SGOTM 03 - Smurkz

[Methos]

Niklas... any news?

He knows its his turn, due to this post from SGOTM12.

Haha, but of course I want all the fun! But seriously, no, I'm still up in our CIV game and have been so for the past week, and if CB had finished I would have asked for a swap anyway.

Since I brought it up anyway, please note that the SGOTM12 game is a very interesting read.

 

[Niklas]

>>The Save<<

I played an extra 5 quick turns to somewhat make up for my lateness. And since it's 2 AM, you'll have to make do with my auto-turnlog until tomorrow. It's an interesting read.

Here is your Session Turn Log from 1589 AD to 1664 AD:

Turn 333, 1589 AD: Judaism has spread in Rome.
Turn 333, 1589 AD: The revolution has begun!!!
Turn 333, 1589 AD: Smurkz adopts Universal Suffrage!
Turn 333, 1589 AD: Smurkz adopts Emancipation!
Turn 333, 1589 AD: Smurkz adopts Free Religion!
Turn 333, 1589 AD: Great Scientist has been born in Barcelona!
Turn 333, 1589 AD: Kobo-Daishi has been born in Lyons!

Turn 334, 1592 AD: Frederick adopts Bureaucracy!

Turn 335, 1595 AD: Isambard Kingdom Brunel has been born in Kyoto!
Turn 335, 1595 AD: Saladin adopts Representation!
Turn 335, 1595 AD: Jalal al-Din Rumi has been born in Tenochtitlan!

Turn 337, 1601 AD: You have discovered Steel!
Turn 337, 1601 AD: Hatshepsut adopts Emancipation!
Turn 337, 1601 AD: Louis XIV adopts Emancipation!

Turn 339, 1607 AD: Tokugawa adopts Free Religion!
Turn 339, 1607 AD: Kublai Khan adopts Emancipation!
Turn 339, 1607 AD: Mao Zedong adopts Representation!

Turn 340, 1610 AD: The borders of Neapolis have expanded!
Turn 340, 1610 AD: Cyrus adopts Representation!
Turn 340, 1610 AD: Cyrus adopts Emancipation!
Turn 340, 1610 AD: Cyrus adopts Free Market!

Turn 341, 1613 AD: Great Scientist has been born in Vladivostok!

Turn 342, 1616 AD: You have discovered Steam Power!
Turn 342, 1616 AD: You have trained a Frigate in Irkutzk. Work has now begun on a Galleon.
Turn 342, 1616 AD: Isabella adopts Representation!
Turn 342, 1616 AD: Montezuma adopts Representation!

Turn 343, 1619 AD: You have constructed a Theatre in Vladivostok. Work has now begun on a Lighthouse.
Turn 343, 1619 AD: St. Thomas Aquinas has been born in Washington!

Turn 345, 1625 AD: Montezuma has declared war on you!

Turn 346, 1628 AD: You have discovered Communism!
Turn 346, 1628 AD: Mansa Musa has declared war on Montezuma!
Turn 346, 1628 AD: Hatshepsut has declared war on Montezuma!
Turn 346, 1628 AD: Victoria has declared war on Montezuma!
Turn 346, 1628 AD: You have constructed a Laboratory in Kiev. Work has now begun on The Eiffel Tower.
Turn 346, 1628 AD: Mansa Musa adopts Theocracy!
Turn 346, 1628 AD: Julius Caesar adopts Free Market!
Turn 346, 1628 AD: Victoria adopts Theocracy!
Turn 346, 1628 AD: Saladin adopts Free Market!

Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cannon (12.00) vs Montezuma's Cavalry (18.00)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Combat Odds: 9.9%
Turn 347, 1631 AD: (Extra Combat: +20%)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Cavalry is hit for 16 (84/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Cavalry is hit for 16 (68/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cannon is hit for 24 (76/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cannon is hit for 24 (52/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cannon is hit for 24 (28/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cannon is hit for 24 (4/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cannon is hit for 24 (0/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Cavalry has defeated Smurkz's Cannon!
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cossack (19.80) vs Montezuma's Grenadier (14.04)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Combat Odds: 88.3%
Turn 347, 1631 AD: (Extra Combat: -10%)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: (Extra Combat: +30%)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cossack is hit for 17 (83/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Grenadier is hit for 23 (67/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Grenadier is hit for 23 (44/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cossack is hit for 17 (66/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cossack is hit for 17 (49/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Grenadier is hit for 23 (21/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cossack is hit for 17 (32/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Grenadier is hit for 23 (0/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cossack has defeated Montezuma's Grenadier!
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cossack (21.60) vs Montezuma's Cavalry (11.53)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Combat Odds: 98.8%
Turn 347, 1631 AD: (Extra Combat: -20%)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: (Extra Combat: +20%)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: (Combat: -50%)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Cavalry is hit for 27 (73/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Cavalry is hit for 27 (46/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Cavalry is hit for 27 (19/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cossack is hit for 14 (86/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Cavalry is hit for 27 (0/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cossack has defeated Montezuma's Cavalry!
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cossack (19.80) vs Montezuma's Cavalry (10.71)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Combat Odds: 98.7%
Turn 347, 1631 AD: (Extra Combat: -10%)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: (Extra Combat: +10%)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: (Combat: -50%)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Cavalry is hit for 27 (73/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Cavalry is hit for 27 (46/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Cavalry is hit for 27 (19/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Cavalry is hit for 27 (0/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cossack has defeated Montezuma's Cavalry!
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cossack (18.00) vs Montezuma's Cavalry (10.49)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Combat Odds: 96.5%
Turn 347, 1631 AD: (Extra Combat: +20%)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: (Combat: -50%)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Cavalry is hit for 25 (66/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Cavalry is hit for 25 (41/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cossack is hit for 15 (85/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cossack is hit for 15 (70/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Cavalry is hit for 25 (16/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Cavalry is hit for 25 (0/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cossack has defeated Montezuma's Cavalry!
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cossack (18.00) vs Montezuma's Cavalry (10.49)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Combat Odds: 96.5%
Turn 347, 1631 AD: (Extra Combat: +20%)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: (Combat: -50%)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cossack is hit for 15 (85/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Cavalry is hit for 25 (66/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Cavalry is hit for 25 (41/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Cavalry is hit for 25 (16/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Cavalry is hit for 25 (0/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cossack has defeated Montezuma's Cavalry!
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cossack (18.00) vs Montezuma's Cavalry (10.49)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Combat Odds: 96.5%
Turn 347, 1631 AD: (Extra Combat: +20%)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: (Combat: -50%)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cossack is hit for 15 (85/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Cavalry is hit for 25 (66/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cossack is hit for 15 (70/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cossack is hit for 15 (55/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Cavalry is hit for 25 (41/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cossack is hit for 15 (40/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Cavalry is hit for 25 (16/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Cavalry is hit for 25 (0/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cossack has defeated Montezuma's Cavalry!
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cossack (18.00) vs Montezuma's Cavalry (9.74)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Combat Odds: 97.3%
Turn 347, 1631 AD: (Extra Combat: +10%)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: (Combat: -50%)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Cavalry is hit for 26 (65/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cossack is hit for 15 (85/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Cavalry is hit for 26 (39/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cossack is hit for 15 (70/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Cavalry is hit for 26 (13/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Cavalry is hit for 26 (0/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cossack has defeated Montezuma's Cavalry!
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cossack (18.00) vs Montezuma's Cavalry (9.74)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Combat Odds: 97.3%
Turn 347, 1631 AD: (Extra Combat: +10%)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: (Combat: -50%)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Cavalry is hit for 26 (65/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cossack is hit for 15 (85/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cossack is hit for 15 (70/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cossack is hit for 15 (55/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Cavalry is hit for 26 (39/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Cavalry is hit for 26 (13/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Cavalry is hit for 26 (0/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cossack has defeated Montezuma's Cavalry!
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cossack (18.00) vs Montezuma's Cavalry (7.84)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Combat Odds: 99.8%
Turn 347, 1631 AD: (Extra Combat: +20%)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: (Combat: -50%)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cossack is hit for 14 (86/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Cavalry is hit for 27 (41/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cossack is hit for 14 (72/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Cavalry is hit for 27 (14/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cossack is hit for 14 (58/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Cavalry is hit for 27 (0/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Cossack has defeated Montezuma's Cavalry!
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Rifleman (14.00) vs Montezuma's Catapult (5.00)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Combat Odds: 99.9%
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Catapult is hit for 32 (68/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Catapult is hit for 32 (36/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Catapult is hit for 32 (4/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Catapult is hit for 32 (0/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Rifleman has defeated Montezuma's Catapult!
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Rifleman (14.00) vs Montezuma's Catapult (5.00)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Combat Odds: 99.9%
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Catapult is hit for 32 (68/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Catapult is hit for 32 (36/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Rifleman is hit for 12 (88/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Rifleman is hit for 12 (76/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Rifleman is hit for 12 (64/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Catapult is hit for 32 (4/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Montezuma's Catapult is hit for 32 (0/100HP)
Turn 347, 1631 AD: Smurkz's Rifleman has defeated Montezuma's Catapult!

Turn 348, 1634 AD: Smurkz's Cossack (19.80) vs Montezuma's Catapult (4.20)
Turn 348, 1634 AD: Combat Odds: 100.0%
Turn 348, 1634 AD: (Extra Combat: -10%)
Turn 348, 1634 AD: Montezuma's Catapult is hit for 38 (46/100HP)
Turn 348, 1634 AD: Montezuma's Catapult is hit for 38 (8/100HP)
Turn 348, 1634 AD: Smurkz's Cossack is hit for 10 (90/100HP)
Turn 348, 1634 AD: Montezuma's Catapult is hit for 38 (0/100HP)
Turn 348, 1634 AD: Smurkz's Cossack has defeated Montezuma's Catapult!
Turn 348, 1634 AD: You have trained a Work Boat in Beijing. Work has now begun on a Laboratory.
Turn 348, 1634 AD: Hatshepsut adopts Vassalage!

Turn 349, 1637 AD: Smurkz's Galleon (4.40) vs Montezuma's Caravel (3.60)
Turn 349, 1637 AD: Combat Odds: 73.8%
Turn 349, 1637 AD: (Extra Combat: -10%)
Turn 349, 1637 AD: (Extra Combat: +10%)
Turn 349, 1637 AD: (Plot Defense: +10%)
Turn 349, 1637 AD: Montezuma's Caravel is hit for 22 (78/100HP)
Turn 349, 1637 AD: Montezuma's Caravel is hit for 22 (56/100HP)
Turn 349, 1637 AD: Montezuma's Caravel is hit for 22 (34/100HP)
Turn 349, 1637 AD: Smurkz's Galleon is hit for 18 (82/100HP)
Turn 349, 1637 AD: Montezuma's Caravel is hit for 22 (12/100HP)
Turn 349, 1637 AD: Smurkz's Galleon is hit for 18 (64/100HP)
Turn 349, 1637 AD: Smurkz's Galleon is hit for 18 (46/100HP)
Turn 349, 1637 AD: Montezuma's Caravel is hit for 22 (0/100HP)
Turn 349, 1637 AD: Smurkz's Galleon has defeated Montezuma's Caravel!
Turn 349, 1637 AD: Smurkz's Galleon (4.00) vs Montezuma's Caravel (3.60)
Turn 349, 1637 AD: Combat Odds: 68.5%
Turn 349, 1637 AD: (Extra Combat: +10%)
Turn 349, 1637 AD: (Plot Defense: +10%)
Turn 349, 1637 AD: Smurkz's Galleon is hit for 18 (82/100HP)
Turn 349, 1637 AD: Montezuma's Caravel is hit for 21 (79/100HP)
Turn 349, 1637 AD: Montezuma's Caravel is hit for 21 (58/100HP)
Turn 349, 1637 AD: Montezuma's Caravel is hit for 21 (37/100HP)
Turn 349, 1637 AD: Montezuma's Caravel is hit for 21 (16/100HP)
Turn 349, 1637 AD: Smurkz's Galleon is hit for 18 (64/100HP)
Turn 349, 1637 AD: Montezuma's Caravel is hit for 21 (0/100HP)
Turn 349, 1637 AD: Smurkz's Galleon has defeated Montezuma's Caravel!
Turn 349, 1637 AD: You have discovered Assembly Line!

Turn 350, 1640 AD: You have trained a Work Boat in Irkutzk. Work has now begun on a Laboratory.
Turn 350, 1640 AD: Zhang Qian has been born in Kumbi Saleh!

Turn 353, 1649 AD: Kiev celebrates "We Love the President Day"!!!
Turn 353, 1649 AD: Tlatelolco has been captured by the Egyptian Empire!!!
Turn 353, 1649 AD: Isabella adopts Free Market!
Turn 353, 1649 AD: Montezuma adopts Emancipation!

Turn 354, 1652 AD: Kiev celebrates "We Love the President Day"!!!
Turn 354, 1652 AD: Ravenna celebrates "We Love the President Day"!!!
Turn 354, 1652 AD: William T. G. Morton has been born in London!
Turn 354, 1652 AD: Dante Alighieri has been born in Mecca!

Turn 355, 1655 AD: Deal Canceled: Ivory to Washington for Gold Per Turn (4)
Turn 355, 1655 AD: Ravenna celebrates "We Love the President Day"!!!
Turn 355, 1655 AD: Victoria has completed The Kremlin!
Turn 355, 1655 AD: Mohammed Shah has been born in Berlin!

Turn 356, 1658 AD: You have trained a Work Boat in Irkutzk. Work has now begun on a Frigate.
Turn 356, 1658 AD: Vladivostok celebrates "We Love the President Day"!!!
Turn 356, 1658 AD: Great Scientist has been born in Tiwanaku!
Turn 356, 1658 AD: Alexander adopts Emancipation!
Turn 356, 1658 AD: Montezuma has made peace with Mansa Musa!

Turn 357, 1661 AD: You have discovered Industrialism!
Turn 357, 1661 AD: You have discovered a source of Aluminum near Ravenna!
Turn 357, 1661 AD: Vladivostok celebrates "We Love the President Day"!!!
Turn 357, 1661 AD: Amir Khusro has been born in Tarsus!
Turn 357, 1661 AD: Mansa Musa adopts Organized Religion!
Turn 357, 1661 AD: Montezuma has made peace with Hatshepsut!
Turn 357, 1661 AD: Montezuma has made peace with Victoria!

 

[unkle]

@Niklas:
Nice !!! I like your style

@zyxy:
I think you are up, but I am checking the game "in case". Let's play fast.

 

[Methos]

@zyxy:
I think you are up, but I am checking the game "in case". Let's play fast.

Roster:

• Niklas - Just Played
• zyxy - UP!
• unkle - On Deck!
• Methos - Warming Up
• battchy
• Marc Aurel - skip until further notice

I just realized we only have 21 days to complete this game! Man, we need to speed up.

 

[zyxy]

Well done Niklas!

Got it, I will play tomorrow.

Plan:
- Make peace with Monty asap.
- Research Railroad asap (before arty). We have coal, and rails add flexibility and production (for mines).
- Does the Space elevator also speed up Apollo? If so, then I would do Robotics before Rocketry. If not, then the order doesn't matter much, I think, though I have a slight preference for Robotics, because of the tech path: Combustion is on the road to Robotics and would be helpful in any defensive wars because it gives access to destroyers. Plastics is also on the road to to Robotics and gives access to the Three Gorges Dam as well as Hydro plants. (Is either worth it? Do they need fresh water?)
- The only techs we can possibly hope to get from the AI are Biology, Fission and Arty. I'll give our friends Hatty and Vicky (and perhaps also Cyrus) the prereqs for Fission (they can already research the other two techs).
- Keep selling techs and resources as usual.
- Civics look good to me.
- We have Alu at Ravenna.
- GS's can be used on Fission or so. Not needed yet.
- None of the civs is near any of the victory conditions. It is highly unlikely that someone will be able to get a diplo victory.

EDITTED to 'unmix' rocketry and robotics.

 

[Niklas]

It seems to me you are mixing Robotics and Rocketry a bit (been there done that). Combustion and Plastics are on the road to Robotics, the only thing on the path to Rocketry from here is Arty. To get to Robotics we need Railroad->Combustion->Plastics->Robotics.

I agree that the order probably doesn't matter very much, our towns will be busy building factories + power plants for a while before they can start Apollo. From the description, I'm fairly sure that the Space Elevator does not speed up Apollo. If we want to go for Railroads first, which seems reasonable, then IMO we should go all the way to Robotics and hope that the AI gets us Arty. Several of them have had access to Physics + Steel + Rifling for quite some time now. I hope Biology comes around soon too.

 

[Methos]

One thing to remember, is that the Apollo Program cannot be rushed through , GE, or citizens. It has to be hand built. Therefore, I suggest we go Rocketry first so we can get a jump on the Apollo Program.

The Space Elevator would be nice, if we can build it quick enough. It has to be built early enough to make it worth the time we spend building it.

 

[Niklas]

No rushing of SS parts either?

 

[Methos]

No rushing of SS parts either?

Correct. The Apollo Program and the SS parts are projects and projects cannot be rushed in any way.

 

[Niklas]

Too bad, I was hoping for that Fusion-induced GE to get us the engine. Oh well.

 

[Methos]

Too bad, I was hoping for that Fusion-induced GE to get us the engine. Oh well.

Yeah, I learned the above the hard way during one of my HoF Space attempts.

 

[zyxy]

[EDIT: played before I saw the above comments.]

Turn 0, 1664AD: Set research to Railroads, at max. Sell Electricity to Hatty and Cyrus for a bit of gold.

Turn 1, 1667AD: And now this...

Spoiler :

Sigh... On the IT, we kill a longbow but lose a mace to a cav. [1-1]
I sell Electricity to Louis, Capac and Khan, and some outdated techs to other civs to raise some cash. I readjust our troops and ships to deal with a smallish Greek invasion, and upgrade a spear to rifle to protect Beijing.

Turn 2, 1670AD: IT Greeks pillage a town, and land south of Mozcow.
We kill 1 grenadier, 3 cavs, 1 frigate and 2 galleons at no losses. Three Greek units left at Mozcow, but there's no threat. I also kill a musket in Greek lands, just because I can. [9-1]
I sell Radio to Ghandi and Louis, and outdated tech to almost everybody else, to get cash to fund another turn of research.

Turn 3, 1673AD: IT we kill a pike, lose a galleon and a cav, and Alex pillages some more [10-3].
I clear out the remaining 2 cavs and 1 cat near Mozcow [13-3]. Science has to be lowered to 80&#37;, as we cannot raise more cahs without selling too advanced techs.

Turn 4, 1676AD: Beijing lost an ivory tile to Sparta, and is starving. Sell Electricity to Vicky for some change. Alex and Monty will not talk.

Turn 5, 1679AD: We discover Railroad, and continue with Combustion. It seems both Ghandi and Mansa discovered Railroad the same turn that we did... I start railroad construction.

Turn 6, 1682AD: Kiev restarts IronWorks.

Turn 7, 1685AD: Alex starts to bomb the defenses of Beijing. Monty offers this:

Spoiler :

Why not, so I accept.

Turn 8, 1688AD: we get demands to cancel deals from Mansa and Toku (both refused). The culture of Beijing expands and it regaisn the ivory.
I renegotiate a few deals for a few gpt more.

Turn 9, 1691AD: Louis has hitmusicals for trade, but we don't really need them.

Turn 10, 1694AD: We discover Combustion, and start research on Plastics. Hatty built Statue of Liberty. After many years of scarcity, there's suddenly a large amount of cash available. We grab the opportunity, and sell Assembly line to Louis for 600 gold, and Combustion to Ghandi and Mansa for 260 and 140 gold. sci to 100%.

Spoiler :

Turn 11, 1697AD: Khan discovered arty but won't trade it.

Turn 12, 1700AD: Shanghai suffers a Chinese revolt. Louis also has arty now, but both Khan and Louis will not trade it, because they fear our technological superiority - and rightfully so!

Turn 13, 1703AD: again renegotiate some deals to get a few more gpt.

Turn 14, 1706AD: A Greek cav attacks Shanghai from Chinese lands and kills a catapult. We cannot answer because we cannot enter Chinese lands! I'll just move a cav into town, then. Kill another Greek cav near Corinth [14-4].

Turn 15, 1709AD: IT our exposed cav kills a rifle but loses against a pike.
I kill a Greek cav that entered our lands and kill the offending pike [17-5]. We could easily take Corinth now: it is defended by two catapults. But we don't want it: it's a silly place.

Turn 16, 1712AD: For once, we're not the target: Toku declares on Freddy, and in reply, Ghandi declares on Toku . Suprise for Toku!

Turn 17, 1715AD: Cyrus cancelled the whale for iron deal. Whale is no longer available from him , which causes some unhappiness here and there.
Alex will talk peace now. I take the opportunity to first kill a frigate and a cav, and pillage a few tiles [19-5]. Then:

Spoiler :

Turn 18, 1718AD: We discovered Plastics, starting on Robotics. I'll hand off here.

Hand-off notes:

• We have some happiness trouble because Cyrus cancelled the Whale deal. There may come more unhappiness because Plastics makes Furs obsolete. For this reason we are building a few theatres.
• What type of Power plants do we need? It seems coal plants are the best deal, and the Three Gorges Dam is not worth building, especially because its effect is limited to one continent.
• What is the best research path? I am still hoping that a few more AI's will research Arty (2 of them know it now), and that it becomes available for trade. In that light, Robotics would be nice.
• Where and when do we build Apollo and the Space Elevator? I guess the Elevator (the most expensive one) is suitable for our IW city, Kiev, while Ravenna could do Apollo. Both towns of course need a power plant first.
• We can trade away Assembly line, Radio and/or Combustion for cash as needed.
• GS's will now go towards Fiber Optics.

The save

 

[zyxy]

Too bad, I was hoping for that Fusion-induced GE to get us the engine. Oh well.

So we could use him for the Space Elevator, maybe?

There are three techs to Fusion, and we can rush one of them with the 2 GS.

 

[Niklas]

Looks great zyxy, and you still followed the comments without reading them.

Roster:

• Niklas
• zyxy - Just Played
• unkle - UP!
• Methos - On Deck!
• battchy - Warming Up
• Marc Aurel - skip until further notice

Can't check the save right now, but at a glance I agree with everything zyxy says, including Robotics as next research target.

EDIT: Cross-post with zyxy. Actually, I think that's a brilliant idea. Can we head straight for Fusion then? Before or after Robotics? Is there any chance we could get Fission from the AI?

 

[zyxy]

More comments:

• It seems I made a mistake: it would be faster to do the coal plant in Kiev first, before the IW. Indeed, the coal plant will increase the production multiplier from 1.5 to 2, so it will reduce the remaining build cost of the Ironworks from 509/1.5 raw hammers to 509/2 raw hammers, a reduction by 135 raw hammers. If we continue with the ironworks and do the coal plant after that, then the production multiplier will change from 1.5 to 2.5 for the coal plant, reducing its build cost from 225/1.5 raw hammers to 225/2.5 raw hammers, a reduction of 60 hammers, which is significantly less than 135. Conclusion: build the Coal plant first! This should save (135-60)/27 = about 2 turns of production.
• Some towns are slowly starving, I was counting on getting Biology soon. AI's are not making a whole lot of progress, unfortunately.
• The techs we still need to build the spaceship are:
  • Robotics (gives Space Elevator)
  • Fiber Optics & Fission -> Fusion (gives Free Engineer)
  • Arty -> Rocketry (gives Apollo)
  • Biology
  • Refrigeration
  • Ecology
  • Genetics
  • Satellites
  • Composites EDIT: composites is actually not needed ...
  If we use the listed order, then do we have enough time to finish Apollo before we start the other Spaceship parts? Or do we need to research Arty and Rocketry sooner?
  Let's see. Our best production center will be Kiev. With Ironworks and power plant it will do about 80 hpt, and double that for Apollo (because we have Aluminum). Apollo is 2400 hammers, so Kiev will need 15 turns to build it. It takes about 40 30 turns to research the six last techs at current max speed, so we'll have Apollo ready 25 15 turns from the end. Is that enough? I'm not so sure. (Throughout I assume that the number of research turns returned by the F6 screen are correct. This may not be the case because of discounts, I don't know.)
  Counting from the other side, Kiev needs about 15 turns to build a coal plant and finish the Ironworks, and then perhaps another 2 for an aqueduct, to fight disease. So we would want to start Apollo in about 15-17 turns from now. Researching Arty and Rocketry takes 11 turns at present speed, and Arty is not available for trade.
  Researching Robotics, Fiber Optics, Fission and Fusion takes 30 turns at present max speed (where I discounted 3 turns for the two GS's, and I've assumed the AI's don't help). So we can research along this path for about 10-15 turns, starting with Robotics and Fiber Optics (hoping the AI will get Fission for us), and then switch to Arty -> Rocketry. Then start Apollo and switch back to the Fusion path. We should get Fusion at the same time as we finish Apollo. This will give us close to 40 30 turns to build the space ship parts with the use of the space elevator, and this should be enough I think.
• There is some chance to get Fission from the AI because some of them have had the prereqs for 20 turns now. Note we don't need Fission yet - we can do Robotics and Fiber Optics without it.

EDITTED because I accidentally listed Composites as required tech.

 

[unkle]

@zyxy:
That's a got it.
Nice turnset Alex declaring was nearly expected. I still fear from Mao and Julius. Huyana and Monte are threats too. We should not take our military on the light side...

Will post plan and comments on your comments later today. Probably play tomorrow night.

 

[unkle]

Ok some preliminary comments before issuing a plan:
- Why is Vlad on Forge ? Happiness ?
- Vlad will produce a GP in 2 turns. Probably a GS (58%). GA and GM are next.
- Both Moscow and Antium are able to grab a GP. Best is Moscow which could be able to grab a GE if we increase it current GPP production. Health is the issue here.
- I still think GP other than GS could be useful to trigger a late GA (which means +1H for each tile producing at least one H, same for commerce....). I'll wait for next GP from Vlad to see. if that is useful.
- Robotics seems nice to me, but space elevator remains the top priority building.
- switch from IW to Plant is ok.

A real plan later, I am still not home so no game opening

 

[zyxy]

Ok some preliminary comments before issuing a plan:
- Why is Vlad on Forge ? Happiness ?

More production, and more specialists.

- Both Moscow and Antium are able to grab a GP. Best is Moscow which could be able to grab a GE if we increase it current GPP production. Health is the issue here.

And happiness, of course - two red guys.

- I still think GP other than GS could be useful to trigger a late GA (which means +1H for each tile producing at least one H, same for commerce....). I'll wait for next GP from Vlad to see. if that is useful.

Possibly. Each GS saves roughly 3000 beakers. (Does that come to about 2 turns of research?) How much does a Golden Age save? We can profit either from the production bonus (GA after the last tech is researched) or the gold bonus (GA while we are researching), but not both...

 

[Niklas]

Each GS saves roughly 3000 beakers. (Does that come to about 2 turns of research?) How much does a Golden Age save? We can profit either from the production bonus (GA after the last tech is researched) or the gold bonus (GA while we are researching), but not both...

I have no idea how a GA works in CIV, and I don't have time to do the counting now unfortunately. But 3000 beakers is ~1.5 turns of research, considering the least prerequisite bonus we could possibly get when researching any tech at all is +20%. With our current 1600+ beakers per turn, that should mean ~2000 beakers per turn towards any tech. Still, if we "accidently" get some GP other than a GS then it might be a reasonable choice.

We should be sure to balance research and production towards the end. No point having researched everything we need many turns before we can start building the last component. And no good having to wait for components to build.

 

[unkle]

More production, and more specialists.

And happiness, of course - two red guys.

Possibly. Each GS saves roughly 3000 beakers. (Does that come to about 2 turns of research?) How much does a Golden Age save? We can profit either from the production bonus (GA after the last tech is researched) or the gold bonus (GA while we are researching), but not both...

Vlad should not really produce anything interesting, since workshops should be replaced with farms/cottage. Grocer could be better (Merchants+Health). I'll let it finish sine +2 Happy is fine for me.

A GA as I get it is +1H for all tiles worked producing at least +1H, and +1C for all tiles producing at least +1C. Bonuses should apply. I am not yet able to open the save but I'll make for some numbers later on. I think 8 turns of GA should out anything else than a GS in terms of science.... If you think for Moscow, which is full (21 tiles worked) that's 21 commerce (EDIT forgot bureaucracy here, so it's 31 more commerce in Moscow... but this bonus won't be equivalent for other cities), *3 = 63 beakers more per turn for 8 turns, which is 504 beakers for one GA. That's 1/6 GS (ok Moscow is our best city )

And we could use it for production as soon as we are producing any spaceship part.

In any case I will look deeper tonight.