RK-08: Atomic Betty

In the screenshot from post #178, two cities (Sigtuna and Bremen) are only two tiles apart. I was under the impression that this was impossible to do in CIV. I am fairly sure that this is the case in Vanilla. Did something change in Warlords? What happened to allow this close city placement in this case?
If this is now allowable, the great artist culture bomb strategy just got much more powerful.

Thanks,
I.
 
no, it is the same in warlords. he was allowed to build his city there because they were seperated by water
 
I did not know that. Thanks.
 
:culture:
Pink Floyd said:
Hello!?!
Is that anybody in there?!?
Just nod if you can hear me...
Is that anyone home???

Roster:
1. Robo Kai (cooking?)
2. fbelintani (just played)
3. ruff_hi (up for 10-15)
4. frankcor (on deck)
5. vra379971 (Still napping?)
 
Either that or Frankor, so, if either of ya want to take this...

Just a thought.

It seems Alex and Fred are exhausting each other...so may I reccommend the following....

I'd split the SOD, then strike on Fred and Alex at the same time to cripple both and gain copper. As Alex STILL hasn't built us a shrine, I'd leave his capital for last. His iron sources (two of 'em) is what we're aiming for here. We should get Wang to attack Alex.

My suggested battleplan...
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/25465/Battleplan..GIF

Now, if Mao gets the SoL he'll have caught up with us. The ONLY reason I can think of, that they won't trade Democracy is that Mao is trying to build it.

That said, I still think we can beat him even if we do build it in Uppsala as we have a GE coming...So, the suggested Tech path...

Constitution, Democracy, Military Tradition (Calvary! West Point!), then Railroads...
 
I've switched with Frankor so...

Turn 0: I encounter Haitubu in a german revolt. Not good as it would give Fred the doorway to our southern capital. I then see we're researching steam power. We don't need ironclads, I'd rather have Cavs, SoL and West Point with our short supply lines, so I switch to Constituion. We have no cash to upgrade siege troops without tanking science. Meh, we have the military advantage. Might as well press it. I also notice Wang will take a tech for war with Alex.

So...off we go. I declare war on Fred, and hope to fulfill the above battle plan fast by taking Cologne, Hamburg and D-dorf, then scurrying to Dortmund and Sparta. We are popular enough with Fred to survive a rep hit if we conduct a limited war. As for Alex, Wang has enough up there to keep Alex busy while we prepare to bring our army on him.

Turn 1: War declared! Our troops sally forth to defeat the Germans...they Germans sally forth as well, and defeat the Knight at Haithabu. Oh well, I had a counter attacking force ready anyway.

Turn 2: Our sturdy boys got a good lecturing on honour. They listened well. We took Haithabu without further losses. For good this time. And the Germans...do nothing.

Turns 3 and 4: With a few Cannons and Rifles (and because a Wang SOD appeared to move toward Alex) I marched up to seize Dortmand. With any luck we'll meet up in the middle. Oh, and the Germans turtled - again.

Turn 5: Despite 80% odds we get a GA. Oh well. I'll rush a great work in Tao Town, but getting SoL just got very dicey.

Turn 6: Hamburg fell, and I killed of the relief force just beyond it. Pah...no challenge here...yet.

Turn 7: Nothing of intrest, 'cept for the fact I took Dortmand - no losses.

Turn 8: The GA created a great enough work to grab the copper. Those Stupa's and the SOL will now come in at double speed.
 
Nice job on the war and on the research, vra. I'll pick up the save and play tonight.

My goals will be to 1) work towards Military Tradition and 2) prosecute the war with Frederick. At some point, I may make the judgement to seek peace if we can get something good for it or if War Weariness starts hampering our research rate.
 
Eh...we have military tradition...I sorta collapsed with weariness last night and I had a class in the morning so I could not type it out earlier...It'll ne up soon.
 
Give me an hour man =)

9) Our war goes well...but our SOD is over extended. I have to go ato do some work for my mother at home.
 
Played!

We got Military Tradition, and are heading to Steam Power. London spend its time building Ironworks, so we are a bit short military wise.

We hold a tech advantage still...But, we are tight. We can now build Cavalry however...and my battleplan was complete...except we now also own Athens too. =)

So, an advice would have to be heal up, get some Cavs, mabye hurry it up with a few Naval ferries...

Oh, and Fred offers capitulation...crush him.

As for SoL in Uppsala, see what ye can do to hurry it up...mabye some whipping or a bit of putting cash to 0 to buy it outright...
 

Attachments

This is a good read guys. I downloaded the initial save and played it out. I seem to do really bad with Raging Barbs on and I dont like settling 1 off the coast. I settled on the marble which gives an extra hammer....getting the Eastern gold in the fat cross was a plus. The fish site was my second city and it got the gold, cows, and fish.

I went wonder crazy like you guys....I think I built everything except Parth, Great Lighthouse, and Notre Dame (also didnt want to pollute the GP pool like you guys). Having my first 2 cities with workable gold was a tech frenzy. One thing I noticed you didnt do. As soon as you met the other continent...if you had gifted them a cheap tech, they will instantly up their rating of you. It can really help. Didnt really help me because they were behind on techs. I never had a Tech trading partner after Lib (took Astro)

This was one of the first times I played as England and it felt reall overpowered...not sure why. I finished with an "Augustus Caesar" Rating and noticed that i got my second city out before any of the other AI's. That is really weird. Could have been the raging barbs or the fact that I settled on marble.
 
Inherited turn (1760 AD): Before turning my attention to the war, I decided to check our cities for opportunities to micromanage our operations. War time usually leads me to sloppiness when I play single player games but I don't want to play like that when I'm on an SG team. Somebody may make fun of me or something ... :mischief:

I found London starving and hosting 3 angry faces. My predecessor, Warlord vra, had wisely ordered construction of a Christian Temple for the happiness. I could eliminate all angry faces by cranking culture up to 20% but after the temple is done, it won't require so much. I know I'll have to make a decision to address war weariness -- probably a choice between taking a 10-turn peace treaty or cranking up culture. The first would allow us to build an army and not happiness buildings but the second choice would let us just eliminate Frederick sooner and be done with him.

York was building a harbor(4). It was +8 health and didn't need the harbor for that. It is pulling in 4 commerce/turn so a harbor will give us +2 commerce. It seemed to me to be a luxury item at that point. I changed orders to build a Lighthouse(4). The city was stagnant in growth but had lots of sea tiles to work. York was due to pop a great prophet in 3 turns.

Nottingham was stagnant like York. It was finishing up a Confucian Academy(1) so I would start a Lighthouse there next turn. The city due to pop a great scientist in 6 turns but that was not going to happen once the prophet was born.

Canturbury was starving with 2 angry faces and building a Christian Temple(7). Whipping the temple for 3 pop solved the angriness and the starvation simultaneously. It would regain one pop in 6 turns. Unhappiness penalty for the whipping would end in 10.

Jelling was in rough shape: 5 angry faces, -6 food and building a Confucian Academy(3). Whipping the Academy would not cure the angry faces. Like London, this city would need either peace or the culture slider.

I continued through our cities but I'll spare you from reading the gory details (and me from having to write them). I whipped in a few cities and then decided to whip a Jail in London for 3 pop. Happiness was solved and starvation was down to -1 food. I figured we could proceed with the wars for a few more turns without adjusting the culture slider. Statue of Liberty will help but we're starting to see some Emancipatoin envy.

So I took a look at our civics:

Representation - Bureaucracy - Slavery - Decentralization??? - Organized Religion

I considered stopping right then and asking for team input. But then, you folks pay me the big bucks to make these decisions, so I ploughed ahead. I figured if I messed up, it probably won't cost us the game because we're so far ahead :lol:

To me, this looked messed up, especially Economy. With Mercantilism, we could hire a ton of specialists - 1 per city. It wouldn't cost us anything either because we don't have any foreign trade routes in any of our cities. Free Market would get us 1 additional trade route per city. At the time all trade routes were +1:gold:/turn and we had 23 cities. I picked Mercantilism - 1 turn of Anarchy.

If we're going to try to buy the Statue of Liberty, I didn't think it would be feasible to whip it (it would require 40 pop). That means we would need UnivSuf, giving up Representation. Giving up Slavery and going to Emancipation would then make good sense to eliminate that form of happiness. We could prolong the wars a bit more. But it will require paying attention to population growth. We won't be able to whip happiness any more.

For Religion, we could change OR to either Theocracy (for experience points) or Free Religion for +:)/+10%:beakers: and extra happiness. That would offset loss of happiness and beakers from going Rep to UnivSuf and happiness.

We could revolt for UR, Emanc. and Mercantilism for only 2 turns of Anarchy. I didn't consider switching Bur. or Religion because either one would add a turn of anarchy. Uh uh. Not gonna happen. I only get 10 turns at this.

So I revolted. Sue me. Or the next player can change it some other way.

Turn 1 (1765 AD): Now that I didn't have to worry about cities for a couple of turns, I focused on our wars. In the north, we faced 3 Greek cities across the front:
atomic23.jpg


Our norther army was healing in Sparta and Athens. Oh wait, that's not our northern army. That's our whole army. I saw what vra meant when he said our SoD was running out of gas. Hmmm ... we can't fight Alex and Frederic at the same time and be certain of success.

It's a long distance through hostile country to reach any of the Greek cities to the north. To our west we faced 3 widely spread German cities:
atomic24.jpg


In addition, there is Essen on the island at the far west plus Munich to our northwest but not shown above. I decided to leave a strong defense in Sparta and Athens and take the German capital, Berlin. Troop movements were ordered accordingly. I also spent half our treasury upgrading four crack city raiders from Maceman to Grenadier (440 gold).

Turn 2 (1770 AD): We came out of anarchy and it was time to go back to work in the cities. I slowed down growth in a couple to avoid unhappiness from growth and adjusted specialists, paying attention to not messing up the DNA of our GPP pools. The combination of improved civics and hiring a few Merchants cuts our losses at 70% research from 50 to 25 :gold: per turn.

Turn 3 (1775 AD): Nottingham constructed a Confucian Academy, started a Redcoat(7). Hastings constructed a Market, started a Cannon(4). Canturbury constucted a Christian temple, started a Redcoat(7). Uppsala constructed a Taoist temple, started a Frigate(2). Dortmund constucted a Courthouse, started a Theatre(6). Roskilde trained a Workboat and returned to work on a Cavalry. London completed its Jail and continued building a Christian Temple. Tonsberg constructed a Conducian Temple, went back to work on a Courthouse.

And finally, Nidaros constructed a Jewish Temple and went back to work on the Statue of Liberty. At the time we could have bought it for 9792 gold. That would be many many turns at 364 gold/turn at 0% research but I shut down the research slider to see if we had a shot at getting the SoL. Steam Power is due in 9 turns (up from 3 at 70% research).

Hey, who left Dortmund ungarrisoned? Fortunately, I had a spare Redcoat next to the city.

Frederick and Alexander signed a peace treaty with one another. That means Alex can come after us a bit stronger. I figured it was time to get peace with him to ease our War Weariness. All he could give us was this:
atomic25.jpg


I took the deal. The improved economy will be worth far more than his paultry contribution (I hoped -- it turned out to be 16 gold/turn).

Turn 4 (1780 AD): London constructed a Christian Temple, started a Redcoat(1). Roskilde trained a Cavalry, started a Redcoat(6)--no strike that, started a Barracks(2). Haithabu constructed a Theatre, started a Courthouse. Cologne trained a Redcoat, started a Cannon(8). I assigned the Redcoat to garrison the heretofore empty Cologne.

Turn 5 (1785 AD): London trained a Redcoat, started another(1). Jelling constructed a Confucian Academy, started a Redcoat(7). Uppsala trained a Frigate, started a Redcoat(4). Lodose constructed a Barracks, started a Redcoat(12).

SIDEBAR: Folks, did I miss the discussion where we agreed to leave so many cities without garrisons? I mean, we have empty coastal cities that are less than 3 movement turns by Galleon from China, the number 2 in score and who is -6 annoyed with us???? Most of our coastal and core cities are garrisoned by single archers or longbowmen. We are a disaster waiting for an excuse. I took it upon myself to start building Redcoats everywhere. No wonder we were struggling with unhappiness? Heck, I'm almost unhappy! ;)

I caught our Great General sleeping in Nidaros with his feet up on a desk. I tanned his hide and he began his journey to the front to become a Warlord.

Abu Bakr, great prophet, was born in York. I sent him to Canterbury to build an Islamic shrine. Nottingham is due to pop a great scientist(81%) in 8 turns.

Turn 6 (1790 AD): London trained a Redcoat, started another(2). Birka constructed a Taoist Temple, started a Confucian Missionary(1). Roskilde constructed a Barracks, started a Redcoat(7). Hamburg constructed a Barracks, started a Taoist Temple(7).

The bombardment of Berlin began:
atomic26.jpg


Our prophet completed the Masjid al-Haram giving us +2gold/turn -- whoop-de-doo! Someday we gotta spread religions, I guess.

SOL UPDATE: 8181 gold to buy, we have 1645(+384/turn)

Turn 7 (1795 AD): Hastings trained a Cannon, started a Redcoat(3). Birka trained a Confucian Missionary, started a Redcoat(6). I sent the Birka to the coast to catch a Galleon to Bremen, a city without any religion. Bjorgvin constructed a Library, started a Granary(4).

Hamilcar Barca joined up with a Medic Redcoat outside of Berlin:
atomic27.jpg


He's now a Super-medic. I avoided giving him any strength promotions; try to keep him in large stacks and he should survive a long time.

At the gates of Berlin, I sacrificed 2 catapults and 2 trebuchets to soften things up and to avoid the cost of upgrading them (sounds kinda heartless n'est ce pas?). The downside of that is it added to war weariness a little bit at a time. But by then our Cannons could get 76% odds -- the sacrifice helped the survivability of of our modern units. BTW, our crack Grenadiers could get 99% odds so I saved the Cannons to permit them to move onto the next city. I sent in Grennadiers, Cavalry and Redcoats to take the city and claim our 238 gold pillage and a worker. A German General was the last defender to die.

I decided, since we were in the neighborhood, to capture Frankfurt, south of Dusseldorf, next. Then we could move our forces north again to deal with the rest of Germany and Greece. Frankfurt was defended by 3 Riflemen.

Turn 8 (1800 AD): London trained a Redcoat, started another(2).

IBT: Wang Kon offered us Corporation and 110 gold for Astronomy. I took the deal. Corporations build assembly lines.

Turn 9 (1802 AD): Uppsala trained a Redcoat, started another(4). Dortmund constructed a Theatre, started a Library(13).

One of our Frigates sank a Galleon off the coast of Frankfurt -- no clue how many souls went to the bottom with it. The Galleon had been beelining towards Haithabu sitting without a garrison, 5 tiles away.

The bombardment of Frankfurt began, speeded up by a Galleon ferrying troops from the force at Berlin.

Turn 10 (1804 AD): London trained a Redcoat, started another(1). York constructed a Harbor, started a Redcoat. Nottingham trained a Redcoat, started a Confucian Missionary(3). Hasting trained a Redcoat, started another(4). Canterbury trained a Redcoat, started an Islamic Missionary(4).

At Frankfurt, Frederick had 4 Riflemen by then. We lost a Cannon taking the city and picked up 136 gold and three workers.

SOL UPDATE: 7074 gold to buy, we have 3732(+427/turn)

I decided to play 3 more turns to give us a round number year. How's that for a specious excuse?

Turn 10 (1804 AD): London trained a Redcoat, started another(2). Bjorgvin constructed a Granary, started a Courthouse(8). Cologne trained a Cannon, started a Redcoat(8) ... no ... make that a Barracks(4).

My next target was Knossos and our forces began the trek northward.

Turn 11 (1806 AD):

Turn 12 (1808 AD): London trained a Redcoat, started another(2). Steam Power came in and I chose Railroad(40) to speed up the time it'll take to deliver units from London to Korea. The other choices were Scientific Method and Assembly Line. We discovered 3 sources of coal, two of which were already mined.

London trained a Redcoat, started another(2). Jelling trained a Redcoat, started a Christian Temple(5).

Turn 10 (1810 AD): Nottingham trained a Confucian Missionary, started Courthouse(7). Birka trained a Redcoat, started another(6). Roskilde trained a Redcoat, started a Confucian Missionary(2). Uppsala trained a Redcoat, started another(4).

Our Cannons, escorted by Cavalry only have arrived on a jungle square outside of Knossos which is garrisoned by 2 Riflemen.

SOL UPDATE: 16 turns to build, 6183 gold to buy, we have 5022(+424/turn). We should be able to buy it in 2 turns.

A great scientist was born in Nottingham. He can contribute 2100 :science: for Scientific Method. Or build an academy someplace or join someplace. Talk amongst yourselves.

Here's The Save: Atomic_Betty_AD-1810.CivWarlordsSave Have fun!
 
Hey Frank!
Absolutely amazing! :goodjob:

I just don't get your point on defense... I read everywhere on the forums that an Archer can beat a Tank. :mischief: Why would we worry, then? :lol:

Seriously now... Newbie question: How many garrisons do we generally need in border cities after renaissance? Until feudalism, a couple of archers do the job if you're building to attack. After that, a couple of LB do the job (even if I seldom build them)... After that... Muskets, Grenadiers or Rifles defend better? How many to be safe?

It looks like Robo is up, unless Ruff_hi is among us again!
Roster:
1. Robo Kai (up for 10-15)
2. fbelintani (on deck :bday: [party])
3. ruff_hi (missing?)
4. frankcor (just played)
5. vra379971 (wondering....? :D)
 
Maybe I'm too conservative, but in a border city after Renaissance, I keep two up-to-date foot soldiers(rifle/infantry/mech.inf.), one with a city-garrison promotion along with a mounted unit in any border city. Coastal cities should actually have more but I rarely do. But imagine if China were to land 4 galleons full of invaders to York right now; we'd be toast.

Happy Birthday, fb!
 
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