Recommend Six Must-read books.

[Chukchi Husky]

If nothing else, you'll learn how to write well. People who don't read good books are as rule terrible at writing. That makes them look stupid even when they aren't.

I guess that was one of the problems I had at school. When I was at school I never did read any fiction except for what I had to read for English, and I ended up doing poorly in English (along with everything, but I guess that was because I am stupid). Even now I still have problems with writing, sometimes taking an hour to try and write a sentence. I only started reading fiction only a couple of years ago, after watching the Lord of the Rings I wanted to know more about the setting and thought the best place to find out was to read the book it was adapted from.

 

[kochman]

You'll learn a lot reading great fiction books. If nothing else, you'll learn how to write well. People who don't read good books are as rule terrible at writing.

No, you will experience a lot from fiction (exception for historical fiction). You will not learn a lot. You do not learn how to write well by reading well written things, you experience good writing.
Your sentence about people who don't read good books are "as a rule" terrible at writing is utter nonsense, and there is no way to support that statement.

 

[luiz]

No, you will experience a lot from fiction (exception for historical fiction). You will not learn a lot. You do not learn how to write well by reading well written things, you experience good writing.
Your sentence about people who don't read good books are "as a rule" terrible at writing is utter nonsense, and there is no way to support that statement.

Uh, how the hell is one supposed to learn to write? It is done by reading. If you read well-written books, there is of course no guarantee you'll become a good writer, but you'll certainly have an advantage.

People who are not exposed to good writing cannot write well. Obviously this doesn't mean one has necessarily to read fiction to write well, as there are many non-fiction books that are excellently written, but fiction is where you'll generally find the best prose.

As a rule, people who don't read good books are terrible at writing. I don't see how that can possibly be described as "utter nonsense" as it is pretty much self-evident.

 

[Antilogic]

...but fiction is where you'll generally find the best prose.

If it wasn't for this comment, I would agree with you.

Check out some of the books I recommended in my earlier post--nonfiction can compete with the best of fiction.

 

[luiz]

I said "generally"!

Excellent writers like Orwell wrote plenty of nonfiction, so clearly there is much literary value there as well. But generally, fiction is where you find the best prose.

 

[Antilogic]

I said "generally"!

Excellent writers like Orwell wrote plenty of nonfiction, so clearly there is much literary value there as well. But generally, fiction is where you find the best prose.

You only said 'generally' the first time, and I still don't agree with that. The only people who claim that are fiction authors and high school teachers trying desperately to get their kids to read some garbage novel like Tess.

To put my charge more simply: the idea the sentence is trying to communicate (fictive or otherwise) is independent of the quality of the sentence.

 

[luiz]

You only said 'generally' the first time, and I still don't agree with that. The only people who claim that are fiction authors and high school teachers trying desperately to get their kids to read some garbage novel like Tess.

To put my charge more simply: the idea the sentence is trying to communicate (fictive or otherwise) is independent of the quality of the sentence.

No, I said generally the two times!

Of course I agree with your charge, I just think that people with great mastery of the language are drawn to literature, generally speaking. Are there superb writers of non-fiction, on par with the greatest fiction writers of all time? Absolutely. But are they as numerous? I don't think so.

To make it simple: who do you consider to be the best writers of all time?

 

[JollyRoger]

Uh, how the hell is one supposed to learn to write?

It is done by writing

 

[Antilogic]

No, I said generally the two times!

Of course I agree with your charge, I just think that people with great mastery of the language are drawn to literature, generally speaking. Are there superb writers of non-fiction, on par with the greatest fiction writers of all time? Absolutely. But are they as numerous? I don't think so.

To make it simple: who do you consider to be the best writers of all time?

I'll go with the man I recommended earlier in this thread: David McCullough. His writing is superb.

 

[kochman]

Uh, how the hell is one supposed to learn to write? It is done by reading. If you read well-written books, there is of course no guarantee you'll become a good writer, but you'll certainly have an advantage.

People who are not exposed to good writing cannot write well. Obviously this doesn't mean one has necessarily to read fiction to write well, as there are many non-fiction books that are excellently written, but fiction is where you'll generally find the best prose.

As a rule, people who don't read good books are terrible at writing. I don't see how that can possibly be described as "utter nonsense" as it is pretty much self-evident.

This is utter nonsense because you are making an absolute statement about billions of people through history.
Tell me how many good fiction books does one have to read before they can be creative?

 

[Antilogic]

Tell me how many good fiction books does one have to read before they can be creative?

I don't think that's what he is saying...

 

[Hygro]

You'll learn a lot reading great fiction books. If nothing else, you'll learn how to write well. People who don't read good books are as rule terrible at writing. That makes them look stupid even when they aren't. Many of my engineer colleagues suffer from this. The OP was probably looking for non-fiction tips, but he'll be a better person if he reads some good fiction as well.

@Hygro: if you don't think many fiction books are "must-read", you probably haven't read very good books. My opinion is the opposite of yours: you can learn anything you need that is on non-fiction books from secondary sources, internet articles, etc. There is no secondary source for the experience that is reading "Crime and Punishment".

No, I just have a different definition of "must read" when talking about other people. There's nothing in fiction that has guaranteed universal impact on everyone. Fiction tells a story and its up to us to get a takeaway. For example, I spent a long time dwelling on all the implications of A Deepness in the Sky. It affected me a lot--a lot more than most any impressive non-fiction. But the common denominator is lacking for the impact of a lot of books so I don't recommend them as universally must read.

 

[MantaRevan]

Guys, guys, this thread is intended for people sharing their interests, not a spam war about fiction and nonfiction. Let's get back on topic here.

 

[Birdjaguar]

Uh, how the hell is one supposed to learn to write?

It is done by writing

JR is correct. The more you write and have it edited, the better writer you will be. Reading good books will add substantially to your vocabulary which will improve to your writing.

 

[Hygro]

Guys, guys, this thread is intended for people sharing their interests, not a spam war about fiction and nonfiction. Let's get back on topic here.

I didn't realize that writing out my opinion on the matter constituted "spam". I'll keep that in mind next time I respond to one of your threads.

 

[luiz]

No, I just have a different definition of "must read" when talking about other people. There's nothing in fiction that has guaranteed universal impact on everyone. Fiction tells a story and its up to us to get a takeaway. For example, I spent a long time dwelling on all the implications of A Deepness in the Sky. It affected me a lot--a lot more than most any impressive non-fiction. But the common denominator is lacking for the impact of a lot of books so I don't recommend them as universally must read.

I strongly disagree with this relativistic notion. I think several books have universal appeal and everyone should read them, given the opportunity.

JR is correct. The more you write and have it edited, the better writer you will be. Reading good books will add substantially to your vocabulary which will improve to your writing.

He is not. If you don't read, no matter how much you practice your writing it will be very poor.

Vocabulary is the least important thing you pick up from reading good books. You can get a good vocabulary by reading the dictionary, but that won't teach you to write. The good books tell you how to write stylishly, how to use effectively the different figures of speech , etc. Take Hemingway, for instance. The vocabulary used in his books was very simple, but you can learn a lot about how to write well by reading them.

 

[MantaRevan]

I didn't realize that writing out my opinion on the matter constituted "spam". I'll keep that in mind next time I respond to one of your threads.

I wasn't trying to insult you or what you have to say, I just think that it is off of the topic of the thread.

 

[Ayatollah So]

David Hume,, Dialogues Concerning Natural Religion

- Persepolis - Marjanne Satrapi

A Deepness in the Sky by Vernor Vinge

Small Gods- Terry Pratchett

You'll learn a lot reading great fiction books.

Fiction tells a story and its up to us to get a takeaway. For example, I spent a long time dwelling on all the implications of A Deepness in the Sky. It affected me a lot--a lot more than most any impressive non-fiction.

Seconded.

Adding (but these, along with Small Gods, are just for fun):

• Attack of the Deranged Mutant Killer Monster Snow Goons (Calvin & Hobbes) by Bill Watterson
  
• A Song of Ice and Fire (series) by George R. R. Martin.

 

[MantaRevan]

Seconded.

Adding (but these, along with Small Gods, are just for fun):

• Attack of the Deranged Mutant Killer Monster Snow Goons (Calvin & Hobbes) by Bill Watterson
  
• A Song of Ice and Fire (series) by George R. R. Martin.

If you like Small Gods, you should head over to my "any Terry Pratchett fans out there?" thread.

 

[Me,myself,and,I]

The Art Of War-Sun Tzu. (duh!)
Atlas Shrugged-Ayn Rand. This revamped much of my political thought (started it really)
DANGIT! That One Book on the Nazis-Grrr! I can't believe I can't remember the author or the title, but it taught me a lot about why and how the Nazis rose to power.
Two Treatises On Government-John Locke. His work is all over the Declaration for a reason. From Locke I derive many of my ideas of human rights. (How do you like them apples Rousseau?)
Grand Strategy Of The Roman Empire-Don't remember, been a while. I got a great deal out of this book.
Meditations-Marcus "Ben Kenobi" Aurelius. I like Stoics.

I would like to put the Republic on here, but, well I hated most of it's ideas.