SGOTM 04 - Geezers

If we leave Visigoth then maybe we can use Brennus as another trading partner. What are the pros and cons of vassalising him and making him research stuff for Gandhi? I never use vassals so I have no idea.

The culture idea is a good one for helping stake our claim on our new lands but we'd have to have some sort of strategy for how long, and how we get back on track.

We will still need a medium term plan for how to neutralise those two top dogs.

I think we should almost be in a position where we can map out the whole rest of the game from here.
 
We can't vassalize Brennus, because once we do, he's stuck with the same relations with Gandhi as we have. And he won't know that the war is a fake one...how horrible would it be if he were to start pillaging our old lands :eek:

Anyway, the culture slider would be worthwhile to make sure no cities are thrown into our new land, but I think we should wait to do that until after we finish researching Bio so we can attempt to bribe Mehmed into war with Washington again.
 
On increasing the culture slider I was thinking more about reducing the amount of our cities that are unhappy. It'll probably take another turnset to take down Verlamion & Cordoba. Reducing the research rate means we don't lose as much gold.

The other route of course would be to change to State Property. However at two turns of anarchy each time we change civics it doesn't make sense for maybe another 10 turns of war.
 
I considered changing Civics but decided to use the culture slider instead as a more temporary measure. Less effective without theatres though.
 
The other route of course would be to change to State Property. However at two turns of anarchy each time we change civics it doesn't make sense for maybe another 10 turns of war.

Agreed, not worth a civics change. If anything, work the culture slider.

Having said that, unless we have people starving, I wouldn't worry about war weariness too much. We are losing productivity when people are unhappy, but if we turn up the culture slider, we are losing it anyhow. As I've advanced my warmongering skills, I've learned not to worry too much about war weariness. Best way to end it is to eliminate the opponent :hammer: .
 
I tried to get a nice balance between some unhappiness and total chaos. At 0% culture, our economy went completely nuts. At about 40% culture, everyone was happy, but the best outcome seemed to arise at about 20% culture, combined with a programme of whipping the large cities in the Old Country.
 
ok....so I just realized I'm the one that's up now lol

I'm exhausted right now though, so I'll play my turns in the morning(12-14 hours from now)

Until then...I accept all comments and recommendations :)
 
I think we are agreed that the aim of the next turnset is to take out Brennus's remaining cities but may leave Visigoth if it's just too hard - and just leave a one city Brennus hanging around to provide a slight boost to overall research. I guess that depends on how bad the Motherland unhappiness is.
 
Summary: Gandhi has taken IronSheep and Nidaros, We've taken Cordoba and Verlamion with no losses. Brennus is dead. Mehmed vassalized Izzy. Mehmed and Izzy are at war with Washington and Hannibal. Gandhi's GNP is slowly going up. Nearly all our military has moved to former Celtia. Democracy is being researched, Communism has 1 turn of research in it to increase its trade value. We want Communism for Spying...even if we don't have the financial clout to sabotage anything, we want to be able to keep tabs on Gandhi's builds.

Turn 0(1700AD): Get OB with Izzy, trade Wine for Dye, Trade Sci Method to Izzy for 190 gold. Maybe she'll trade it to Gandhi.
IBT: Nothing
Turn 1(1703AD): Start pop rushing science buildings in our homeland. Isca Courthouse>Library. Surround Cordoba and Verlamion and should take them next turn. Rush University in IronSheep, Gandhi will take it next turn.
IBT: IronSheep taken by Gandhi
Turn 2(1706AD): Verlamion and Cordoba bombarded, Both will be taken next turn. Galleons begin ferrying troops and workers away from Nidaros to prepare for giving it up
IBT: Mehmed declares war on Brennus...and Gandhi starts pillaging IronSheep's towns that are still covered by Nidaros culture
Turn 3(1709AD): Bio is 5 turns away from finishing, I hope to use it to bribe Mehmed into war with Washington, and to catch us up in tech some by trading it to Washington and Hannibal. Verlamion and Cordoba taken with no losses. Birka founded 1SW of the desert oil.
IBT: Nothing
Turn 4(1712AD): Move troops toward Visigoth to try to make sure Mehmed doesn't vassalize Brennus
IBT: Nothing
Turn 5(1715AD): Units keep moving toward Visigoth
IBT: Weird events...Brennus destroyed by Mehmed, and Izzy becomes peaceful vassal of Mehmed!
Turn 6(1718AD): Demand 30 gold from Washington. Trade Replacement Parts to Izzy for 20 gold. Science is now at 50%, losing 79 gpt, and Bio will be due in 1 turn. We'll also run out of gold at that point. Because Brennus is no more, Hannibal and Washington won't trade Physics anymore...dang it
IBT: Nothing
Turn 7(1721AD): I go trading around Biology. Mehmed is willing to give us 790 gold, his WM, AND declare war on Hannibal!! for Bio, so I gladly trade it to him.
Hannibal gives us Economics, Military Tradition, 290 gold, and his WM for Biology.

Oh yeah...and thanks to recent relations changes, there is now a world war going on. Izzy and Mehmed have declared war on Hannibal and Washington....and we are at war with Gandhi. That should slow down either Mehmed or Hannibal, and hopefully both of them. We should keep our eyes open though in case we need to jump in and prevent one of them from dominating the other.

I also abandoned Nidaros because Gandhi was beginning to close in and pillage. I'd rather give him Nidaros now than have him pillage everything first.

I start research toward Communism for a single turn, perhaps we can convince someone to trade it to us soon. We want it so that we can build Spies and keep an eye on the wars and on what Gandhi's building, so we know what kind of progress he's making on the space ship stuff.
IBT: Nothing
Turn 8(1724AD): Change research to Democracy so we can either just simply adopt Univ Suffrage if desired, and Emancipation, or so we can use our GE on the Statue of Liberty and get a free specialist in each city.
IBT: Nothing
Turn 9(1727AD): Gandhi's troops move next to Nidaros, he should take it this interturn. I see Hannibal and Washington's stacks of troops invading Mehmed...Izzy's stacks are on their way down and Mehmed likely has his moving down as well, since he sent his troops up toward Brennus just before declaring war on Hannibal
IBT: Nidaros taken by Gandhi
Turn 10(1730AD): It appears that the capital doesn't necessarily move to the biggest city, because our new capital is Uppsala, despite Bibracte being our largest city.
 
Wow, Thrallia, you achieved pretty much all our near term objectives in one turnset. Awesome. What now? Which side of the world war do we line up on for now? How long before Gandhi lights his first little experimental skyrocket?
 
An interesting turnset on how to divest ourselves of good cities Thrallia. :goodjob: :lol: I still think I would have preferred Birka to be on the desert tile. I can understand your thinking on overlap but I hope it doesn't flip to Izzy.

Thrallia said:
It appears that the capital doesn't necessarily move to the biggest city, because our new capital is Uppsala, despite Bibracte being our largest city.

Perhaps the capital moves to the city with the most culture? :dunno:

Ghandhi's gold has dropped like a stone. :eek: I don't think we want him to take any more cities for a while until his income recovers. Since we also don't want him to pillage too much of our (his) improvements I think this means we need to land/build some decent forces to deter/kill his forces for a while.

On the world war side of things we need to decide if we want to support Mehmed/Izzy or Hanni/Washy in case we're asked to join in by either side. I would have thought we're against Hanni/Washy but do we really want to be pulled into that war whilst our economy is in tatters? Not to mention the lack of any decent forces in the south.

On another point it looks like Izzy is only 1% pop short of reclaiming her freedom from Mehmed. If she achieves it she may decide to attack us again. I can't believe we've got a demerit from her for razing Cordoba. :mad:
 
She won't break free from Mehmed by upping her pop...she became his vassal peacefully, so she can break free every 10th turn if she chooses to. Otherwise, she'll be his vassal permanently...I don't think she expected to be forced to declare war on Washington and Hannibal 1 turn after becoming his vassal though ;)

I think the reason we have a demerit is because I was given the choice to keep it, raze it, or return it to Izzy...I may go back to that save after the game is over and see if we would have gotten a bonus from her if we gave it to her...that'd be helpful to know for our next diplo SG.

I think we want to be on the side of Izzy and Mehmed, mainly because Izzy is willing to trade with Gandhi.

On that note...I just had a thought. Mehmed is willing to change to Free Religion for 630 gold...Hannibal was willing to change to Free Religion in exchange for Bio, if we had been willing to give him gold in addition to Bio for his two techs. We may want to consider that in order to get rid of their heathen modifiers toward Gandhi...that may be enough to get them to tech trade with him again.
 
On that note...I just had a thought. Mehmed is willing to change to Free Religion for 630 gold...Hannibal was willing to change to Free Religion in exchange for Bio, if we had been willing to give him gold in addition to Bio for his two techs. We may want to consider that in order to get rid of their heathen modifiers toward Gandhi...that may be enough to get them to tech trade with him again.

This sound promising. I am willing to take that option. Hopefully Demo is appealing to AI.

Very good 3 turn sets team. We are on the right path. Lets get all these cottages going. Who ever is up next should work to get those promotions going while killing Gandhi's units and hold the line.
 
Who ever is up next should work to get those promotions going while killing Gandhi's units and hold the line.

Well I can answer that :

Roster:

Sam - UP
Htadus - on deck
Mark
Jenarie
Harbourboy
Thrallia - just played
 
[pointless post]
I PASSED 1,000 POSTS!!!!!
[/pointless post]

I'm done...I just now realized that I had passed 1k posts...probably at least 1/3 of them in Geezers SG threads :)
 
Well I can answer that :

Roster:

Sam - UP
Htadus - on deck
Mark
Jenarie
Harbourboy
Thrallia - just played


:eek: I'm sure that Htadus used to be before me. :hmm: Ok, I'll have a look later today and come up with some proposals. Any thoughts from the rest of you?

EDIT:

Sam_Yeager said:
On the world war side of things we need to decide if we want to support Mehmed/Izzy or Hanni/Washy in case we're asked to join in by either side. I would have thought we're against Hanni/Washy but do we really want to be pulled into that war whilst our economy is in tatters? Not to mention the lack of any decent forces in the south.

It would be nice to know the answer before the next round. :)
 
I think you two swapped last round, so I just kept it that way. If you want to swap back no problem, just say so.:)

Being friends with Washy-Hanny has the plus we could attack Mehmed-Izzy from both sides and maybe encourage Hanny to declare war first, so they burn their units on that front before we step in. The other way round we would have a buffer zone between us and our potential enemies, but gaining territory would be hard and costly as our empire would be split apart and for sure we do not want any AI to gain any more room if we can avoid it.
Without looking at the save and looking at the situation I would prefer to stay friendly with Washy-Hanny. That would enable us to enlarge our empire much easier IF we want to enlarge it.
 
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