ibcoltscrew
Prince
Don't be mad Rhye.Rhye said:
Rhye's of Civilization - the fastest loading mod Expanded
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I've posted the guide to Incans.
Ottomans soon.
Ottomans soon.
Thanks Tyrion. We discussed this thing long ago. The natural setting for guerrilla is of course "not wheeled". The problem was that this was pointless, as none of the weaker civs ever built them.
It was coming too late. In fact there was a huge gap between Med.Inf. and guerrilla.
Some months later I released a patch which enphatized the use of Flintlock Infantry: they are part of the chain spearman-to-infantry, while riflemen are out, and instead are in med-inf-to-guerrilla-tow.inf.
That's because riflemen were historically a cheaper kind of army, without regular training. This way, the flintlock (upgrading to nothing) problem was solved, and there was something added in the middle of the path.
Right now, the situation of the cheaper units chain is:
med.inf. (iron) -> rifleman -> guerrilla (bombard) -> tow.inf. (bombard)
You see that now the main problem (inheritated from Firaxis) is that med.inf. requires iron: a civ that hasn't access to iron, will build spearmen.
So, if we want to go further in historical realism combined with balancing, not only guerrilla but the whole line needs a re-thinking.
about med.inf. I propose 2 solutions (as usual, I'll change only if I get enough people agreeing):
- substituting med.inf. with another unit (and another animation, a soldier without an iron plate): I could call it med.inf again, or man-at-arms, and it doesn't require iron.
Its natural setting would be 3/3/1 but I fear that it would be unbalancing. This is however, the cheaper unit weak civs need.
- substituting med.inf. with the same animation, same stats, but renamed Mercenary, without the need of iron, and very low cost, and high upkeep. In the late meddle ages the "Cavalieri di ventura" were very famous across all Europe: mercenaries who fought wars often switching side (depending on who was paying best).
after all, if you read Civilopedia you'll find that Firaxis had no clue of what kind of unit it was:
"Troops who fight on foot, even though transported to the battlefield by horses, ships, aircraft, tanks and other
motorized vehicles, skis, or other means are classified as Infantry. This term applies equally to troops armed
with weapons such as the spear, sword, and mace in ancient and medieval times. As with most foot-soldiers, the
objective of the Medieval Infantry was to seize and hold territory, often in an attempt to occupy enemy territory.
Despite the temporary dominance of cavalry in the feudal and middle ages, infantry has been the largest single
element in Western armies since ancient times."
After that, I agree with the not wheeled guerrilla.
It was coming too late. In fact there was a huge gap between Med.Inf. and guerrilla.
Some months later I released a patch which enphatized the use of Flintlock Infantry: they are part of the chain spearman-to-infantry, while riflemen are out, and instead are in med-inf-to-guerrilla-tow.inf.
That's because riflemen were historically a cheaper kind of army, without regular training. This way, the flintlock (upgrading to nothing) problem was solved, and there was something added in the middle of the path.
Right now, the situation of the cheaper units chain is:
med.inf. (iron) -> rifleman -> guerrilla (bombard) -> tow.inf. (bombard)
You see that now the main problem (inheritated from Firaxis) is that med.inf. requires iron: a civ that hasn't access to iron, will build spearmen.
So, if we want to go further in historical realism combined with balancing, not only guerrilla but the whole line needs a re-thinking.
about med.inf. I propose 2 solutions (as usual, I'll change only if I get enough people agreeing):
- substituting med.inf. with another unit (and another animation, a soldier without an iron plate): I could call it med.inf again, or man-at-arms, and it doesn't require iron.
Its natural setting would be 3/3/1 but I fear that it would be unbalancing. This is however, the cheaper unit weak civs need.
- substituting med.inf. with the same animation, same stats, but renamed Mercenary, without the need of iron, and very low cost, and high upkeep. In the late meddle ages the "Cavalieri di ventura" were very famous across all Europe: mercenaries who fought wars often switching side (depending on who was paying best).
after all, if you read Civilopedia you'll find that Firaxis had no clue of what kind of unit it was:
"Troops who fight on foot, even though transported to the battlefield by horses, ships, aircraft, tanks and other
motorized vehicles, skis, or other means are classified as Infantry. This term applies equally to troops armed
with weapons such as the spear, sword, and mace in ancient and medieval times. As with most foot-soldiers, the
objective of the Medieval Infantry was to seize and hold territory, often in an attempt to occupy enemy territory.
Despite the temporary dominance of cavalry in the feudal and middle ages, infantry has been the largest single
element in Western armies since ancient times."
After that, I agree with the not wheeled guerrilla.
Blasphemous
Graulich
What would be unbalancing about a Man-at-Arms (best name for it) with 3/3/1 that's the same as Med Inf except it doesn't require Iron? That fits the anicent-to-early-medieval stat/cost scheme perfectly...
That sounds like a good idea if you ask me.
I think Med Inf should stay as it is just be in a different line (perhaps Med Inf > Berserk > Marine?). As far as I know there's no way to make one unit have a different upkeep than the rest, so the option of a low costm high-upkeep unit does not exist.
That sounds like a good idea if you ask me.
I think Med Inf should stay as it is just be in a different line (perhaps Med Inf > Berserk > Marine?). As far as I know there's no way to make one unit have a different upkeep than the rest, so the option of a low costm high-upkeep unit does not exist.
oh, you're right, it can't be changed only for one unit.
I was meaning, I fear unbalancing because some players used to attack with med.inf. would be forced to use knights or weaker man-at-arms. I would delete med.inf: there are 3 lines: defensive foot units, offensive mounted units and cheaper units. It's a substitution: no iron for them, but weaker.
I was meaning, I fear unbalancing because some players used to attack with med.inf. would be forced to use knights or weaker man-at-arms. I would delete med.inf: there are 3 lines: defensive foot units, offensive mounted units and cheaper units. It's a substitution: no iron for them, but weaker.
Blasphemous
Graulich
But there is another, under-appreciated line of slow units designed exclusively for attack: The Berserk and Marine.
Just like you would never build one of those two for defense, you would never build Med Inf for defense.
And anyway, what about Swordsmen? What line are they in currently?
Just like you would never build one of those two for defense, you would never build Med Inf for defense.
And anyway, what about Swordsmen? What line are they in currently?
Jean_ni
Chieftain
Well Well,
To add my grain of salt, I say you should leave Med Inf as it is. When I do not have Iron, I wait for another tech that will permit me to build something else or I trade for it.
It's what I think and it's worth wath it's worth.
To add my grain of salt, I say you should leave Med Inf as it is. When I do not have Iron, I wait for another tech that will permit me to build something else or I trade for it.
It's what I think and it's worth wath it's worth.
oh well, that's true, I forgot to see what's behind. There's the swordsman. It's upgrading to med.inf.
OK, nothing 's done. And the guerrilla? Will removing the wheeled flag have some collateral effects?
OK, nothing 's done. And the guerrilla? Will removing the wheeled flag have some collateral effects?
I'll leave everthing as it is now. There would be too much to change (remember the archers/spearmen attack/defense swap?) if I want to keep things both balanced and realistic. And this goes too far with the purpose of this mod.
Replacing the whole unit system (including the double UU, remember?), will only be an optional expansion pack. Maybe, one day.
Replacing the whole unit system (including the double UU, remember?), will only be an optional expansion pack. Maybe, one day.
Well i played some more and saw that paratroopers could walk on jungle and mountains well it said so in the civlopedia and that makes sense so i cant see why really you could just change the guerrillas. Maybe swap them around or remove the bombard skill. Just my opinion.
There are big suprises coming. I won't say any detail for now, but something is moving 
In the meantime, I'd like to play that succession game and complete the strategy page with your help.
In the meantime, I'd like to play that succession game and complete the strategy page with your help.
oops copy&paste mistake
copy&paste mistake
I need a grammar check to this before posting it.
What's the strength of the Ottomans? 3 out of 5?
What's the strength of the Ottomans? 3 out of 5?
SmiteMeister
Chieftain
- Joined
- Jun 28, 2004
- Messages
- 14
I've been played Rhye's Random scenario with some friends a lot this summer, and its been great fun.
But Oy! i got pissed when i saw that but the hanging gardens and the two cathedral wonders all have wine as a prerequisite!
And there are several other wonder prerequisite issues along the same line, incense f.ex.
it works great on the real world map, but not on the random map.
I've changed it myself, but every time a new Rhye version is uploaded, I have to make the same changes again and again, and sometimes i forget something making us moan
(and one of us smirk 
) after sevreal hours of playtime.
pleeeeease restore wonder prerequisites on the downloadable file
But Oy! i got pissed when i saw that but the hanging gardens and the two cathedral wonders all have wine as a prerequisite!
And there are several other wonder prerequisite issues along the same line, incense f.ex.
it works great on the real world map, but not on the random map.
I've changed it myself, but every time a new Rhye version is uploaded, I have to make the same changes again and again, and sometimes i forget something making us moan
(and one of us smirk ) after sevreal hours of playtime.pleeeeease restore wonder prerequisites on the downloadable file
Hello and thank you.
...I did never think of the prerequisites. You're right, it surely needs to br restored as it was. How it is, it's nonsense.
Now I'm going out, I'll post the updated version tonight.
By the way, 4 people downlaoded the txt, but anybody posting the corrected grammar version?
...I did never think of the prerequisites. You're right, it surely needs to br restored as it was. How it is, it's nonsense.
Now I'm going out, I'll post the updated version tonight.
By the way, 4 people downlaoded the txt, but anybody posting the corrected grammar version?
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