Ruff02 - Concurrent Succession Game

chriseay · May 5, 2006

radiopill said:
And for chriseay's save, a good development (lots of cities), but a poor infrastructure (few courthouses and no market, of course with 5 more turns, there will be some more CH, but curency due in 3... so for me a lot of money has been lost).

Yeah, given the extra 5 turns, I think I would have caught up with the other saves, though I don't know about passing anyone. Just to make sure I'm not going crazy, this is why I only played 15.

ruff_hi said:
Question - how many rounds? 10, 15 or 20. I would think we should go with 15.

and

knupp715 said:
Yeah, IMO mutineer had the best save out of the bunch. Good Job. 15 turns sounds fairly reasonable to me.

My vote is for Radiopill....good expansion, better tech choices, and more courthouses.

Mutineer · May 5, 2006

Currently it is 300 turns left.
WE probably will use about 200 of them.
If we reduce amount of turns to 15 it will take 13.3333 weeks =
>3 month. I think it is way to long.
In addition in less then 20 turns difference in strategies would not be notisable.

chriseay · May 5, 2006

Mutineer said:
Currently it is 300 turns left.
WE probably will use about 200 of them.
If we reduce amount of turns to 15 it will take 13.3333 weeks =
>3 month. I think it is way to long.
In addition in less then 20 turns difference in strategies would not be notisable.

I have no problem with playing 20 turns a piece, I just was under the impression that we were playing 15. There was no evidence to the contrary and the two posts I cited in support of that conclusion. On how long it takes, I'm not going anywhere and I like this game (Civ 4) plenty to keep playing for quite a while. It makes no difference in my book how long the game takes.

bobrath · May 5, 2006

Honestly, I played 15 and was about to post when I noticed both Mutineer and Radio had played 20 so I went back and played 5 more. Agree that we need better communication.

If not for my screw up with the wonders, I'd vote for my save as it has the best (imo of course) city placement for denying the south to Freddy and for our health as a nation. I also made up a lot of ground with tech trades and GP research. However I will agree that the wonders is a big deal. Grudingly vote for Radio's save.

knupp715 · May 5, 2006

My vote goes for Radiopill also.

btw: I think we should play 20 turns each round so the game doesn't take excessively long to finish

@chriseay - that vote for mutineer was from the round before, not this round.

P.S. I think posting the saves with the report would be much better than posting the save after the report. I don't know about you guys, but it is very hard for me to see everything that is going on without checking out the saves.

pholkhero · May 5, 2006

AFter careful consideration, i'm thinking RadioPill's got the best save. I like the Gr Lib in Karak, I like the hook-up of the sea resources. The only thing that gave me pause was difference in finances, but, upon reflection, noticed it was only a few gold, and i also saw that Mutineer is losing 8gpt @ 70%, Radio is losing only 5 ~ it's not much, but there's not a WHOLE lot to differentiate those two.

ruff_hi · May 5, 2006

Radiopill - looks like we will need your save.

Also, we are playing 20 and will be playing 20 until further notice.

Finally, maybe posting the everyone's saves will make analysing differences easier but I was hoping that people's write ups would relay the good points. At the moment, I am leaning towards NOT posting saves. One of the things I hoped to learn from this SG was how to get the right messages across via reports - a dump of the autologger (or similar) is just not going to cut it.

Round 4, Team 2
Spinoza - mia
Ruff_Hi
knupp715
pholkhero

knupp715 · May 5, 2006

I know what you mean Ruff. I would hope that nobody would write crappy reports if they could just post their saves thinking that says it all.

I just suggested it because reading the reports and analyzing every point isn't always easy. For me, checking out everybody's saves and seeing with my own eyes what is going on would help me a lot. I guess I am just a visual person. Sticking with posting the save after the vote is okay with me though.

chriseay · May 5, 2006

@knupp - I know that vote was from the last round, it just happened to be where I quoted you in respect to the 15 or 20 turn quandary I ended up with. Sorry about that! :rolleyes:

bobrath · May 5, 2006

I think posting the saves with writeups will push us away from the writeups. I viewed this SG as a chance to learn to play better AS WELL AS writeup better.

radiopill · May 6, 2006

Here is the saves guys... :king:

knupp715 · May 9, 2006

Okay. Research wise I got Philosophy and headed towards Education. Got education and now liberalism in due in 7 turns. I got Machinery and optics from Bismarck.

I founded three cities. I was building a settler to fill the last spot until I noticed the Egyptians took it.

I spread Buddhism to Egypt. We can now see almost all of Hatty's cities.

Most of our cities were building infrastructure except a few which were building units. Most of our cities are now protected by an archer and an axe. We are in a decent place militarily, at least for now.

For future plan I say we finish up infrastructure and build up our military. We should be able to take out Egypt fairly easy.

I'm posting A LOT of screen shots. I didn't crop most of them so that you guys could see everything that is going on. Notice we have a great merchant which I didn't use. I intended for us to save him for a GA.

knupp715 · May 9, 2006

Some more screenshots.

pholkhero · May 9, 2006

1000 ad/Turn 0:
I wonder about what our goals are and where we should be heading with this empire, i.e., what sort of victory are we pursuing?? At this point, a quick glance at the f9 screen tells me that military or space is the way at this point?? I could use some practice on snaky continents warfare ~ as Mutineer suggested, we could take out Hatty and annex Egypt next ~ (if not, straight Dom, perhaps back-door Diplo w/Germany’s help?? We’ll see. Either way, Egypt has to go. We could use about 4-5 galleys worth of units, w/about half on reserve to reinforce the attack (so…8-10 units, w/5-6 ready a few turns later). Besides, their land is quite green!

MM Madras to get Market quicker; also Calcutta to get the Gran faster there (THEN we should work all those food tiles and save ½ of them at pop growth); want to get a worker down to Karachi to mine that hill and iron ASAP. Go to binary science and 100% (w/no culture needed and a short turnset in SGs, binary, I think, is a must); Phil down from 5 to…4 ta da! :lol:

-65gpt.

Goals:
Begin preparations for an assault on Egypt. To that end, I want some more military techs and the capability to crank them out in a couple cities. Karakorum of course should produce many, while perhaps Calcutta can send out some Galleys. We could also use two for exploration.

I press enter.

1010 ad/Turn 1:
Bangalore: Market>Courthouse to knock out that -5 maintenance; Karakorum: Harbor>Heroic Epic (see above). Our scout near giza spies a crab; the site will make a good fishing village; another one is heading to upper Egypt to spy out our future holdings. The worker team at Karachi finishes the farm on the corn; 2 go roading and the 3rd goes to mine that jungle hill.

Fred want to trade maps; ok! He won’t declare on hatty because we can’t afford their price.

1020 ad/turn 2:
Nothing much. Our scout loads up in southern Egypt. On the inter-turn, Hatty comes calling. She wants us to cancel our deals w/Fred. Thanks, but no thanks.

1030 ad/turn 3:
Bombay finishes up (I forget :confused:

) but starts on a galley for the invasion fleet; a worker-pair finishes up on the incense there, too; I send them down to iron now that Karachi’s border’s have expanded; the settler is done @ Turfan, I begins on a market. Meanwhile, I send the settler around the cape to a spot SE of Turfan, near the corn and gold there. At some point, I’d like to make another settler and stick it at the spot south of Delhi; it would make nice staging area :devil:

Hatty wants to exchange maps; sure, why not?

1040 ad/turn 4:
Lahore: Gran>Courthouse (to get rid of the -9 gpt maintenance!); iron mine in 2 turns; Karachi will have nice prod.

1050 ad/turn 5:
Philosophy in; decisions, decisions…Civil Service (then Construction>Education to Liberalism). Delhi builds a lighthouse; Kara finishes heroic>axe; Ptolemy (gs) born in kara; going to delhi for academy. The mine is done on the former jungle NE of Karachi.

1060 ad/turn 6:
Iron is connected and @ Karakorum: Axe>Sword. I shuffle some axes on the lower part of our continent to defend the impending city. Worker pair heads form the iron down to the gold by Lahore. I send the axe to the peninsula south of Delhi. Start a cottage @ Karachi w/2 workers. Kolhapur settled in the SE, near corn and gold; started on granary.

1070 ad/turn 7:
Bombay: Galley>Galley; Kara: Sword>sword. Academy built in Delhi.

1080 ad/turn 8:
Kara: sword>axe. I SET THE RALLY POINT FOR KARAKORUM TO BE THE FUTURE CITY ON THE PENINSULA, NEAR EGYPT!

1090 ad/turn 9:
Delhi: lighthouse>galley; Kara: axe>sword.

1100 ad/turn 10:
Kara: sword>sword; Karachi: gran>courthouse. Egyptian archer-settler pair arrives in the lower portion of our continent :mad:

IBT: El-Amarna founded near Lahore and Kolha.

1110 ad/turn 11:
Kara: sword>axe. Change Kolha from Gran>Library.

1120 ad/turn 12:
Bombay: galley>galley; Madras: market>aqueduct @ 2 unhealthy, stop growth w/Eng spec; Kara: axe>spear; Calcutta: gran>library for some scientists.

1130 ad/turn 13:
Kara: spear>sword.

1140 ad/turn 14:
Civil Service>Construction (in 1), revolt to Bureaucracy; Delhi: galley>settler; Bangalore: courthouse>library; Kara: sword>sword.

1150 ad/turn 15:
Construction>Educ; Kara: sword>cat; 5 million people! El-amarna stole our gold down at Kolhapur

1160 ad/turn 16:
Kara: cat>cat

1170 ad/turn 17:
Bombay: galley>galley; kara: cat>cat; popped another one near Karachi: iron on the ex-jungle hill that’s already mined!

IBT: I trade Hatty our Philosophy for her Machinery + 10g; she low-balled me, but I’d like to have machinery ~

1180 ad/turn 18:
Kara: cat>cat

1190 ad/turn 19:
Delhi: settler>galley; Kara: cat>mace

1200 ad/turn 20:
Jaipur founded south of Delhi; begins on library for culture. At Jaipur, we’ve got 3 galleys, w/2 more en route, 1 in production. Also, we have 6 swords, 3 axes, 1 spear w/1 sword and 4 cats en route. Educ is due in 3 (w/an aim to taking Nat’l w/Liberalism).

pholkhero · May 9, 2006

okay, heres more screenies...

pholkhero · May 9, 2006

one more plus the save

ruff_hi · May 9, 2006

Another 20 turns, no war but lots of building and research. We do have an invader on our island but I have swords rushing to the area.
We have some cities (ie Bombay) that are stagnant if they are working their max hammers but can grow if not. I put these cities to grow and used the reduced hammers to build Missionaries. Current research is Civil Service due in 3 at 70%, -9 gold with 75 in the bank. I also swapped maps a few times with both Hatty and Bismark. I didn't trade tech with Bismark as he is more ahead of us in some areas (and he wouldn't trade as often). I swapped to Theocracy once I started to build the swords (+2xp) and no anarchy (the power of Gandhi).

I am currently after the +1 boat movement via circumnavigation …

Here is a picture of our two new cities (and the interloper) …

Spoiler Techs :

Spoiler I built the following: :

Stats

Spoiler runlog :

Mutineer · May 9, 2006

Question, I am not in official roster, do you want me to play my turns and put unofficial one?

ruff_hi · May 9, 2006

Mutineer said:
Question, I am not in official roster, do you want me to play my turns and put unofficial one?

Hi Mutineer, I would prefer if you would offer comments and vote on our turns.

Mutineer · May 10, 2006

Problem with commenting and 20 turns steps is that longer planing results are not visible yet.
Second problem that I feel you many voite and decision come from idea choising no my save, not choising the best save.

For example: In my previous save all Markets/baraks were allredy build befor I let cities to grow. That slow my research a bit, but was preparation for next 20-40 turns when this sacrify pay for itself.
When turns are measured not by long term plan, but by current state long turm plan will not be apriciated and wrong conclusion will be drafted.
When I look on provided save it become clear that it is not posible to use a big plan I used of whipe structures in Orgonised religiong/small cities and grow and run specialists in Pacifism then revolt to Nationalism to draft army for fast conquest.

For all practical reasons we allredy won this game, so this inprecision would not be matter, but I am unable to demonstrate advantages of long turm planing and why doing thinks this way is more optimum.

On other hand, no one propouse long turm plan or explain why they doing think they do linked to there long term planing.
Then difference become a luck or different micromanagment.

for example, whipping:

I whip food ritch cities every time I need to produce setler or I can whipe or building as soon as it is posible. Reason: they are best way to increase our production, I can hire a lot of specialists with out castle system the moment I switch to pacifism, I am allredy have barak and happiness buildings for wars and drafting futher of.
In short my actions at that moment prepare my actions 20-40-60 turns ahead. That made for me to imposible to comment on other people saves, as no one stated there plan for next 20-40-60 turn. No one specify how they intend to build military, how fast and in what amount if they intend to go to war or what is purpouse of there peacefull development.

It still work on low level, up to Monarch, but not in higher level or from every starting position.

Many people who win on emperor or even higher do have plan, but it is often very narrow plan, like praetorians rush or something simular and if terran and situation does not sute it they reroll or lose.

Now there is additional problem as people take my point of view offencive, then the only think I want to do and try to do is to explain this main point.

Ruff02 - Concurrent Succession Game

The Master Trader

Deity

The Master Trader

Emperor

King

Deviant Mind

Live 4ever! Or die trying

King

The Master Trader

Emperor

Tyrant

King

King

Deviant Mind

Deviant Mind

Deviant Mind

Live 4ever! Or die trying

Deity

Live 4ever! Or die trying

Deity

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