be "left" alone (bonus, hills, rivers etc. :drool:).

But there is one improvement I never build near any mountains - except by mistakes:shake:, when my "brain" takes a nap :sleep:- and that is the cottage --> town improvement.

I can't explain how big a fool I feel I am , when I see a fully developed town turned into ashe - just because of my :badcomp::deadhorse:
 
Thanks for answering.
:)
How is culture an exception (or am I simply misunderstanding something)?
Well, as I wrote, this is a dubious option. It's just that the result is very close.

By "miracles" are you referring to some kind of triggered random event?

It was just "Russianism", I'm sorry. In Russian, the wonders of the world is a "miracle of the world". In general, I mean the wonders of the world, national wonders/limited buildings and great works. For example, "Along the river" - +1 culture to the court
for multiple cities I looked at, so it likely should have been a multiple of 10% instead.
Yes, that's why I suspect that the cultural effect of some wonders has been superimposed on the effect of the art (30%).

Regarding the eruptions, I sometimes wonder why Kamchatka is so sparsely developed and populated, when it looks so beautiful and is not too far away from one of the most densely populated regions of the world. I had never heard of that volcano (and am honestly surprised that its frequent eruptions don't make any headlines that I've noticed), but maybe that has a lot to do with it. In any case, I'm going to think twice before settling near mountains in-game now.

No, Kamchatka is the size of half of France, Klyuchevskaya Sopka is "violent", but not so much. Simply built in one of the warmest places in Kamchatka, Petropavlovsk-Kamchatsky has an average temperature almost like in Narvik (northern Norway). At the same time , the population of Narvik is 14 thousand , and Petropavlovsk is 164.9 thousand .
That is, looking from Russia, the vacuum in Northern Europe, Canada and Alaska causes amazement. Moscow is slightly warmer than Juneau (average annual temperatures of 7.1 and 6.7 degrees), three million Novosibirsk – climatically in inner Alaska, somewhere near Fairbanks and White Silence (tm) – the average annual temperature is -0.2 and -0.7 degrees, respectively.
 
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I'm experiencing a graphics bug since installing 3.6: all land tiles are black. This also occurred after installing the latest patch. I don't use Steam for running CivIV.
Would be glad if someone could help. Here's a screenshot (OK, most of the black area is unexplored, but you can see what's the issue I reckon). Land tiles are also black on the minimap.
Unbenannt.png
 
Would be glad if someone could help. Here's a screenshot (OK, most of the black area is unexplored, but you can see what's the issue I reckon). Land tiles are also black on the minimap.View attachment 655417
If you have a dedicated graphics card, make sure that Civ is using it. Failing that, try turning down the graphics settings in Civ - I know that sounds ridiculous with such an old game, but it doesn't really make use of modern hardware very well. You can also search this thread; the black textures bug has been discussed quite a lot.
 
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something weird happen, in my game revolts are turn on and on monarch difflucty Poland almost got me, they take all land cities i sign a peace traty with a few island who i still got, global world war started and half of polish teritory surrender to weaker civ (me) and their cities join to my civ. later the same happen with algierian cities. (who didnt declare war on me, they just revolt and AI choose that i should control their cities?)

and now celtia fight with malaysia and almost all malaysian national cities (never conquered by celtia) surrender and join their enemies.Only capitol stay under their control

it looks like russia declare war on ukraine and suddenly whole russia, all major cities join ukraine.
highly improbable and yet it happened.

https://www.sendspace.com/file/x5qzc4

my save 1-2 turn before "lets join to our enemy who kill us" event

this one game is weird as hell, my last game on prince was masterpiece, especially when main Big One (China) literally fall on 6 different countries like yugoslavia 200 turn before end-game timer.

I would like there to be a possibility that if the separatism is too big then the whole country including the capital breaks up into a number of small civs. This would be the end of the game for civilisations who overexpand.
No "capitol is not touched, waste few turn and re-take your cities from hands of barbarians" Whole civ fall = whole civ fall, game over. (I mean this -500 separatism should stay but if all other cities revolt and join new ruler old capitol should join to revolutionists)
Or the option that if one region has a high separatism factor at once it will have a small effect on others (+1 to separatism for each city with positive separatism)

no latest patch in this game - if something.
 
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One more thing: Have you tried with the Shader cache OFF?

Shader_off.jpg
 
Hey guys, this is my first post here, so first and foremost a big thank you to everyone who worked on this fantastic mod! That goes especially to you Walter as I understand it was basically a one man project for the last few years. The amount of depth and finesse you were able to add to an already amazing 17 year old game is astonishing. Civ4 BtS remains the pinnacle of the series for me and this mod just pushes it waaay further up the mountain.

I've joined a while ago at version 3.5 and I'm now playing my first 3.601 game, the Huge World Map scenario (right in at the deep end as always). It seems you're not a big fan of it Walter, but it remains my favorite so I'm glad you kept it. I was able to play a game on 3.57 up until about the 1700's, when I kept getting too many crashes, even with the Project Lasso fix. For this new version I've applied the 64bit 4GB RAM "patch" and have Project Lasso running in the background, we shall see how far I can push it this time, I'm only up to around 500BC right now.

Since you said you are taking an indefinite hiatus from RI development for now Walter, is there anybody else who's picking up the batton? Although it already feels like a very polished product, I'm sure there is always more that can be done. I would offer myself but I'm afraid I have neither the time and more importantly the skills to do so.

Another question: Do people still "meet up" to play this mod online? In all my years of Civ4 gameplay I've only really ever played it as a singleplayer game (except for a few times via LAN with a friend back in the day), might be fun to try it via multiplayer after all these years.
 
@Mus_musculus,

I wish I could help you beyond what others have said, since I had the same problem when I initially installed the mod a little over a year ago. I applied the fix which Walter mentioned above, which mostly fixed it, though it had happened once or twice since then I think. I have no idea what's different now, but I haven't have that issue once probably since about a year now. At the time, one thing that helped (for reasons I can't explain) was simply to reload the same save over and over and over again. Probably one out of twenty reloads would show up correctly, and then the map would appear normal as long as the game remained loaded. I know it's painstaking, but for me it worked occasionally, and, even if it takes 20-30 minutes to get it working, if you plan to sit down and play an all-day session, it might be worth your time.

On the bright side, it does seem that the computer somehow "remembers" the fix and it eventually stops happening so frequently. Unfortunately there's not much more I could suggest, but you might want to give that a try.

I have always - at least since I restarted this game with R: - done "my best " to keep away from mountains. Never-the-less, then sometimes the terrain is too good to be "left" alone (bonus, hills, rivers etc. :drool:).

But there is one improvement I never build near any mountains - except by mistakes:shake:, when my "brain" takes a nap :sleep:- and that is the cottage --> town improvement.

I can't explain how big a fool I feel I am , when I see a fully developed town turned into ashe - just because of my :badcomp::deadhorse:

Yes, that was the biggest disappointment! When the event reel said "Your town was destroyed by a volcanic eruption!" (or some similar words to that effect) I thought "Oh, hopefully just downgraded to a village," but nope! Went the way of Pompeii instead... The only silver lining was that, by the time the town was destroyed, it was about the time when mechanized farms become more profitable anyway, and I had a fluke map in that game where my entire empire had zero fresh water and no way to spread irrigation, so food was at a premium above commerce anyway.

Lesson learned though. :) It would be cool if "volcano" could be a terrain feature only available to mountains, so that the player could know ahead of time whether or not any random mountain had the chance of spawning this event, since it unfortunately appears to be quite frequent and random. Graphically, it could be just a darker coloration or crater around the top. Not all mountains are volcanic, after all, but in the game, it seems they are all potentially so.

:)

Well, as I wrote, this is a dubious option. It's just that the result is very close.

Yeah, it must have been the other modifiers which apply universally and weren't listed in that city specifically (most likely art eras, though in that case, the additional 3% discrepancy is still curious - perhaps an undocumented difficulty modifier?).

It was just "Russianism", I'm sorry. In Russian, the wonders of the world is a "miracle of the world". In general, I mean the wonders of the world, national wonders/limited buildings and great works. For example, "Along the river" - +1 culture to the court

Oh, no problem, but thanks for the clarification. It seems a lot of players here are Russian, interestingly. Idioms are always the most confusing part of language to learn, IME. I'm halfway fluent in German and can read some Latin, but that's the extent of my meaningful foreign language knowledge besides English.

And as it pertains to the game, yes, some of that is probably not directly documented.

Yes, that's why I suspect that the cultural effect of some wonders has been superimposed on the effect of the art (30%).

Sic.
No, Kamchatka is the size of half of France, Klyuchevskaya Sopka is "violent", but not so much. Simply built in one of the warmest places in Kamchatka, Petropavlovsk-Kamchatsky has an average temperature almost like in Narvik (northern Norway). At the same time , the population of Narvik is 14 thousand , and Petropavlovsk is 164.9 thousand .
That is, looking from Russia, the vacuum in Northern Europe, Canada and Alaska causes amazement. Moscow is slightly warmer than Juneau (average annual temperatures of 7.1 and 6.7 degrees), three million Novosibirsk – climatically in inner Alaska, somewhere near Fairbanks and White Silence (tm) – the average annual temperature is 0.2 and -0.7 degrees, respectively.

Fascinating. Maybe that has to do with the habitability afforded by the Sea of Okhotsk? In the Arctic Circle, I doubt (though am completely guessing) that the local fishing is not good enough to sustain any kind of large population when reliable infrastructure out of the region is so weak due to ice and snow, but Kamchatka has an enormous coastline around a massive sea which isn't (by another guess) perennially frozen. Being on an unfrozen coast probably does a lot to sustain a larger population, I would think.

Hey guys, this is my first post here, so first and foremost a big thank you to everyone who worked on this fantastic mod! That goes especially to you Walter as I understand it was basically a one man project for the last few years. The amount of depth and finesse you were able to add to an already amazing 17 year old game is astonishing. Civ4 BtS remains the pinnacle of the series for me and this mod just pushes it waaay further up the mountain.

I've joined a while ago at version 3.5 and I'm now playing my first 3.601 game, the Huge World Map scenario (right in at the deep end as always). It seems you're not a big fan of it Walter, but it remains my favorite so I'm glad you kept it. I was able to play a game on 3.57 up until about the 1700's, when I kept getting too many crashes, even with the Project Lasso fix. For this new version I've applied the 64bit 4GB RAM "patch" and have Project Lasso running in the background, we shall see how far I can push it this time, I'm only up to around 500BC right now.

Since you said you are taking an indefinite hiatus from RI development for now Walter, is there anybody else who's picking up the batton? Although it already feels like a very polished product, I'm sure there is always more that can be done. I would offer myself but I'm afraid I have neither the time and more importantly the skills to do so.

Another question: Do people still "meet up" to play this mod online? In all my years of Civ4 gameplay I've only really ever played it as a singleplayer game (except for a few times via LAN with a friend back in the day), might be fun to try it via multiplayer after all these years.

Yes, when vanilla BtS was already an excellent game, it really is almost too good with RI, isn't it? :)

I recently played through the Europe scenario (and off the top of my head, can't remember if that's larger or smaller than the huge world map, but in any case, it's close) and started to get crashes around late Renaissance. One thing that helped when that happened for me was to reduce the graphics to low. On high graphics, I could barely end my turn without a CtD, but after turning the graphics down, it happened maybe once or twice for the remaining ~10 hours of the game. Did you give that a try?

Also, since we're kind of a small, informal group on this thread, I would be willing to play multiplayer with others ITT if there is any mutual interest. Not sure exactly when that would be possible, but since human interaction makes for much more interesting diplomacy, that would be plenty of fun, I think.
 
One thing that helped when that happened for me was to reduce the graphics to low. On high graphics, I could barely end my turn without a CtD, but after turning the graphics down, it happened maybe once or twice for the remaining ~10 hours of the game. Did you give that a try?
I don't really remember if I did, I think so and it didn't change much. Also it just feels wrong to me to set the graphics settings to "low" on a 17 year old game, just out of principle :nope:;)

Also, since we're kind of a small, informal group on this thread, I would be willing to play multiplayer with others ITT if there is any mutual interest. Not sure exactly when that would be possible, but since human interaction makes for much more interesting diplomacy, that would be plenty of fun, I think.
Excuse my ignorance but I tried looking up the meaning of ITT, I found the acronym used in several Civ forums but never explained. I'm assuming it means some form of "real-time" multiplayer instead of PBEM?
 
ITT = "in this thread"
Well that was a much simpler explanation than expected :lol: But I'm correct in assuming you mean some form of simultaneous online play vs PBEM, right? Because I agree that actually chatting while gaming makes for much more fun diplomacy.

One thing I have noticed while playing, not just this recent version, is the feeling that early recon units rule the battlefield in their time. I'm talking especially about the skirmisher, which you will get fairly early on, and keep on using for quite a while. Whenever I'm attacked during that era, the only real quick and cost efficent defense is a skirmisher spam. Even for offensive actions, so removing any active stacks the AI might have roaming around that could threaten your city attack stack, it's often the number one choice.

One of the reason for that, in my opinion, is that, unless I'm overlooking something here, there is not a single unit that acts as a defense against recon straight out of the bat. Every other unit category has its organic counter - spearman vs charge mounted; heavy infantry vs shock; archers vs range mounted etc. There is nothing like that for recon troops, so without a specialized promotion there is no direct counter to it. The only unit of that era that gets any bonuses vs recon units are the composite archers, but they only get a bonus when attacking recon units. The chances of that actually happening are quite slim though for various reasons (them being usually used as city defenders, having only 1 movement vs the skirmishers 2, etc).

Combining this with their cheap cost, no need for any special resources, and their organic bonuses (+50% attack vs. melee, various terrain bonuses) they seem a bit overpowered for me and sadly almost make some other units obsolete:
  • Charge mounted units to quickly attack and do collateral damage on that nasty stack coming to threaten your lands? One spearman in there and maybe they are even moving through hills/forest - forget about it. It'll likely get killed before it even got a chance to do any damage whatsoever. Coupled with the fact that the usefulness of their ability to flank siege units is greatly reduced due to how siege units work in RI combat: In vanilla CIV4 a weakened catapult would be less effective in attacking your stack of city defenders. In RI however siege units are tagged along for their ability to bring down city walls and for their siege combat aid bonuses. Therefore it doesn't really matter if they are at full health or not. And I don't think I have ever seen a siege unit be outright killed through flanking damage.
  • Range mounted instead? Replace spearman with archer or skirmisher, especially on defensive terrain, and basically everything just mentioned also applies here.
  • Heavy/shock infantry? Quite expensive, slow, and mainly used to defend/attack cities. Will also have a hard time attacking stacks on defensive terrain.
The cheap and lowly skirmisher however will do great attacking against pretty much everyone, especially on favorable terrain, which is pretty much everywhere in this era because forests/jungle are still abundant. And even if you lose a couple they are much faster to reproduce than other units.
Charge/range mounted still have their uses as rebellion crushers, but not so much in actual combat I feel.

In my games I would bet that during this era skirmishers account for 80%+ of all enemy units killed outside of city combat. I'm not really sure if that is really a realistic representation of combat/wars during this time in history, and since this is the Realism Invictus mod after all... ;) When I think of skirmishers I am thinking of light troops harrassing the enemy formations so the heavy infantry/mounted troops have a better chance of defeating an already weakened/disorganized enemy. However I am not thinking about them charging into battle headfirst and straight up dealing the killing blows themselves.

So translated into RI mechanics I think I would suggest a nerf to their strengths, maybe reduce their base strength to 3, drop the 50% bonus against melee units and maybe even their terrain bonuses that they come with. Instead let them give combat aid in the form of extra first strikes and better performance on "their" terrain (forests/jungle/hills).

What do you guys think? Thanks for listening to my TED talk :p
 
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Just to get a few comparisons.
On which maps and with how many players and at what speed do you play? I have always played bts (or base) on a large map with about 11 players. I wanted to avoid huge empires and prefer to manage 5-7 cities. (without new conquests)
But with RI it seems to be too crowded for me.
 
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