No savebreaking changes has yet been pushed to master or SVN.
Savebreaking Changes. Mapmakers/modmodders update your scenarios/modmods for SVN 11132+.
- Thread starter raxo2222
- Start date
Those are changes, that you don't see in game, and only you see when editing files.
Those are internal tag renames to match what is displayed in game.
What you see is "thing" and what is inside is "TYPE_STUFF".
I change TYPE_STUFF to TYPE_THING
So we won't have to search for "thing" first to edit "TYPE_STUFF"
That is in game civic option is called Workforce, but internally its called LABOR.
I changed LABOR to WORKFORCE in that example.
Only one exception is: in game None was changed to Currency-less (Currency category).
That's because CIVIC_NONE could mess up EXE.
Also those savebreaking changes aren't pushed to SVN - they are on separate branch.
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Thunderbrd
C2C War Dog
We'd probably have to discuss each if we want to reconsider them, which we should do if we're looking to use a save break period to rename the TXT_KEYs and Type tags themselves. Making sure we agree on the naming is probably a good first step.
The first? I have no idea nor any opinion on that name change. I'm not really sure I get what either one means just by looking at the name. Seems to me all systems would have some amount of labor and workforce so how does either name capture a concept here?
The second? I think I like Fascist better, but I'm not really sure if that encapsulates the concept more than Totalitarianism or not. Fascism would be better if we went back towards that. I'm not sure why it was renamed.
The third? Atheism means something different to most of us in the US than it does in many other countries, particularly European minded ones where Atheism as a concept is not considered no religion but just a different way to see religion somehow.
Maybe this discussion deserves its own thread. Maybe it had one and we weren't paying much attention to it?
The first one is the name of the civic group, the group of all the mutually exclusive civics that pertain to labour.
Thunderbrd
C2C War Dog
That being the case, either term works equally well I suppose. Workforce might be a bit better imo due to it considering the possibility of AI doing most of the work, which I would say doesn't fit under the concept of 'labor' (painful toil) at all really.
I'm pretty sure the exe doesn't mind one way or another, but the dll would object big time to one being called NO_CIVIC as that is the reserved name for the NULL value for the civic enumeration.
So it seems like some internal tag names were better than current displayed names.
Others are pretty obvious like being typos or having kinda placeholder name like NO_SPEAK, that was renamed to NONVERBAL - displayed name for default Language civic.
Some renames just were matching spelling like "That thing" was "THATTHING" internally.
Others are pretty obvious like being typos or having kinda placeholder name like NO_SPEAK, that was renamed to NONVERBAL - displayed name for default Language civic.
Some renames just were matching spelling like "That thing" was "THATTHING" internally.
Dancing Hoskuld
Deity
Saying Atheist= Anti Religion is only true according to one American (USA) Dictionary. According to all other dictionaries (USA and world wide) saying Atheist=Anti Religion is equivalent to saying Christianity=Hindu.
Thunderbrd
C2C War Dog
What again does it mean to you exactly? Some kind of subset of Catholicism where you don't see God in the same light or something?
I'm not sure I understand the concept of Theism as a whole.
I renamed RELIGION_ tags so they now match ingame (displayed) name.
For example what was internally EGYPT_MYTHOLOGY is now KEMENTISM
As for civic names I think fascism (Can be Nazism too - most hardcore of authoritarian systems that existed
) would be cooler than totalitarianism as example.
Totalitarianism: I control everyone.
Fascism: I control everyone and I want to conquer world, no butter for you only cannons.
Nazism: I WILL CONSUME YOU IF YOU DEVIATE BY MILLIMETRE.
I just renamed internal tags so they match display names - much easier for modding if you can instantly search for tag without searching diplayed name first.
For example what was internally EGYPT_MYTHOLOGY is now KEMENTISM
As for civic names I think fascism (Can be Nazism too - most hardcore of authoritarian systems that existed
) would be cooler than totalitarianism as example.Totalitarianism: I control everyone.
Fascism: I control everyone and I want to conquer world, no butter for you only cannons.
Nazism: I WILL CONSUME YOU IF YOU DEVIATE BY MILLIMETRE.
I just renamed internal tags so they match display names - much easier for modding if you can instantly search for tag without searching diplayed name first.
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Dancing Hoskuld
Deity
Theism = there are gods or a god.
Atheism = there is no evidence there are gods or gods (or supernatural).
Except for a very few radical fundamentalist atheists most atheist have no problem with theists wasting their time and resources on their hobby.
On the other hand they do complain when one person or other claims that their religion is the one that the constitution (of whatever country) says is the "real" religion when there is no mention of any religion in it. By the way the first amendment of the US constitution is almost in direct contravention of the common Christian version of the first commandment.The problem there and with all the "new" names for the elder religions is that the names are not of the elder religion but the name of the revived modern version of the religion. It is sort of like how Australia used to be called New Holland so we will call the place that existed back in time Australia also.
It may be several weeks if not few months before those changes are implemented in SVN.
So what internal names for religions were better than display names?
I added list of religions, that got their internal name changed on beginning of thread.
Thunderbrd
C2C War Dog
So... you're distinguishing the civic as basically Atheism as a state religion then. Enforcing or at least strongly promoting the Atheist view to say no religion should be considered possible to be true, just as any other state may enforce or at least highly promote a view of any other particular religion. Free Religion doesn't matter what religion you have but designates that you believe all have a right to maintain their own views. I do sometimes wonder if some religions are completely incompatible with that view if you take them seriously. I mean you have many religions going out of their way to preach that theirs is the only right way to see things and that those who don't are outright evil incarnated. How do we make that fit into a world where everyone is supposed to accept that everyone believes whatever they do? Particularly when violence is urged by the religion itself?Theism = there are gods or a god.
Atheism = there is no evidence there are gods or gods (or supernatural).
Except for a very few radical fundamentalist atheists most atheist have no problem with theists wasting their time and resources on their hobby.
I found it so strange the comments that were made recently by our leadership... we love freedom of religion and religion and defend the right to express it, but let's be honest, if you're from a country that worships a particular religion predominantly, we are banning travel. Also, what we mean here is that our view of freedom of religion is such that you should be allowed to push your religious views on others all you wish, so long as its in agreement with OUR religious views.
I kinda feel like we're completely missing the point of religious freedom lately, and maybe in some ways the founders never considered the FULL width of religious variation that could exist outside of the realm of the Christian banner and were mostly thinking of empowering only variations on that particular religion rather than on religions as a whole. Or at least, that's what a lot of current citizens tend to think of religious freedom as being there to protect. Personally I'm thinking that religious freedom is being thrown out the window by religious bias and doing so while calling it in support of freedom. But that's a big off-topic really.
Back on topic, this is why Atheism needs to be a religion. To choose none is to make a choice. Again, though, that's an old discussion that isn't ready to be necessary yet. I think I can agree with the difference in definition between Atheism and Anti-Religion as a civic selection concept anyhow.
When I started my civics lore discussion these were already there for quite some time, so why are you just mentioning your concerns towards them now after they've been in for +2 years?
sunrisereader
Warlord
- Joined
- Jan 2, 2015
- Messages
- 185
A way to do it might be a autobuilding of the same type as the crime ones that is AI only that gives +stabiltiy.
JosEPh_II
TBS WarLord
I did mention some and you reverted a few. But No I did not comb thru all the changes. And also at that time other seemingly more important things were going on as well.
Part of my point is that while some of the changes may mean the same, But the newer names are much longer names, why cahnge them? Why is this a problem? Let me ask you this, why is a longer name better when the shorter name means the same thing? Plus you have Less characters to add up to inflate the size of text files. And many of those are too wordy and bloated anyway. Conservation of data space and being concise over verbose.
EDIT: And I'm getting old! Dang it!
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Dancing Hoskuld
Deity
Most state religions support religious freedom at different times. While Western European Christians (Catholics only, as Protestants had had not yet been invented) were persecuting any from other religions (mostly Jews and Moors) the various Islamic nations were very tolerant.
Atheism can't be a religion because everyone's is different to everyone else's. They have a congregation of 1! They don't have a common Cannon or Dogma nor are there buildings associated with it.
BTW I saw a very good reason why there are so few new religions spawning in modern times. Copyright Law does its best to squash them.
Thunderbrd
C2C War Dog
A religion does not require that. A religion is just a general ideology, a set of beliefs. Yes, there are variations but even standard religions vary on outlooks to the nth degree from one gathering to another. If you say there are 90% Christian but 10% undeclared, being of the firm belief that there is "no evidence there are gods or gods (or supernatural)" would be a portion of those. And btw, it is NOT just no evidence that unites the Atheist viewpoint, but rather that there is a belief that this means therefore there IS not god or gods or supernatural. The recognition of 'a lack of evidence, not enough or not conclusive' evidence is Agnosticism. It's when you take that step over into the 'belief' that there is NOT a God or religious viewpoint that could possibly be true, that you become what we'd call an Atheist. THAT is, itself, a faith.
And even Agnostic should be a religion. Again, without any buildings, cannon nor dogma. But it is what many people would say the are, isn't it? If I asked a person, "what's your religion?" whatever they could say qualifies as a religion. Even to say "I don't have one", because that, too, is a selection on the dropdown list of possible answers. Those non-religions wouldn't be in any way 'balanced', but if the state adopts one of them as a state religion, as China has done regarding Atheism, it may well lean towards trying to eliminate other religions.
Interesting theory about Copyright Law. I believe it's more because since the invention of the scientific method, people have put their faith in scientific method as the only source of information they will accept as likely truth. The doctrine of Scientific Method is such that until there is evidence, that lack of evidence can be construed as evidence to suggest that the concept lacks cause to be true. The more a person attaches to this, the more likely they are to claim to be Atheist as opposed to Agnostic (open minded/declared to be unsure).
The religious disabling system, along with Developing Leaders, Complex Traits, and our civics, are designed to give this range of variation between being accepting of non-state faiths or not.
Dancing Hoskuld
Deity
Except it has stopped religions. The Star Wars "Force" one has continued in the face of law suits. Others haven't.
Most atheists and agnostics would say "I have no religion". When asked "what is your religion?".
Yudishtira
Spiritual/Creative
Atheism is in denial as to the degree of dogma (beliefs that aren't evidence-based) and thus religion involved, but that doesn't alter the facts.
