[R&F] Rise and Fall General Discussion Thread

[Uberfrog]

Civ V's Shaka theme was great, but we can move away from being 100% Shaka: The Civ with Mbube, by Solomon Linda, the Zulu singer who inspired The Lion Sleeps Tonight...

Spoiler :

 

[Zaarin]

"Ugh, Shaka," is what I tend to think, too.

 

[SammyKhalifa]

Are you really sure that we will be able to have a deep dive in the Emergencies in one livestream?
First, how could it be possible to see different emergencies unless they show several games (which I highly doubts).
And we won't be able to see emergencies from the two point of view (triggered or triggering).
As I saw it, an Emergencies has a beginning, a middle and an end.
We can't see the beginning and the end in the same livestream, because it would be too long.
And I'm a little concerned that we will be able to really see how AI behave during an emergency during the short time of a livstream.
SO, either we will be disappointed because they won't show a lot, or we will take a great look in the Civilopedia in order to see what kind of emergencies exists, how are they triggered and what kind of bonuses we can have (but I also doubt that emergencies info will be in the Civilopedia).



Yeah... 22 days...

You can get a solid sense of how it works without having to know all of the details about every different emergency. I don't know, would rather be a little suprised when I first play or there's no point . . .

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

How about "I Just Can't Wait to Be King" or "Can You Feel the Love Tonight"?

Some Shaka love as he Zerg-rushes your capital on turn 50. Seems fitting.

"I Just Can't Wait to Be King" can burn, though.


On topic: if we are still in doubt about Shaka’s inclusion with the civ, then which other so far theorized civ could be a contender for the remaining Unique District? Ikandha seems to fit too well.

You forgot "Hakuna Matata." Of course it's in Swahili, but so is the name of Kongo's UU. No worries for the rest of your days with Shaka of the Zulu. And yes he would most likely get the Ikandha as the Unique Encampment.

May I suggest something like this:-

The first one sounds good for an earlier Ancient or Classical Theme. I don't have to have vocals, but the new themes from the Cree and Georgia are really good with them.

 

[SammyKhalifa]

"Ugh, Shaka," is what I tend to think, too.

I can't stop this feeling!

 

[Phoenix1595]

I'm sure those reasons have nothing to do with the Civilopedia. Of course, there's nothing left to spoil now...

Yes, there is-- they still haven't disclosed where on earth the red forest is from! I honestly will probably have to shell out the $30US just for that one little piece of info they haven't leaked yet.

 

[Siptah]

Some ideas for the new civs. I'm not really happy, but couldn't come up with better ones.


Scotland

Civ ability: Theatre Square and all its buildings produce +1 GP point. GWoA radiate loyalty.

Unique improvement: Distillery. +1 food, +1 culture. +2 gold at some point. +1 amenity to all cities within 6 tile range for each adjacent wheat/rice/sugar/orange.

Unique unit: Schiltron. Replaces the Pikeman. +10 combat strength when defending against any attacker, -5 when attacking.

Leader: Uilliam Uallas

Leader ability: Additional combat strength bonus from terrain/rivers. Unit strength increases when HP is below 25.

Leader agenda: Dislikes civ that lead multiple wars at the same time.


Mapuche

Civ ability: Other civs gain tourists of your civ half as fast. Ability is ignored when the other civ has the globalization civic researched.

Unique improvement: Chemamüll. +1 faith and +1 culture. Radiates a bit of loyalty.

Unique unit: Mapuche Horseman. Replaces Cavalry. When HP reaches 0, the units doesn’t die, but gets 1 HP and extra movement next turn. Of course, if attacked again in the same turn, it will die.

Leader: Lautaro

Leader ability: +10 combat strength in his own territory when DoW’d. Mounted units get a bonus against cities.

Leader agenda: does not like civilizations that settle cities far away from their capital (without cities in between).


Zulu

Civ ability: conquered cities are immediately yours, without drops in loyalty, population etc.

Unique district: Amakhanda. Replaces Encampment. All units are built faster.

Unique unit: Impi *yawn* replaces Spearman. Additional support bonus from nearby Impi units. Each adjacent unit reduces CS of enemy units by 5. Negates the bonus CS that melee units would have against it.

Leader: Shaka *yawn*

Leader ability: Melee units are able to capture other melee units.

Leader agenda: dislikes civs that do not upgrade their units

 

[SammyKhalifa]

I think that assuming they exist, Scotland should have some kind of science buff.

 

[ferretbacon]

Yes, there is-- they still haven't disclosed where on earth the red forest is from! I honestly will probably have to shell out the $30US just for that one little piece of info they haven't leaked yet.

That and the last natural wonder. I guess some think it's that red mountain seen in a stream, but I'm not sure.

I think that assuming they exist, Scotland should have some kind of science buff.

I would like this, but I think it boils down to this: are we getting Scotland or are we getting Celtic Scotland?

 

[Disgustipated]

Are you really sure that we will be able to have a deep dive in the Emergencies in one livestream?
First, how could it be possible to see different emergencies unless they show several games (which I highly doubts).

during the last live stream they loaded a save to show a different aspect of the civ they were featuring. So yes, you can load save games in Civ6. They pre plan these games out to get to where they want to be to show us what they want to show. Though I'm not sure how they are going to get the emergencies to initiate unless they initiate them themselves by conquering holy city/city-states etc. You certainly can't rely on the AI to do those things.

 

[Uberfrog]

I would like this, but I think it boils down to this: are we getting Scotland or are we getting Celtic Scotland?

In a game with Gandhi's fearsome Varus and Hojo Tokimune churning out electronics, I don't see why they can't have a medieval leader with some aspect of the Enlightenment thrown in as well.

 

[WillowBrook]

Are you really sure that we will be able to have a deep dive in the Emergencies in one livestream?
First, how could it be possible to see different emergencies unless they show several games (which I highly doubts).
And we won't be able to see emergencies from the two point of view (triggered or triggering).
As I saw it, an Emergencies has a beginning, a middle and an end.
We can't see the beginning and the end in the same livestream, because it would be too long.

We likely will not get all the info we want. But they often load two different saves in a livestream, so showing one where an emergency is triggered and one where a different sort of emergency is resolved is quite plausible.

 

[ferretbacon]

In a game with Gandhi's fearsome Varus and Hojo Tokimune churning out electronics, I don't see why they can't have a medieval leader with some aspect of the Enlightenment thrown in as well.

True, they may interpret Scotland broadly and give nods to a range of eras. Medieval leader and LUA, Enlightenment CUA, ancient UI, etc.

 

[Kimiimaro]

Are you really sure that we will be able to have a deep dive in the Emergencies in one livestream?
First, how could it be possible to see different emergencies unless they show several games (which I highly doubts).
And we won't be able to see emergencies from the two point of view (triggered or triggering).
As I saw it, an Emergencies has a beginning, a middle and an end.
We can't see the beginning and the end in the same livestream, because it would be too long.
And I'm a little concerned that we will be able to really see how AI behave during an emergency during the short time of a livstream.
SO, either we will be disappointed because they won't show a lot, or we will take a great look in the Civilopedia in order to see what kind of emergencies exists, how are they triggered and what kind of bonuses we can have (but I also doubt that emergencies info will be in the Civilopedia).

I don't know for you, but I feel that this is the week of disappointment.
First, no FL and, to replace it, a Full Details which little details (just one tny face to speculate... meh).
Second, deduction of Zulu, Scotland and Mapuches. Without Inca, Italy, Mali or Ottomans. Well, I must say it's really not the end of revelation I was waiting for (I'm still hoping that this reveals are wrong). Don't take me wrong : Mapuches can be amazing (even I would have preferred the Kingdom of Araucania and Patagonia, but, it's not quite exactly a real country, so...), and Scotland is really a wonderful possibility. But... Mapuche over Incas, when we have not yet our mountain-lover road-builder knot-reader gold-digger civ? Incas are not only a staple or a niche civ: they have really a unique possible gameplay that cannot be taken by any other civ (unlike Georgia which can be, in terms of GP, close to Poland). And for Scotland, well, they are truly great, but it's another medieval-warmongering-loyal-kindofreligious civ. I don't know which abilities they will gave us, but I'm sure that it could be for another civilization as well. And Scotland with England on the same game when Italy or Ottomans or Finland or Portugal are absent is really annoying, I think (who on Earth think placing Scotland before Italy is a naturel thing? Who?).
And for the Zulus, well... It's what really put the nail to the coffin.

Yeah... 22 days...

*Cough* *Cough* save files *Cough* *Cough*

They did it with Chandragupta, they did it with Genghis Khan & Wilhelmina. They can do it with Tamar.

Edit: Ninja'd by @WillowBrook.

 

[Phrozen]

Siptah: You forgot the peat. The Distillery needs peat to make a proper Scotch. Marshes are a must!

 

[Arianrhod]

Don't be so eager to get rid of William Wallace.

I know nobody wants a non-leader leader, including myself, but he's also probably the strongest case we have for the Scots over the Celts. If Willy's a great person, then the only actual evidence we have for Scotland is the Scottish architecture, which isn't enough to rule out a V-level Celtic Cataclysm that just has Scottish architecture because Edinburgh is the capital. While I'd ultimately prefer another leader, I'd still rather have the Scots led by William Wallace than anything resembling what the Celts were last time.

 

[Quis]

Don't be so eager to get rid of William Wallace.

I know nobody wants a non-leader leader, including myself, but he's also probably the strongest case we have for the Scots over the Celts. If Willy's a great person, then the only actual evidence we have for Scotland is the Scottish architecture, which isn't enough to rule out a V-level Celtic Cataclysm that just has Scottish architecture because Edinburgh is the capital. While I'd ultimately prefer another leader, I'd still rather have the Scots led by William Wallace than anything resembling what the Celts were last time.

Yes I agree, and we should not condemn him until we have seen him and his abilities.

 

[ferretbacon]

Don't be so eager to get rid of William Wallace.

I know nobody wants a non-leader leader, including myself, but he's also probably the strongest case we have for the Scots over the Celts. If Willy's a great person, then the only actual evidence we have for Scotland is the Scottish architecture, which isn't enough to rule out a V-level Celtic Cataclysm that just has Scottish architecture because Edinburgh is the capital. While I'd ultimately prefer another leader, I'd still rather have the Scots led by William Wallace than anything resembling what the Celts were last time.

Also, to be fair to Wallace, he was for a time de facto leader of Scotland when he was Guardian of Scotland.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

Don't be so eager to get rid of William Wallace.

I know nobody wants a non-leader leader, including myself, but he's also probably the strongest case we have for the Scots over the Celts. If Willy's a great person, then the only actual evidence we have for Scotland is the Scottish architecture, which isn't enough to rule out a V-level Celtic Cataclysm that just has Scottish architecture because Edinburgh is the capital. While I'd ultimately prefer another leader, I'd still rather have the Scots led by William Wallace than anything resembling what the Celts were last time.

I don't have anything against the portrayal of the Civ itself, but William Wallace would work better as a Great General. At least make the leader Robert the Bruce, an actual king of Scotland, and he would still probably have the same agenda and ability that William Wallace would.

 

[Thormodr]

It’s rather sad. People clamour for more of Africa to be represented in the game.

People wail on about how Carthage is not part of Africa or how they are European.

The Zulus are possibly in the game?

Oh, we don’t want them!

Nonsense...

I would be very happy to see the Zulus. They represent an unrepresented area. They’ll provide competition for Kongo on TSL maps. They’ll be fun to fend off as they’ll be sure to be Uber aggressive.

Plus, they will be sure to have awesome music.