SGOTM 02 - VQ Black

namliaM · Aug 19, 2006

Hakkaido it is

On war vs Spain, I think we want to take Barca, then pause for 10 turns? and kill her after that with Sams?

We really need to pay attention on BT and whipping, cause it slips easy... Ideally we want to Whip on every 14th turn and maybe we could hire an Engineer instead of an Artist? It would double the production and who can ignore a GE?

eektor · Aug 19, 2006

I got it

. Let's see summary of what I read. Keep fighting Spain. Raze or ignore jungle cities. Research MC -> machinery. MM Osaka to work wheat. Whip forges and harbors.

Sounds good?

Cosmichail · Aug 19, 2006

Eektor the only jungle city we want to keep is Barcelona. Now hope I didn't infuence you from VQ07 about being evil and razing holy cities. That shrine will net us some coin.

namliaM · Aug 20, 2006

I would ignore but not raze, if we leave her some cities she will cough up some techs for peace...
If we leave her near nothing she wont...
And eventually we want to fill up Hakkaido and maintenance wouldnt be sky high... Oh and UP the science rate a bit and invest that war loot into science....

And make sure to cover/defend the captured cities, you never know when a stray axe/sword (barb or spainish) may pop up.

pigswill · Aug 20, 2006

I reckon it's worth keeping hold of Seville and Barcelona (minor detail of taking them first). Maybe bargain/exploit for peace leaving Bella with Toledo and Madrid. Second phase: raze Toledo, keep Madrid. Cordoba we could either whip for barracks/ units or settler.

namliaM · Aug 20, 2006

I was thinking a little... Arent AIs reluctant to give up Monopolies? Or what they think to be?
How much is Bella going to give up? Why not just smash her up..?

Cosmichail · Aug 20, 2006

Yep the quicker we finish her off the quicker we can get our science up and get to Astronomy. Then we can start sending troops from Hokkaido to other continent and finish them off. Only one I would raze is Toledo which we seem all agreed on. She probably won't give up much but we could try.

Did you notice Ratpack is already at 1200's ad. Good score too. Looking forward to see what we can do with BT/cats on new continent.

eektor · Aug 20, 2006

Sorry for the hold up. Took me more time than I thought for VQ08. Going to start soon.

eektor · Aug 20, 2006

Turn 0: 710 AD
Whipped Library in Edo

Turn 1: 725 AD
Barb Archer commits suicide on our Archer near the Barb City
Osaka: Axeman -> Swordsman
Tokyo: Catapult -> Catapult
Edo: Library -> Catapult
Put two scientists in Edo
Satsuma: Workboat -> Worker
While exploring discovered a cultural boundary of our last mysterious unknown civ.

Turn 2: 740 AD
Metal Casting -> Machinery (We want samurais!!!)
The mystery civ is Mao
Kagoshima settled on Stone Island. Started a courthouse

Turn 3: 755 AD
Two Spanish galleys move toward our new clams.
Sigh, wont be able to get a galley in time either to protect.
Only an axeman and archer guarding Seville!
Seems like theres more units in Toledo than anywhere else in the Spanish cities.

Turn 4: 770 AD
Cordoba comes out of revolt (we get more money because of the shrine!!!) starts building an archer.
The Spanish threatens our sheep with two chariots. I killed one with spearman, lost an axe on 80% odds and killed it with the other axe.

Turn 5: 785 AD

Turn 6: 800 AD
Decided to use GS for Philosophy, no point in letting it sit there and I didnt think Kyoto was a good place for an academy.
Traded Literature for 30 gold and Monotheism.
Traded Code of Laws to KK for HBR.

Turn 7: 815 AD

Turn 8: 830 AD
Mao asks for OB, I said sure, why not.
Captured Seville. Lost two swords.

Turn 9: 845 AD

Turn 10: 860 AD

Turn 11: 875 AD
Toledo captured and razed.
The only reason why it was easy to capture was because Spanish sent out a counter attack force to Osaka. Unfortunately I wasnt ready for that and I decided to whip an axeman in Osaka to help.

Turn 12: 890 AD
The counter attack force pillaged our iron and sheep but I was able to finish them off.

Turn 13: 905 AD

Turn 14: 920 AD
Lost pasture in Tokyo to barb warrior. Came out of nowhere. I might not have seen it because of the other enemies appearing next to other cities.

Turn 15: 935 AD
1 turn to Machinery
3 turns to hook up Iron and get ready for Samurais!!!

After turn comments:

Well, I must say everything went well til the last 5 turns. The counterattack messed us up and then I lost a pasture in Tokyo. This made me realize we are pretty short of workers. We only have 2 and we got a lot of land to improve. I would suggest to hook up sheep and rice asap. Also to road up the cities and rebuild the pasture in Tokyo. We have a good force in Osaka healing. With that force and the ones left over in Seville, Barcelona should be easy pickings with Madrid next. Lets hurry up and finish the Spanish so we can quickly get this continent up and running and then churning out units.

Spoiler :

namliaM · Aug 21, 2006

Iron pillaged ... :cry:

Sheep pillaged :cry:

Well guess we just need Catapults then...

Yeah we are short on workers, but we will capture some from spain to aid in the work (and in the chop)
Why trade for HBR? Guess we need it for Knights?

pigswill · Aug 21, 2006

Details, details. Pillaging easy to fix tho we do need more workers; as namliaM pointed out spain should provide some. Mao and CKN is bad news for samurai so either get him before machinery or leave him till last. But sounds overall a good set of turns and certainly moving in the right direction.

Edit: looked at the save. Barbs will continue to plague us in the south. Two solutions: build settlers next in Osaka and Tokyo and found cities to drive out the fog or else upgrade existing archer fogbusters to crossbows.

eektor · Aug 21, 2006

I decided to go for HBR because KK was behind and it was a tech pretty much everyone else had. I think it was pretty good because now that we have no iron I decided to build a Horse Archer to help us out in our fight.

As for Mao he already has Machinery (I believe). I think he's the most advanced too. We should save him for last and get him with calvaries I think. I did a lot of exploring and Hatty has a nice huge empire. I'm thinking we might want to consider taking her out first.

As for capturing Spain's workers, I haven't seen any. I'm hoping they are all by Madrid and Barcelona.

bobrath · Aug 21, 2006

Play-prep questions:
What's the keep/raize plan on Izzy's cities?
What's the suggested upcoming tech path?
Who's the suggested next target AI? (one vote for Hatty so far)

Cosmichail · Aug 21, 2006

Hey Bob

Look's like only Barcelona/Madrid left and Toledo is razed/Seville captured. Good keeping Seville as it has sugar with plantation.
Suggested tech path (NamliaM and other concur) Machinery (1 turn) compass-->optics to get us to Astronomy.

I think that vote for Hatty is mine.

I checked with all civs (looked at save) anybody will trade philosophy for feudalism and that's about it. Khan has compass but not willing to trade.

Also Kyoto is working two sea tiles (2f2c) when we could take off one and work fish and have a citizen for hammers towards forge. Cordoba is building a worker and we seem to have a decent military to take out the rest.

Also Isabella is not willing to give up theology or any other techs for peace so let's just finish her. She is harassing us 3 galleys. (typical Izzy) so we can't work those clams until she is gone. Barb is at Tokyo and hopefully he will attack Tokyo but could move around to pillage horses. If he does once he gets out into the open we could attack but a slight risk only have one archer in Tokyo.

eektor · Aug 21, 2006

I was thinking that vote for Hatty was mine too.

I agree Astronomy should be our next tech to beeline too.

As for which to attack first I have two ideas.

1. attacking Hatty. She's the strongest one and closest to our cities on the Spanish continent.

2. attacking Mansa(?) or another weak one. This way we get a good foothold capturing the cities and then use those to wipe out the others one by one and I would say take out Hatty next.

I saw that people were willing to trade philosophy for feudalism but I wasn't sure if we were trying to go for liberalism and didn't want to give philosophy away for that reason.

In Tokyo we would have a catapult to take out the warrior if he doesn't attack the city.

bobrath · Aug 21, 2006

Sounds good. I won't be playing until after work, so still plenty of time for others to weigh in.

pigswill · Aug 21, 2006

Basically wipe out spain asap, settle rest of island and research towards astronomy. This phase will take a couple of turnsets at least; so plenty of time to work on invasion strategy.

LuvToBuild · Aug 21, 2006

If we go after Hatty soon then we will for sure want to have Astronomy ASAP. Keep in mind that she is kind of buddy buddy with Bismarck so if we attack her prior to Astronomy, we need to be prepared for a no turning back offense against her since Bismarck might close his borders to us, closing off the possibility of reinforcements. I think namliaM mentioned that before and I'm probably just restating the obvious.

Since we are already at war with Mansa, I think we should try and take Timbuktu after finishing Izzy and building up a decent landing force in BT. Timbuktu has iron in the BFC and if we can get the borders pushed back out without the Mongolians or Germans pushing up against us, we might be able to use Timbuktu as our Samurai launching base. For pushing the borders out, we can either put off Calendar until taking Timbuktu and having a freebie obelisk build culture again, or we can switch to Christianity as the state religion until the borders in Timbuktu pop and then switch back to whatever we want afterwards.

bobrath · Aug 22, 2006

The Save

Two Spainish cities fell, I captured one and raized the other, cause it was just plain ugly and useless.

Here's the capture (with before and after force shots):

Course the one that I raized was Santiago, got all of 3 gold for taking it out...

One trade offered during my turns:

I did not accept it, I'll leave tech trading up to my betters.

One demand for tribute (that I refused and then asked what he would give us for it):

We have Machinery and Compass, but it took a bit longer to get compass because we ran out of cash. Our GNP is just plain ugly.

The good (bad?) news is that we did not lose a single unit during my turn sets (even the first suicide cat managed to withdraw). I did push out and archer and our horse archer to fog busting duty.

We have open borders with Khan and peace with Mansa (he paid us 10g to stop beating him down).

Mao and Hatty have Optics (spotted on caravel from Mao near Kyoto). We may not be able to stay isolated there much longer. Completed two more cats in BT and overflowed into the forges. Stone island will complete its courthouse next turn. Forges prolly need another overflow whip to finish off, they both have whip unhappy to wear off tho.

I would suggest that unless we're going to use religion as a diplo tool that we convert to no state religion as that will massively improve our cultural output. The only thing that being Hindu gets us now is 2 smilies and a spy into Izzy's capital.

Speaking of, here's the remainder of her forces:

I've got that Axe camped on the hill to make life rougher.

The upcoming battle (and I assume death of Izzy):

And the new mainland:

I didn't try extorting Izzy, but I only finished taking Barcelona this turn. I'd suggest not bothering because she'll only plop down another crappy city north of our capital and we'll have to "waste" forces cleaning it up. Up to the team tho.

Enjoy!

Turnlog of Love

Spoiler :

namliaM · Aug 22, 2006

eektor said:
I was thinking that vote for Hatty was mine too.

I agree Astronomy should be our next tech to beeline too.

As for which to attack first I have two ideas.

1. attacking Hatty. She's the strongest one and closest to our cities on the Spanish continent.

2. attacking Mansa(?) or another weak one. This way we get a good foothold capturing the cities and then use those to wipe out the others one by one and I would say take out Hatty next.

I saw that people were willing to trade philosophy for feudalism but I wasn't sure if we were trying to go for liberalism and didn't want to give philosophy away for that reason.

In Tokyo we would have a catapult to take out the warrior if he doesn't attack the city.

Hatthy seems the logical choice... OR Mansa... He would make a nice jumping platform if we can conquer 2, 3 or 4 of his cities..
I.E. Get some of Mansa's (preverably Iron) cities (thus slowing the normaly tech monster) and start some Sams/Cats. Then start attacking Hatty... By the time we are ready with Hatty, we should be able to pincer Bismark. Move most of the troops to Mansa land, while building new in Hatty land. Then attack from 2 sides...

Oh.... :drool:

I like timbuktoe...

Have Ivory as well, maybe we could add an elephant or 2 just in case we encounter horse things...
I think Timbuktoe (appart from the obvious GERMAN pressure would be OK vs the Mongolian culture. The nearest citie looks to be NW, N, N of the stone we can see...

I suggest using the whip to finish the Forges in BT. So we can start running some Engineers. (double the production of a citizen) Also after that we can start building some Cats and Archer/LBs.

Question: What Specialist, under what circumstances would offer to put beakers into Optics/Astronomy??? I would look myself, but dont have the time at the moment

Edit2: Crossposted with Bob, nice set... To bad about the prophet having to die, doesnt she have a nice religion to found?

SGOTM 02 - VQ Black

Deity

Prince

Dark Lord of The Sith

Deity

fly (one day)

Deity

Dark Lord of The Sith

Prince

Prince

Deity

fly (one day)

Prince

Emperor

Dark Lord of The Sith

Prince

Emperor

fly (one day)

Prince

Emperor

Deity

Similar threads