RoM in Space!

[Galacticat42]

@Civ Fuehrer

This looks great! What should we do about other star systems solar systems? Unlike ours they could have anything from gas planets in the inner solar system to binary stars to even all asteroids.

Depending upon the type of star would determine what type of habitable zone there would be when colonizing other star systems.

Good point, I think the inner solar system gas giants we'll skip for now, the asteroid systems will register as an asteroid cluster (mineable but nothing more) here's more random probability layouts:
number of stars will just offset base distance percentage system appropriately, temp zones will only be affected by sun with highest % shift.

star size affects temp zones
small = 5% downward shift
ms = 2% downward shift
medium = normal percents as shown above
ml = 2% upward shift
large = 5% upward shift

star heat (color) affects temp zones
purple = no purple stars will have inner solar system planets
red = 5% downward shift
orange = 2% downward shift
yellow = normal percents as shown above
bright blue = 2% upward shift
white = 5% upward shift

 

[Hydromancerx]

@ Civ Fuehrer

Ok. Next set of ides/questions....

1. How many systems can a player discover? Is there a limit?

2. Will the galaxy be separated into quadrants? Ex. Alpha Quadrant, Delta Quadrant, etc.

3. Will there be "Galactic Objects" to discover such as ...

- Black Hole
- Proto-Planetary Disk
- Binary System (2 Blue Giants)
- Binary System (1 Blue Giant, 1 Yellow Sun)
- Binary System (1 Blue Giant, 1 Red Dwarf)
- Binary System (2 Yellow Suns)
- Binary System (1 Yellow Sun, 1 Red Dwarf)
- Binary System (2 Red Dwarfs)
- Comet
- Nebula Gas
- Shells of Supernovae
- Pulsar, Magnetar, Quasar
- Galactic Center

4. Will some systems have microbial life? Or even muticellular fauna and flora? I think intelligent life is too complex because then you would need a new AI.

5. Do you think there should be an additional "Galactic Era" after the Trans-Human Era?

 

[Galacticat42]

@ Civ Fuehrer

Ok. Next set of ides/questions....

1. How many systems can a player discover? Is there a limit?

2. Will the galaxy be separated into quadrants? Ex. Alpha Quadrant, Delta Quadrant, etc.

3. Will there be "Galactic Objects" to discover such as ...

- Black Hole
- Proto-Planetary Disk
- Binary System (2 Blue Giants)
- Binary System (1 Blue Giant, 1 Yellow Sun)
- Binary System (1 Blue Giant, 1 Red Dwarf)
- Binary System (2 Yellow Suns)
- Binary System (1 Yellow Sun, 1 Red Dwarf)
- Binary System (2 Red Dwarfs)
- Comet
- Nebula Gas
- Shells of Supernovae
- Pulsar, Magnetar, Quasar
- Galactic Center

4. Will some systems have microbial life? Or even muticellular fauna and flora? I think intelligent life is too complex because then you would need a new AI.

5. Do you think there should be an additional "Galactic Era" after the Trans-Human Era?

1. These are only numbers attached to a tab in the screen, this won't slow down the game too much so I'd say limited to about 100 systems/objects

2. Maybe later, I'm hoping the first releases to be the basic math calculations for solar systems.

3. Yes, but I'm going to be starting with only systems then expand out to include other things.

4. I'm not going to add any of that for RoMiS, I'll save that for Alien Outbreak.

5. I can do that.

EDIT: The basic screen python file is nearing completion so I can start fiddling with tab layouts soon.

 

[Hydromancerx]

EDIT: The basic screen python file is nearing completion so I can start fiddling with tab layouts soon.

Cool! Show a screenshot as soon as you can.

 

[Galacticat42]

gunna have to redo the screen, i think the tut i took it from is too outdated.

 

[Galacticat42]

keep the ideas coming if you think there's anything left out.

 

[Hydromancerx]

keep the ideas coming if you think there's anything left out.

I have plenty of ideas I am just not sure what can be done and what we need to focus on. Like did you get a mock Space screen/menu to work?

Also i went over the game "Outpost" to see if i could use any of their ideas for this since the game is all about colonizing a planet. Here are some things maybe we could use.

Probes and Satellites
- Interstellar Probe (Locates Habitable Planets)
- Meteor Satellite (Scans the Sky for Incoming Meteors and Asteroids)
- Communications Satellite (Gives Communications Between Colonies and Satellites)
- Geological Penetration Probe (Marks Resources for Mining)
- Weather Satellite (Track the Planets Weather)
- Orbital Observer Satellite (Maps the Planet)

Robots and Vehicles
- RoboDozer
- RoboDigger
- RoboMiner
- Rover
- Cargo Truck
- Construction Vehicle
- Earthworker
- Evacuation Transport
- Repair Vehicle
- RoboSurveyor
- Scout

Colony Buildings
- Cargo Lander (Land Your Cargo to the Planet's Surface)
- Colonist Lander (Lands Your Colonists to the Planet's Surface)
- Tokamak Reactor (Provides Nuclear Power)
- Solar Array (Provides Solar Power)
- Life Support (Provides Breathable Air for the Colony)
- Agrodome (Provides food for the Colony)
- Command Center (Main Building of the Colony)
- DIRT [Disaster Instant Resonse Team] (Helps reduce damage in emergencies)
- Consumer Good Factory (Provides good for the colony)
- Vehicle Factory (Creates Robots and Rovers)
- Forum
- Garage (Repairs Vehicles and Robots)
- Geothermal Plant (Provides Geothermal Power)
- GORF [Garbage and Ore Recycling Facility] (Recycling Center)
- Guard Post
- Laboratory (Basic, Standard and Advanced)
- Medical Center
- Meteor Defense
- Nursery (For Kids)
- Observatory
- Recreational Facitlity
- Residence (Basic, Advanced, Reinforced)
- Robot Command Center
- Smelter
- Spaceport
- Storage Tanks
- trade Center
- University

Also the Outpost Wiki might be helpful.

Outpost Wiki
http://wiki.outpostuniverse.net/Main_Page

Note all these might not fit but I am just throwing out some ideas since you asked.

 

[generalstaff]

Colony Buildings
- Cargo Lander (Land Your Cargo to the Planet's Surface)
- Colonist Lander (Lands Your Colonists to the Planet's Surface)
- Tokamak Reactor (Provides Nuclear Power)
- Solar Array (Provides Solar Power)
- Life Support (Provides Breathable Air for the Colony)
- Agrodome (Provides food for the Colony)
- Command Center (Main Building of the Colony)
- DIRT [Disaster Instant Resonse Team] (Helps reduce damage in emergencies)
- Consumer Good Factory (Provides good for the colony)
- Vehicle Factory (Creates Robots and Rovers)
- Forum
- Garage (Repairs Vehicles and Robots)
- Geothermal Plant (Provides Geothermal Power)
- GORF [Garbage and Ore Recycling Facility] (Recycling Center)
- Guard Post
- Laboratory (Basic, Standard and Advanced)
- Medical Center
- Meteor Defense
- Nursery (For Kids)
- Observatory
- Recreational Facitlity
- Residence (Basic, Advanced, Reinforced)
- Robot Command Center
- Smelter
- Spaceport
- Storage Tanks
- trade Center
- University

Also the Outpost Wiki might be helpful.

Outpost Wiki
http://wiki.outpostuniverse.net/Main_Page

Note all these might not fit but I am just throwing out some ideas since you asked.

Also, the Final Frontier mod, although, I think most of the key buildings you mentioned.

Just a thought on vehicles, buildings, etc, the list seems pretty civilian. What military things are planned (Laser Satellite, Garrison, Invasion Transport, Automated Defenses, Space Bomber (Fun from Civ: CtP, a space platform which coated asteroids in metal which would survive the atmosphere and drop them on cities), etc.)

 

[Hydromancerx]

@Civ Fuehrer

I was thinking more about colonization and i think we should have diffrent planets, moons and asteroids give a diffrent number of city "slots". Thus when the player or AI try to colonize a planet, moon or asteroid only a limited number of colony cities can be built.

This way we can have them fight over them and then in turn have a % of the planet. Also if we got fancy we could even have those space colonies split up unto their own vassal nations or independent nations.

 

[Galacticat42]

Yea I'm planning on turning this into a really fancy modmod but start with the basics which we've covered and get deeper and deeper into details with each passing version. Currently I'm trying to figure out the python for ANM since RevDCM 2.6 has appeared to have broken it. I'm thinking about pulling the 2.15 download from the site since it's completely faulty right now. Yes you have the nukes, but they don't do any special effects.

EDIT: Good new about RoMiS however is that since there are plenty of screens in game, chances are I won't have a problem with unknown python errors like I'm having with ANM since ANM doesn't have any folder in the entire game even remotely similar to it that I can base it on.

 

[Hydromancerx]

So for like version 1 should we just do basic stuff like have discovering the moon or a planet but not have any info on it or colonization? In short like having the menu and unlocking the tabs but that's all.

 

[Galacticat42]

Pretty much, but that kind of version will only be alphas and betas. For alpha versions I will only release it to you or anyone willing to put in specific input on what should be added or if it's not working with other screens etc.
EDIT: I got ANM working again so I can start working on the screen python again.

 

[Hydromancerx]

Ok i have some idea on colonization ...

Moon Colonization
You colonize the same way you colonize on your homeworld with individual cities and individual Buildings.

Home Solar System Colonization
You are now starting to colonize planets, asteroids and other moons. Rather than worriying about individual buildings in a colony you have pre-made "colony arcologies" which land on te surface and have all the buildings needed already. In addition there could be other types of things such as mines, etc. But there is no micro managing buildings anymore.

Colonizing the Nearest Solar System
After sending probes you send out a "Planet Colonization Ship" to the nearest star system. This has bunch of "colonization arcologies" on it so you can colonizes an entire planet at once each time you send one.

Colonizing Other Solar Systems
The next step up you send out "Star Colonization Ships" these ships will colonize all the inhabitable planets at once sending down hundreds of "colony arcologies".

Colonization Beyond
We could keep expanding out with ones that colonize who sectors of space, then whole quadrants and then the entire galaxy. I think it might be too much beyond auto colonizing each star system.

Let me know what you think of this idea of mass colonization ships.

 

[Galacticat42]

Ok i have some idea on colonization ...

Moon Colonization
You colonize the same way you colonize on your homeworld with individual cities and individual Buildings.

Home Solar System Colonization
You are now starting to colonize planets, asteroids and other moons. Rather than worriying about individual buildings in a colony you have pre-made "colony arcologies" which land on te surface and have all the buildings needed already. In addition there could be other types of things such as mines, etc. But there is no micro managing buildings anymore.

Colonizing the Nearest Solar System
After sending probes you send out a "Planet Colonization Ship" to the nearest star system. This has bunch of "colonization arcologies" on it so you can colonizes an entire planet at once each time you send one.

Colonizing Other Solar Systems
The next step up you send out "Star Colonization Ships" these ships will colonize all the inhabitable planets at once sending down hundreds of "colony arcologies".

Colonization Beyond
We could keep expanding out with ones that colonize who sectors of space, then whole quadrants and then the entire galaxy. I think it might be too much beyond auto colonizing each star system.

Let me know what you think of this idea of mass colonization ships.

Definitely like it. One thing I thought about though: when a civ builds the Apollo program, they claim the moon as their territory. How would civs that do not own the moon build bases on it? Or should we leave the fact out that the US claimed the moon as their territory when we won the space race to the moon against Russia?

 

[Supercheese]

One thing I thought about though: when a civ builds the Apollo program, they claim the moon as their territory. How would civs that do not own the moon build bases on it? Or should we leave the fact out that the US claimed the moon as their territory when we won the space race to the moon against Russia?

Well, if some non-US space program were to, right now, launch a manned mission to land on the moon, would we stop them because we've "claimed" the moon as "United States Territory"? I personally wouldn't think so; rather, ownership of land on the moon should be on a "staking a claim" basis, meaning that any space program wanting to colonize the moon would have to mark & enforce borders (on the moon), thus making the territory within those borders theirs, de facto. Likewise, any moon colonies in Civ4 would have borders defined by enforceability -- if you can claim and protect any land on the moon, then it is yours.

Naturally, a military presence is not the only option for enforcing borders on the moon. Diplomacy works just as well, if you can get everyone to agree on moon-borders, that is. It seems to have worked with Antarctica where military activity is banned and governments agree on allowing manned outposts. (See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antarctic_Treaty_System)

 

[Hydromancerx]

Definitely like it. One thing I thought about though: when a civ builds the Apollo program, they claim the moon as their territory. How would civs that do not own the moon build bases on it? Or should we leave the fact out that the US claimed the moon as their territory when we won the space race to the moon against Russia?

Yay! Glad you like it.

I think it would work where you would establish each "base" (aka city) on the moon. The moon would have limited amount of city slots. Once you establish your "base" then you would get to send new buildings to the "bases".

So for your example the US made a claim to the moon but have we made an actually moon base? Not really. Now before the "bases" were put on the moon we can have other things such as rovers, moon landers and taking moon walks. But all of this would be under exploration and not colonization.

I image each discovery having 3 stages ....

1. Exploration
Sending out Probes, Landers and Rovers.

2. Colonization
Establishing a base and then colonizing the world.

3. Production
Once the colonies are establish they send back resources, wealth and scientific knowledge. In addition one could eventually terraform at this stage.

So for say the moon you would ...

1. Send down rovers, a moon lander and do some moon walks.

2. Establish some moon colonies with buildings such as habitation pods, laboratories and even factories.

3. Once base is established you would get money (from tourism), beakers (from scientific knowledge), hammers (from low gravity factories), etc.

Note that having a moon base would be important to exploring space since low gravity production can allow for building spaceships easier.

 

[Galacticat42]

Note that having a moon base would be important to exploring space since low gravity production can allow for building spaceships easier.

True, easier than assembling in orbit too since they won't have to worry about having perfect velocity, direction, etc.
EDIT: Also as I mentioned in an earlier post, the maintenance costs would be directly affected by water levels on that planet/moon. Say (this would be a random chance) that the moon doesn't have enough water (like what the LCROSS mission discovered a few weeks ago), the maintenance would go from 100g/t (gold per turn) to 5000g/t then through biological waste recycling, the maintenance would slowly decline to 100g/t. Distant planets however would not require maintenance(except for shipping of resources) since they can start their own economy but still be a part of your civ plus the fact that any distant planet would need sufficient water levels to start a new colony at such far distances.

 

[Hydromancerx]

True, easier than assembling in orbit too since they won't have to worry about having perfect velocity, direction, etc.
EDIT: Also as I mentioned in an earlier post, the maintenance costs would be directly affected by water levels on that planet/moon. Say (this would be a random chance) that the moon doesn't have enough water (like what the LCROSS mission discovered a few weeks ago), the maintenance would go from 100g/t (gold per turn) to 5000g/t then through biological waste recycling, the maintenance would slowly decline to 100g/t. Distant planets however would not require maintenance(except for shipping of resources) since they can start their own economy but still be a part of your civ plus the fact that any distant planet would need sufficient water levels to start a new colony at such far distances.

Collecting/Harvesting Ice Asteroids in the Asteroid Belt/Oort Cloud should reduce maintenance costs then since they could use the ice for water on dry planets. Note it would probably coast a bunch of hammers to do this but over time systems could redistribute water from space to the colonies. I think this method should probbly becomes its own new tech on the tech tree.

In fact there will be many new "space techs" we should add on the tech tree. Some should be put throughout the existing tech tree from advanced rocketry on. Wile other later trans-human techs should probably get pushed back into the new "Space Era". Mainly ones like "Space Colonies" and "Interstellar Travel". Some ideas for new techs ...

- Lunar Exploration (Allows for probes and rovers to explore the Moon)
- Lunar Colonization (Allows for colonies to be established on the Moon)
- Low Gravity Manufacturing (Allows for spaceship factories to be built on the Moon)

- Planetary Exploration (Allows for probes and rovers to explore planets in your solar system)
- Planetary Colonization (Allows for colonies to be established within your solar system)

- Asteroid Mining (Allows for the asteroid Belt to be Mined)

There are many more. We should really start planning all the new techs out since we is so much we could do with it.

 

[GeoModder]

Can't believe this escaped my attention for two weeks.

A question first: is this mod supposed to start from the ancient era with tech progression towards the space exploration/colonization part, or does it start from the modern/future era?

In any case, good ideas here and the basics sound realistic. However, since the plan is to have a bit of a random solar system I wonder why you would restrict yourself to the standard 'habitable planet with a moon in orbit'. How about the home planet's location depend on the mapsize? For instance tiny/small sized maps could be considered a home'moon' orbiting on a safe distance (radiationwise) from a gas giant near or in the habitable zone of a sun. And the larger the size of the map, the more chance for multiple and large moons orbiting the homeworld (planet in this case). And dependent on the kind of star(s) in the system, there could be more then one planet in the habitable zone(s).
I've seen some discussion on whether or not other civs could also establish colonies on an already inhabited planet/moon. Whether or not this is allowed could be tied in the game as a UN-council proposal. Let's say the proposal becomes viable once the first civ created the Apollo Program. Same with space stuff that let large chunks of matter like asteroids or ice-comets be diverted in orbit of the homeworld. There's always the risk of miscalculation or technical problem nudging such stuff in orbit and let the whole thing crash downwards.
Of course, defying a proposal is an option, but penalties from the other civs might become more severe the higher the risk for the whole homeworld.
Some other thing. The habitability of a planet is of course mostly determined by the distance from its sun. But size could also play a role. For instance, I've read somewhere that if Venus and Mars where in each other's orbits their hospitality towards life would be increased significantly.

 

[Galacticat42]

This modmod will start in the ancient era with tech progression, this is a RoM future modmod not a future mod by itself. Nice ideas, I'll definitely add them to the todo list.