RFC: BtS Bug Reports

[blizzrd]

Wow. If this has been the cause of terrible foreign stability (for certain civs in particular), and this can now be fixed, this would have a significant effect. Great work!

 

[onedreamer]

great Sedna !!! Heh, I knew it must had been a bug !

 

[onedreamer]

Well, it's not the same. Game must be self consistent, after choosing the level of approximation to historical reality. See, Rhye made it so that horse will not appear in Americas until Europeans. Now one needs to be consistent with this choice. You can't research HR because you never seen horse. Now Gunpowder is a different story.The mining of Chile saltpeter was such a profitable business that three nations, Chile, Peru, and Bolivia fought over the richest deposits in the War of the Pacific. The world's largest natural deposits of caliche ore were in the Atacama desert of Chile. Inca COULD have been researched the gunpowder and Mayans COULD have been strong established nation by the time Aztecs spawn. But there were no Kangaroos in Britain and no horses in Americas. So if Rhye specifically banned horse from the New World American civs should not research it, IMHO.

a) Incas rided Llamas.
b) you are technically mistaken because that's not how the game (Civ4) works. If I research bronze working but don't find any bronze or cannot trade for it, according to your reasoning I cannot research metal casting, so I am pretty much stuck to bronze age. Horseback riding isn't that harsh since I don't think it is a prereq. for advancing the tech tree, still the reasoning behind it is flawed so I don't think it's worth implementing it.

 

[Walliard]

Think of it this way: If a civ without access to horses researches HBR, they get no benefit from it. They can build stables, but they're useless without the ability to produce mounted units. So from a practical standpoint, it's as if they never researched it at all.

 

[AnotherPacifist]

a) Incas rided Llamas.

This page suggests that llamas can be ridden but they are not supposed to be. In fact during my trip to Peru I never saw anybody (small or big in body size) ride llamas, but they carried a lot of stuff on their backs.

http://www.wikihow.com/Ride-a-Llama

 

[onedreamer]

only notable ppl would ride them AFAIK, not just anyone, and it was in the past... they didn't have proper cavalry if you get what I mean, but it was rather a status symbol like among the Celts. But I must say that I'm really not competent in the matter, so I might be reporting wrong stuff, and I have no sources at hands.

 

[Tigranes]

Onedreamer, my post was more than 1 month old, why did you suddenly remember it? I am already fine with this aspect of the game. Simply when Spaniard arrived they were considered as gods because they were different.
They had white skin, they carried firearms, they had strange animals, the horses and Incas even thought the horse and the Spaniards were just one being who had the ability to divide in two. How else could 120 men conquer an Empire of 12 million? So not only the horse was strange, riding on the back of the animal was very strange too.

Let's talk about something even more weird. Incas have built great temples but they didn't even come up with the idea about the Wheel! BTW, why do they start with the Wheel in RFC ? They had paved roads (long roads, just like Romans) but alas in the real world one does not have to know about the wheel to build roads. In Civ 4 they finally arranged Writing BEFORE the Alphabet, maybe in Civ 5 one would build roads without the Wheel

 

[blizzrd]

There is a bug in RiseAndFall.py in hitNeighboursStability. On a civ spawn, instead of looping through the pre-defined list for which existing civs should take a stability hit (this list is n elements long), the stability hit is applied to first n civs as ranked by ID. This hit is applied to "Foreign" stability. This explains why Egypt (ID = 0) has such bad foreign stability, as most civs have at least one neighbor defined in lOlderNeighbors and thus actually hit Egypt upon birth. See my suggested fixed line (in red):

def hitNeighboursStability( self, iCiv ):
                if (len(con.lOlderNeighbours[iCiv])):
                        bHuman = False
                        for iLoop in range(len(con.lOlderNeighbours[iCiv])):[COLOR="Red"]
                        for iLoop in con.lOlderNeighbours[iCiv]:[/COLOR]
                                if (gc.getPlayer(iLoop).isAlive()):
                                        if (iLoop == utils.getHumanID()):
                                                bHuman = True                                        
                                        utils.setStability(iLoop, utils.getStability(iLoop)-2)

I really hope Rhye sees this post.

 

[onedreamer]

Yeah I tried a new game to test this fix: I got to 1950 (and running, 5th on scoreboard) with Egypt without a single Golden Age, at the first try. This has never been possible before ^^

 

[Ornen]

For some reason ever since I started playing the version bundled with BTS, dynamic civ names don't show up anywhere. Is there a certain way to enable them?

 

[ZachScape]

sure you can. In Screens\CvMainInterface.py, replace around line 2990 the occurances of getCivilizationShortDescription(0) with getCivilizationDescription(0)

FYI, I've put all the interesting info about this feature in this page:

http://rhye.civfanatics.net/wiki/index.php?title=Rhye's_and_Fall_of_Civilization_dynamic_names

Here, hopefully this helps.

 

[Tigranes]

Egypt, 2nd UHV: would not register failure

Is it only me, guys? I don't even have Literature, it's past Turn 134, F8 shows "Not yet", interface shows white 1/3, on turn 136 the Great Library was build by someone else -- and still it shows "Not yet" and white 1/3...

 

[Walliard]

Wonder-based UHVs only check when you build the wonders in question in order to save on processor time, so if you never build them, they stay as "Not yet".

 

[onedreamer]

nope, it does show.

 

[Virdrago]

@Tigranes: I think you will be greyed out after you learn Literature. Then the UHV may do the check. It could be like the Babylonian UHV, where you don't know you've lost until the three techs have already been researched.

 

[kretes]

I was playing as the U.S. (with France as a vassal) and had signed defensive pacts with the greatest military powers: Britain and Spain (Spain's vassals: Mali, Netherlands and Portugal). What happens when Spain invades France? Every one of the seven listed nations are at each others' throats (with the exception of France and America thankfully).

Spoiler :

What's even more confusing is the fact that Spain's vassals declare war on me faster than Spain which causes Mali and the Netherlands to declare their independence for some reason and Spain to declare war on all three of its vassals (due to the US-Spanish DP). Portugal, being the butt monkey of this game, forgets to declare itself independent and soon it is at war with Spain and Spain's vassal at the same time.

Spoiler :

I love situations like this.

 

[onedreamer]

exactly, it's not a bug. All intended to make the AI go to war.

 

[kretes]

Well yeah, the only real bug is having Portugal being at war with its own master. Still, amusing as they are, situations where the DP participants declare war on themselves aren't exactly natural. I doubt Spain in my game intended to lose all its vassals and engage in a war with its own allies by attacking my vassal. A human player would know better than to attack its ally's vassal, so I'm geussing that simply lowering the chance of an AI declaring war on an ally's vassal to zero (or almost zero) would fix the otherwise really cool system of fixed alliances.

 

[onedreamer]

Actually the AI does do such stupid acts in the late game even in unmodded BtS.
Also, vassals declaring war to their master isn't that ahistorical.

 

[Lone Wolf]

Also, vassals declaring war to their master isn't that ahistorical.

Sure, but in such case the declarer should stop being a vassal.