[R&F] Rise and Fall General Discussion Thread

[Jkchart]

Is this right? I just had Japan, a level 3 Research alliance declare war on me as a result of a betrayal emergency against me. I had declared war on England once my level 3 cultural alliance with her lapsed triggering the betrayal emergency. I also had Genghis Khan declare war on me who was in a declaration of friendship with me. Germany was already at war with me because of his alliance with Victoria.

Not a huge deal as I plan on conquering every city in the world anyways, but I was trying to play the diplomatic game to avoid fighting too many people at once, and trying to keep some alliances going as long as possible for this reason. It's why I renewed my alliance with Japan just a few turns prior. I don't actually have any units on my border with Japan as I hadn't expected this.

Yes, you can be attacked by anyone in a betrayal emergency, even your own allies. You’re kind of the scum of the earth if you do that according to the game design

 

[Disgustipated]

Betrayal Emergencies can also be accepted by your allies. After all, you've proven to not be a trustworthy ally yourself.

Makes sense. Good to know. I just wasn't sure. Because I've noticed in my peaceful games, I almost never get the option to participate in emergencies because I'm usually allied with most people or declaration of friendship. I never noticed Betrayal emergency was different.

Yes, you can be attacked by anyone in a betrayal emergency, even your own allies. You’re kind of the scum of the earth if you do that according to the game design

Well I suppose I am scum, hehe. But England had it coming, call it Napolean's revenge (I am playing as France).


I also noticed the Sean Bean no longer narrates quotes bug is back, but it only came very late game after about 5 or so future civics and techs. I believe this is a bug and not intended since it's making that weird hissing sound it used to make when the bug appeared last summer.

But the good thing is the sound bug with the music cutting out hasn't happened. I'm running a large map all civs which is a lot for my 9 year old CPU and RAM, and so far so good on the music and sound effects. *knocks on wood* This is the longest game I've ever had, I'm around turn 600 now on epic speed.

 

[agonistes]

Well, here's a connection I didn't expect - loyalty is making it more likely I'm going to have aquaducts in any given game.

edit: I mean, I'm going to build them, not just land grab them.

 

[Bosque]

I have played R&F enough that I have gotten every Achievement except one: Join a Betrayal Emergency.

Until I read the posts on this page, I wasn't sure that Betrayal Emergencies could actually happen. So how do I go about increasing my chances for seeing one?

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

I have played R&F enough that I have gotten every Achievement except one: Join a Betrayal Emergency.

Until I read the posts on this page, I wasn't sure that Betrayal Emergencies could actually happen. So how do I go about increasing my chances for seeing one?

In my experience: Form an tier 2 alliance with Wilhelmina then stop trading with her (for me this was due to trade routes getting pillaged in a different war).

 

[WillowBrook]

I have played R&F enough that I have gotten every Achievement except one: Join a Betrayal Emergency.

Until I read the posts on this page, I wasn't sure that Betrayal Emergencies could actually happen. So how do I go about increasing my chances for seeing one?

I've been betrayed by Gitarja in two different games. The more alliances you have but then don't renew, the greater chance of being betrayed.

 

[Disgustipated]

Or just initiate it yourself as I have done. May take a couple of tries, since there's no guarantee that an emergency will trigger. Though I think they should change this mechanic so emergencies always trigger.

 

[Trav'ling Canuck]

Well, here's a connection I didn't expect - loyalty is making it more likely I'm going to have aquaducts in any given game.

"A clean citizenry is a loyal citizenry." - Anon.

Okay, nobody actually said that as far as I know, but somebody should have.

 

[Rosty K]

Korea are just ridiculous. I've wasted the Classical Era Golden Age on trying to get a religion (unsuccessfully, because everyone else, including Mvemba of all the people, also picked that dedication), but I'm still so ahead in science, that I feel like I'm a Deity AI or something

 

[bite]

in frustrating news just discovered Mountains don't count for polders

 

[Rosty K]

Just had an interesting case with Emergency. I was already at war against Rome (on the other landmass), they JW-d me with someone else also on that landmass. But there was Nan Madol next to Roman cities, of which I was a suzerain. Naturally, Romans captured it, which triggered an emergency. However, since I kind of expected that, my ships were already there, waiting to intervene if needed (and I'm Korea, so those ships were ironclad, while Rome is still in Medieval), so I one-shot liberated Nan Madol and got 14,000 gold basically for nothing (well, for the liberating ironclad which ended up stuck in the lake, but I felt that's a fair trade ), because I'd have liberated it anyway, even without the emergency.

What I'm saying is maybe the CS emergency should only be triggered when a major civ attacks the CS directly and conquers it, not when it's conquered in a war against its suzerain (in which case it's suzerain's responsibility to deal with it).

 

[WillowBrook]

in frustrating news just discovered Mountains don't count for polders

At least hills do now - IIRC, only flat land counted at first.

 

[WillowBrook]

I don't think this is worth it's own thread, but the golden age exodus of the evangelists dedication has made me enjoy pursuing a religious victory. I found them tedious in vanilla (I only did one or two), but the extra movement and spreads really help.

 

[Trav'ling Canuck]

Mountain tunnels. That's the other geography altering improvement that's likely coming in a future expansion, along with canals.

Sorry for the random thought. It's WillowBrook's fault. Her post led me to think about the pantheon that allows your religious units to avoid terrain costs, and that led me to think about religious units being able to cross mountains ("faith can move mountains", "faith can move across mountains"), etc.

 

[Rosty K]

I don't think this is worth it's own thread, but the golden age exodus of the evangelists dedication has made me enjoy pursuing a religious victory. I found them tedious in vanilla (I only did one or two), but the extra movement and spreads really help.

Though it makes me feel even more that the Great Prophet points should have some use after all Prophets are gone...

 

[Victoria]

Though it makes me feel even more that the Great Prophet points should have some use after all Prophets are gone...

even if its just extra faith, that sort of makes sense, something attracted the prophet in the first place

 

[Flaxton]

Could be Religious Leaders or Lessor Prophets, with abilities like double T3 Holy city bonuses, cause a +500 religion effect within 10 tiles, increase shrines faith by +1, add an additional faith effect, increase followers by 1 in all your cities. Destroy all inquisitors in a radius. Force a peace treaty. +3 amenity in Holy city etc

 

[acluewithout]

Great Prophets should be available the whole game and let you choose between:

- founding a religion (up to whatever is the max for that map),

- if you’ve founded a religion already, allow you to Evangelise Belief (ie pick another Belief) or start and inquistion, or

- get a random bonus, being either relic, religious work of art, unlock your policy cards, or a random civics boost.

 

[God of Kings]

Given that, there should be industrial and later era Great Prophets such as Joseph Smith and L. Ron Hubbard.

 

[acluewithout]

I was thinking more Martin Luther King.

I don’t think a “Great Prophet” literally has to have founded a religion, at least not more modern ones.