SCENARIO: Age of Exploration (1492)

[Birdmanz]

Is there a way to Add Barbarian Towns?

If not i have to remove 1 or 2 European country in exchange for more Depth outside Europe.

I want to add The Muslim States (World wide variety of ports from North Africa to Indonesia).

Countries Small enough to be able to remove without changing the Political Situation a lot.

Ireland, Helvetia, Romanian Princes, Napoli.

I would choose to remove Ireland, so i can give England 1 more starter city anyway, but i will wait for your suggestions!

I want to keep the Vatican state for the sake of historical Reality.

 

[Birdmanz]

Yes Ideal city locations. Shown in cheezy the Whiz's mod. You'll have to autoproduce the cetlars though.

Can you explain?
What mod of cheezy, INEMONH? (im downloading it ATM)

Sidenote: I just was viewing screenshots of INEMONH, the map is in a much bigger size, for the sake of turn speed i kept a 180x180 Map with Bigger Europe, done by Rhye's.
But yes it would help a lot to place cities, also you have Google Map, EU2, EU3, or Other Related games to do this

 

[Alan McG]

Ireland was already occupied by England in 1492, thats why there are 2 cities in Ireland that are English.
You asked me if i need support, well i do, its not a hard task, i need to find unit graphics for each country during this era, there are plenty of em in the forum, its just that im doing so many things atm, i was concentrating on resources, making the images and defining what they give, etc.

Sorry, had not seen the "spoiler" tags. Your units look pretty generic to me, anything against using the default ones?

 

[Birdmanz]

Sorry, had not seen the "spoiler" tags. Your units look pretty generic to me, anything against using the default ones?

Well i plan to do Generic Units to start with mostly in the Medieval era, remember most Medieval era tech tree are already granted to to all Europeans from start.

I have to plan on units for each Country for each Historical Era.
But besides what i plan, i would need ship graphics (Standard have few units).
Even when the starter units i planned so far looks standard, the basic units of the game don't cover all of em.

Any suggestions on Units for each era would be great.

Btw i have to define the Exact years of each era, so we can have an idea on what units/improvements to place in each one.

 

[RedwallFortress]

Well i plan to do Generic Units to start with mostly in the Medieval era, remember most Medieval era tech tree are already granted to to all Europeans from start.

I have to plan on units for each Country for each Historical Era.
But besides what i plan, i would need ship graphics (Standard have few units).
Even when the starter units i planned so far looks standard, the basic units of the game don't cover all of em.

Any suggestions on Units for each era would be great.

Btw i have to define the Exact years of each era, so we can have an idea on what units/improvements to place in each one.

You could look in the The Unit Library. There are many different units in the Library, including ships.

 

[RedwallFortress]

1. OMG if forgot i still had to add Russia, well i ran out of Countries Easy i bet, Egypt historically was occupied in the 1500's is there any point in adding em?.
2. I can't tell about Berbers, they were fine traders, but im running out of tags, and i want to keep the Political Depth in Europe.
3. Yes indeed, i forgot about that, thanks for remainding of the invasion in 1415, i just read that Henry the Navigator along with many other princes participated in the conquest.
4. Mmm the fact is that in 1492 Dutch people was still Catholic the Reformation didn't had come yet.
And the Dutch revolted from Spain, since after the Hapsburg and Spanish crown union Lowlands was passed to Spain, Austria kept a few territories in France only (old lands of Burgundy).
So if i add the Dutch they won't gain any personalized tech/unit until the Reformation Era.

The Mameluke dynasty ruled Egypt and Syria until 1517. So they still existed for two decades after 1492.
You should add Persia, the Safavid in this period ruled not only Iran, but Iraq, Western Afghanistan, part of Central Asia, and the Caucasus.
North Africa in 1492 was home to the powerful Saanian kingdom of Morocco. Their Army fought the Portuguese, Spanish, and Ottoman Turks with marked success.
This scenario starts in about the period, when Muhammad Babur first created the Mughal Empire in India. The Mughal should be included, ruling Eastern Afghanistan, Pakistan, and Northern India.

 

[Birdmanz]

The Mameluke dynasty ruled Egypt and Syria until 1517. So they still existed for two decades after 1492.
You should add Persia, the Safavid in this period ruled not only Iran, but Iraq, Western Afghanistan, part of Central Asia, and the Caucasus.
North Africa in 1492 was home to the powerful Saanian kingdom of Morocco. Their Army fought the Portuguese, Spanish, and Ottoman Turks with marked success.
This scenario starts in about the period, when Muhammad Babur first created the Mughal Empire in India. The Mughal should be included, ruling Eastern Afghanistan, Pakistan, and Northern India.

Egypt: So they still existed for two decades after 1492..
I don't think we should waste a tag in a country that should last 20 years only, this mod covers a long timespan.

I would love CIV III to have more than 31 Countries, but it doesn't.
We have to wisely chose what countries to mod and what not.

What i did to add a lot of Muslim states that aren't the Ottomans, is add a Muslim Nation.

Did you ever played Uncharted Waters 2? (SNES version used to be far much better than the version on the other platforms).

Well most of the world that wasn't involved in great wars against Europeans in this era, will be added as ports, yes just to be there to generate trade shipments.

I plan to give more depth to areas like China, Japan, America and India.

While Africa and Middle East, Indonesia and Indochina will be merely ports cities.

Most of the African continent, except for north Africa, was barely explored during this era.

I will allow a few places here and there to construct basic colonies (by using the cheezy ideas).

With the current country configuration i planned, i have 2 tag free to add an important country, since i didn't added Ireland, removed Bohemia, and Romanian Princes.

I don't have many countries left to remove in Europe, becouse if i unite Lithuania and Poland, it will be a huge, or the map would look very uncompleted.

Any ideas are more than welcome, remember we have 31 Tags only, and atm we have 2 left only. (I think we should add a Shiite nation like the Safavids, or do something similar to the Muslim Ports).

 

[Birdmanz]

I Modified the marsh to behave as in Cheezy mod, now named Habitable land, i have one problem, the map looks so ugly now, that most places looks deformed, this is noticed were i replaced plains with Habitable Land.

Is there a way to make this Habitable Land (marsh), to deal with water borders like plains do? (Marsh borders always seems to be like grasslands).

 

[RedwallFortress]

Egypt: So they still existed for two decades after 1492..
I don't think we should waste a tag in a country that should last 20 years only, this mod covers a long timespan.

I would love CIV III to have more than 31 Countries, but it doesn't.
We have to wisely chose what countries to mod and what not.

What i did to add a lot of Muslim states that aren't the Ottomans, is add a Muslim Nation.

Did you ever played Uncharted Waters 2? (SNES version used to be far much better than the version on the other platforms).

Well most of the world that wasn't involved in great wars against Europeans in this era, will be added as ports, yes just to be there to generate trade shipments.

I plan to give more depth to areas like China, Japan, America and India.

While Africa and Middle East, Indonesia and Indochina will be merely ports cities.

Most of the African continent, except for north Africa, was barely explored during this era.

I will allow a few places here and there to construct basic colonies (by using the cheezy ideas).

With the current country configuration i planned, i have 2 tag free to add an important country, since i didn't added Ireland, removed Bohemia, and Romanian Princes.

I don't have many countries left to remove in Europe, becouse if i unite Lithuania and Poland, it will be a huge, or the map would look very uncompleted.

Any ideas are more than welcome, remember we have 31 Tags only, and atm we have 2 left only. (I think we should add a Shiite nation like the Safavids, or do something similar to the Muslim Ports).

I understand that the Game is limited to 31 Civs, but some Civs are to important to be ignored. I was actually planing to make a scenario about this period to, but never quite found the time. I still have a lot of the plans and info I gather for the project. I will dig up and post the list of civs 31 I planed to add to my scenario, maybe you will find it interesting.

You should definitely add Safavid Persia, there should be at least one strong Muslim Power in the game beside the Ottomans.

 

[Birdmanz]

I understand that the Game is limited to 31 Civs, but some Civs are to important to be ignored. I was actually planing to make a scenario about this period to, but never quite found the time. I still have a lot of the plans and info I gather for the project. I will dig up and post the list of civs 31 I planed to add to my scenario, maybe you will find it interesting.

You should definitely add Safavid Persia, there should be at least one strong Muslim Power in the game beside the Ottomans.

One thing i forgot in 1492, the Safavid were called Ak Koyunlu, but after the Shiite revolution they were called them self Persia or Safavids, and years later (around 1520) invaded the Sunni Eastern neighbor Timurid Empire (Or what was left of it anyway) to form almost what is today Persia, it was a bit bigger by that time.

 

[Alan McG]

I understand that the Game is limited to 31 Civs, but some Civs are to important to be ignored. I was actually planing to make a scenario about this period to, but never quite found the time. I still have a lot of the plans and info I gather for the project. I will dig up and post the list of civs 31 I planed to add to my scenario, maybe you will find it interesting.

I also have an scenario planned and started for a similar period, from the time of the Armada till Napoleon. But it only included Europe, so my civs where different from the ones I guess you'll want to use.

 

[Birdmanz]

I Modified the marsh to behave as in Cheezy mod, now named Habitable land, i have one problem, the map looks so ugly now, that most places looks deformed, this is noticed were i replaced plains with Habitable Land.

Is there a way to make this Habitable Land (marsh), to deal with water borders like plains do? (Marsh borders always seems to be like grasslands).

Besides that problem that i didn't solved yet..

Edited: I already found out about the arrows..

Anybody knows what are the image names for the Science Advisor Arrows?

Im finishing the Medieval Era Tech Tree, and i don't know how to replace arrows..

 

[RedwallFortress]

Hello Birdmanz.
Regaring what you asked: No I have not played Uncharted Waters, I've been to busy playing Civ3.

I am well aware of the weakness of most of the Non European world in this period. I do not blame you for not wanting to waste tags on them.

The Persian Safavid's are the only Shiite country in the period, just as Iran is today. However it is only right to put the The Gunpowder Empires into the Scenario. The Ottomans, Safavid's, And Mughal's were the the only powers able to significantly resist European Aggression.

I suggest you create a civ called Hindu-Buddhist States. It could cover southern India, the part that is not under the Mughal, Sri Lanka, Burma, Vietnam, Thailand, Cambodia, etc...

I also suggest you add Morocco. It would provide another Muslim power in the west beside the Ottomans, and it also could be a navel rival to the Europeans and Turks in the western Mediterranean. Also it remained independent from European Colonialism until 1912!!!

 

[Virote_Considon]

I completely agree with adding Persia. They were very important in this period, particularly relating to the Ottomans in their West, and European colonization of India in the East.

 

[Mirc]

This looks great! Looking forward to the download.

And very well presented too.

Spoiler :

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/06/OttomanEmpireIn1683.png

No no no no NO! This map is totally wrong! It's the most biased map I've seen on Wiki!! (look on the talk page to see how many complaints have been made about that map, some of them won't be visible though as they are archived - they were so many!)

Crimea, (Southern) Poland, Wallachia, Moldova, Eritrea, Ethiopia have all NEVER been inside the Ottoman Empire! Never, it's a joke map!!!

 

[Virote_Considon]

I think the Crimea was under Ottoman rule at some point, Mirc. The rest of it, you're no doubt right on

 

[Mirc]

I think the Crimea was under Ottoman rule at some point, Mirc. The rest of it, you're no doubt right on

Possibly, but all I know of is that they have been a vassal. Of course, they were a puppet state for a long time, but all the other countries were clearly not in the Ottoman Empire. (by any standards)

 

[RedwallFortress]

The Ottomans did not ever manage to establish an effective system on administration for the countries you listed (Crimea, (Southern) Poland, Wallachia, Moldova, Eritrea, Ethiopia). Most those states were at most temporary vessels the the Sultan, at least for some years after the Turks crushed there armies in battle.

 

[Mirc]

The Ottomans did not ever manage to establish an effective system on administration for the countries you listed (Crimea, (Southern) Poland, Wallachia, Moldova, Eritrea, Ethiopia). Most those states were at most temporary vessels the the Sultan, at least for some years after the Turks crushed there armies in battle.

Exactly, the only relation they had with the Ottomans was temporary vassalship after a strong defeat in battle. Not only did they not manage to establish an effective system on administration, but they were also never able to enforce their religion or culture (unlike in Asia Minor, or parts of north-eastern Africa), and there were always real borders, with taxes and everything, which separated those countries from the Ottoman Empire. For example, in this part of Europe the border was the Danube for centuries. Which automatically sets Poland, Moldova and Wallachia in a different country than the Ottomans. That map on Wiki is made by a Turkish guy BTW.

Anyway, I'm going off-topic - this looks like an excellent scenario in the making, and I'm going to congratulate (again) the OP for the great presentation of it.

 

[Birdmanz]

Thanks all of you for supporting me, this is the first mod I'm working on, and its great to have such feedback.

Im adding Safavid cities at this moment .

I been working a lot on this mod, honestly I'm hoping to deliver some alpha for this weekend (obviously is to test some game mechanics, as there will be just few units for the Medieval era only).

The only thing that keeps worrying me atm is how to fix the map areas affected by the Habitable Land area, some of em are really so ugly to try to publish them in a finished version.

On the other hand i was battling my head deciding how Main and Port cities will be differenced from themselves, and i came up with many ideas I'm testing today.

After adding the Safavid Empire, we have one tag left, i might add the Mughals or Morocco, but maybe we are forgetting someone more important, any suggestions?

One thing i also have in mind is maybe moving the starting years a bit ahead, closer to 1520, since a lot of Nations would be annexed shortly after 1492, starting in 1492 with the current map might be a bit unhistorical.

Note: Remember i keep the first posts updated after adding something to the mod.