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SGOTM 10 - Smurkz

On normal speed maces cost 70, pikes 60, Lbows 50. The melees can get Woodsman promos, which is nice because they might be able to level up to WoodII for extra forest movement, but the Lbows have intrinsic 25% hill defense. I prefer maces over pikes because they're only 1.17x the cost of pikes but have 1.33x the base strength; they're more likely to survive attacks and level up or take out more attackers with them. Lbows have an advantage on cost effectiveness when they're posted on hills or in city garrisons, so I can see using them in some situations.

I'm still worried about Broberg in the short term. Sure, we move the pike to the iron. If the Lbow attacks him and wins, what should the Broberg Lbow do? Attack if odds are better than TBD% (maybe 98%), otherwise stay put? Shouldn't we try to get another unit over there ASAP if we're down to just the 1 Lbow? Also, whether or not we kill the Lbow, Gandhi will send more up there to pillage the iron and there's nothing we can do about it when we only have 1 or 2 units since we'll necessarily be on the defense. Without the iron Broberg will be very slow in building stuff. We need to post a strong unit or two somewhere to protect the iron, don't we? I don't think St Pete can spit out the units fast enough in the short term to supply our needs. Can we have just one mace from Moscow, pretty please? The galley would have to sit in port for a couple turns anyway so there's little if any delay in using it. Yes, it'll set back the urgently needed settler by around 3 turns, but we don't want to lose Broberg.

I'm comforted by your settler-stifling experience. Is the current placement of units inside Gandhi's territory OK for that?

I don't know how long it'll take Seaside to get up in pop, but perhaps it could take a little of the settler building load off Moscow with all that food.

Yes, Bombay is very likely close to getting a settler. I think the latest Lbow appeared roughly 5 turns ago. Note, though, that moving the warrior to St Pete so we can put a pike on the cows will put a couple tiles in our SE back into the fog, particularly if we pull out all the workers down there. When possible, I'd like to have a worker there building roads but mostly beating back the fog. Losing the furs or silver island to barbs would hurt.

Out west, OK, pull back the knight and leave the explorer as bait. He's better off defending in a forest, though: explorers start with both GuerI and WoodI and forests give 50% defense vs 25% for hills. As for fog busting, I think a city with the cows would be useful and another sited at/near the western mouth of the river to get crabs, furs, copper, and hills would be good. We need to keep the copper out of Gandhi's hands and it greatly speeds Confucian Academies, which will be vital in St Pete and probably elsewhere for the culture multiplier. If we want to preserve those sites I'd put the explorer on the river mouth and a worker probably SE of the cows.

Haven't heard from CB or Rolo in quite awhile again. I get Monday off so will have a fair amount of time but I've already played nearly a full turnset. How are things looking for you, BL? I'd be happy to hand off now (if you'll agree to build one measly mace in Moscow ;) and try to keep most of the west free of barbs.)
 
I've been watching and soaking up the discussion on this, but haven't had anything to contribute.

On unit selection, aside from cost, how long would it take to build each unit in Moscow and St. Peteys? It seems that time is just as important as cost.

I get antsy about Broberg-grad being weakly defended, but that is due to my nature and not so much our in-game situation. I tend to over-protect my border cities. I would feel better with a stronger unit in Broberg, but we might be able to get Gandhi to look at our single units instead this city.

If we had units being a pest inside Indian borders, they would get all the attention, right?
 
6 turns for either pike or mace in St Pete; in Moscow, 3 turns for Lbow, 4 for mace--not sure but probably 3 for pike.

Here's my synthesis of what we've discussed for the next few turns:

Finish turn 45:
Move pike near Broberg to iron.
Broberg build culture for 1 turn.
Cancel all worker actions (to be safe).
Change Moscow build to galley.
Change St Pete build to Lbow. Finish mace after that.


Turn 46 (and beyond):
Moscow grows to pop 9 (I think on this turn). Work a coast tile until workshop ready.
2 workers by Moscow build workshop on plains, then another on plains.
Seaside worker mines.
2 western workers on hill finish road before knight moves that same turn.
Move knight east to be a nuisance near Bombay.
Use explorer as bait, trying to get axe to attack him in forest or perhaps on a hill.
Move worker resting on the hill back east to develop around horses.
Slave3 and worker5 mine the hill southish of St Pete.

Move warrior on horses north to St Pete.
Move St Pete unit to cows SW of Bombay after warrior arrives.
Seaside finishes workboat, starts library (BUT see below).
Broberg finish workboat then build barracks and units. Delay the barracks and go straight to Lbow if afraid
St Pete build Lbow and then continue with mace
Moscow build Lbow (3 turns) unless it already has hammers in a mace, in which case finish the mace. Then finish the galley and start a settler. (BL wants to finish the galley and go directly to a settler. How about if we finish the galley and see how things turn out around Broberg? If our pike survives, go for the settler. If he dies, build the Lbow or mace before the settler.)
Moscow finish galley. See what happens to the pike at Broberg, but probably start a caravel to thwart barb galley. Aim to reach pop 9 when it finishes and start a settler.

We'll get a Great Eng on turn 47. Shall we immediately use him to build National Epic in Seaside? It gives 4 culture per turn--should we then delay the library and build workboats instead? If we don't use the Eng for that, what shall we do with him? Settle in Moscow or save him? Save Eng for now. Analyze merits of settling
 
Here's my synthesis of what we've discussed for the next few turns: And here's my responses:

Finish turn 45:
Move pike near Broberg to iron. Yup
Broberg build culture for 1 turn. Yup
Cancel all worker actions (to be safe). Good idea

Turn 46 (and beyond):
Moscow grows to pop 9 (I think on this turn). Work a coast tile until workshop ready. Actually it grows to pop 8 this turn, but the pop working the coast until the workshop is ready is correct
2 workers by Moscow build workshop on plains, then another on plains. Yup
Seaside worker mines. Yup
2 western workers on hill finish road before knight moves. If it helps the Knight's movement this turn, then yea, if not, then eh, not necessary.
Move knight east to be a nuisance near Bombay. Yup
Use explorer as bait, trying to get axe to attack him in forest or perhaps on a hill. Yup
Move worker resting on the hill back east to develop around horses. Yup
Slave3 and worker5 mine the hill southish of St Pete. Yup

Move warrior on horses north to St Pete. Yup
Move St Pete unit to cows SW of Bombay after warrior arrives. Yup
Seaside finishes workboat, starts library (BUT see below). Yup, but not possible on 'see below'
Broberg finish workboat then build barracks and units. Yup, but if you're still paranoid ( :p ) then I could see longbow -> barracks ->units
St Pete continue with mace NO! The unit that gets built there next is MP. Otherwise the city becomes unhappy and I'm definitely not agreeing with using maces as MP. Switch the build out to a Longbow before hitting enter. It'll finish being built the turn it grows. After that then a mace can be built since hammers have already been sunk into building one.
Moscow build Lbow (3 turns) unless it already has hammers in a mace, in which case finish the mace. (Does not have hammers in a mace, but no longbow out of Moscow). Then finish the galley and start a settler. (BL wants to finish the galley and go directly to a settler. How about if we finish the galley and see how things turn out around Broberg? If our pike survives, go for the settler. If he dies, build the Lbow or mace before the settler.) Actually, I was saying finish the galley, then build Caravel for barb duty, then build settler if we're at pop 9 (I think we will be). I can agree with waiting to see what the longbow does by Broberg since we're finishing the galley anyway this turn, but I still strongly prefer not delaying the settlers much more than we already have.

We'll get a Great Eng on turn 47. Shall we immediately use him to build National Epic in Seaside? It gives 4 culture per turn--should we then delay the library and build workboats instead? If we don't use the Eng for that, what shall we do with him? Settle in Moscow or save him? This is not possible, since NE requires a library in the city. I guess save him for now, probably for Oxford somewhere or for Mining Inc later. Settling him in Moscow isn't going to help a whole lot.

So yea, we got most of the points straightened out. Just the builds we're still differing on.
 
OK, I've edited my previous post--please check. If it looks OK, I might be able to play a little tonight; perhaps only 1 turn if the Broberg pike dies. Glad you're still around, CB. Feel free to chime in. ;) BL, you've been evasive about when/if you can play :dunno:. Pick a side, we're at war! :D If BL can't, shall I keep going for another few turns, or is CB available?
 
I can probably play next week. The updated post looks good. Play out the one turn, see what happens with Broberg and let us know.
 
I've finished turn 45 and hit Return. There's good news and bad news.

The Lbow by Broberg moved NE to the grass hill we now own after cultural expansion. We're now building barracks (4 turns). Meanwhile, the barb galley off Moscow (now due E of the gold hill) unloaded a mace and spear (both unpromoted) on the cows . :eek: The two workers can move out of harm's way. We have only 1 warrior in Moscow. Maybe I suggest an upgrade to a mace for 245 gold? The St Pete Pike can get there this turn but we'll then have nobody in St Pete, which will cause unhappiness. The southern warrior can get there in 3 moves, or the pike NE of Bombay could get there in 2. Moscow finished its galley and I've tentatively set it on a longbow (2 turns). A mace would take 3.

Gandhi has not produced any new units this turn, but he's moved his fast worker into the forest N of Delhi. Our WoodsII pike by Broberg could capture him this turn. Gandhi has 3 Lbows and a cat in Delhi that could then attack us. Our pike has 6 XPs.

I think we should upgrade the Moscow warrior (which has Combat1) and move in the St Pete Lbow. Leave St Pete unprotected for 2 turns. Odds are we'll be able to move the pike back there in 1 turn, or the new Lbow in 2 turns. Seaside can live without its archer for awhile, so I'd also move it this turn toward Moscow. It can get there in 1 more turn, or turn back if not needed.

Out by Broberg, I'm very tempted by the fast worker. Gandhi would only throw the cat and at most 2 Lbows against our WoodsII pike, probably only 1, and I think our odds of surviving are pretty good.
 

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Well F%$#. :mad:

Let's face it, we lose Moscow, we earn Wooden Spoons for this competition. Before I went into full panic mode (here's that smiley you wanted: :run: ), I ran some tests which I hope are accurate to our game as well. Here are the findings.

Upgrading the mace regardless of the various options is a no-brainer. However, moving the pike and/or the archer from St. Pete and Seaside respectively to Moscow may not be required.

First test: Upgrade Mace, leave one worker next to barbs as a decoy. Our galley moves 1 NE, 1 E away from city but out of range of barb galley. The mace attacks the worker, and the spear follows the Mace. The barb galley retreats away from our galley. Net result: One worker lost, Moscow not attacked, no tiles pillaged. Both mace and spear remain. In the same set up, I also saw Moscow attacked with the Mace and the worker killed via the spear.

Second Test: Upgrade to Mace, run both workers away. Galley 1 NE, 1 E. Mace attacks city (9.1% victory odds for barb mace). If our mace takes no damage in the attack, the spear will fortify on the cows. If our mace takes damage, the spear moves 1 SW to our grassland gold or 1 S to the plains hill gold. Barb galley retreats away from our land. Net result: Mace attacked our Mace, barb mace loses. No tiles pillaged, no workers lost. Barb spear remains (chances are there are good odds to use the mace to take out the spear next turn as long as the damage isn't too severe. In all of my findings I was able to attack the spear at greater than 90% odds).

Third test: Upgrade to Mace, both workers split. One remains on plains tile, the other 1 SW to corn. Galley 1 NE, 1 E. Mace attacks city. Spear attacks worker on the corn. Barb galley still retreats. Net result: One worker lost, Moscow attacked, no tiles pillaged. Only spear remains.

Forth test: Upgrade to Mace, both workers retreat. Galley stays in port in Moscow. Same deal as in test #2: Mace attacks, spear moves to gold, galley retreats.

I also ran tests where our galley moves to within striking distance of the barb galley. Every time the galley attacked ours at 32.2% odds. Given the results of the other tests, namely that the barb galley running away I see no reason to move the galley into harm's way. We'll have our future caravel take care of it.

This is certifiably nuts... :crazyeye: but I recommend not moving the pike from St. Pete to Moscow. As long as Moscow has its warrior upgraded to a Mace, it appears the mace will only attack it and the spear won't. However, I do recommend moving the pike outside of Bombay back towards St. Pete. When our Mace in Moscow moves out to mop up the spear, Moscow will need the MP unit from St. Pete to remain happy, and thus the unit from Bombay will serve as St. Pete's MP for a turn. Since I saw the same city attacking results from the Mace, leaving the workers as a decoy probably isn't going to help any, so I'd send them both 1 NW and build a new workshop (but cancel that turn). Galley stays in port.

Capture Gandhi's worker - he's chopping a forest which could go towards any number of things.

In Broberg, after the workboat gets the clams hooked up next turn, continue to work the cows and Iron since the food can't really go toward anything productive for the city, but the hammers from both tiles obviously can. Worker by Seaside starts the mine as planned. And the explorer should probably move to a hill or forest tile and fortify - odds for the barb attacking him in either tile appear to be the same.
 
I knew you'd recommend something certifiably nuts! ;) I didn't notice a test that included putting the St Pete Pike in Moscow. What happens then? 91% odds of a happy outcome defending with just the mace are good, but ... I could imagine that with the pike in place, the barbs don't attack and instead wander around pillaging and we have to go out and kill them, which would take at least one more unit to be built. Is that your reasoning? Did you test it?

Any harm in moving the Seaside archer toward Moscow, just in case? And is the idea with moving the galley NE to let us take a peek at the land to our east while on the way south to transfer a worker to the silver island (for fogbusting and roading)?

Last, I take it you want to continue with the planned caravel in Moscow and not build another unit? If we did build a unit, I was thinking that a crossbow might be better--only slightly more expensive than a longbow but it has 50% vs melees (i.e., barbs) while Lbow has only the 25% city defense. I guess we're not likely to see another barb galley for awhile, but when/if we do, I would argue that we need a little extra security in Moscow. The barbs can also unload on silver island, so we shouldn't skimp too badly on defense there (or else keep some money in the bank like this time).

On the other hand, this little diversion may cost us a turn in getting Moscow up to pop 9 (for settler building) so perhaps slotting in that 2-turn Lbow isn't much of a sacrifice. It would let us keep our unit fortified by Bombay, rather than running to St Pete. What do you think? CB, Rolo, anybody--this would be a good time to speak up. We need to run some risks to try to win, but if we guess wrong in the wrong place...
 
It has been tested, and both barb units run around and start pillaging things, starting with the gold tiles. Plus St. Pete gains three unhappy people from the lack of a garrison. So not only does St. Pete starve, but we still would have no way of killing the barbs (specifically the mace) for a number of turns until a crossbow could be made. They'd run around and pillage a whole bunch of tiles. You could 'persuade' them to capture workers instead to stall the pillaging, but that's hardly beneficial either. By moving the pike out of St. Pete, the barbs no longer feel like gate crashing Moscow, and thus we'd have one starving city for a turn, one less unit in Gandhi's lands for a longer period of time (since the pike from Bombay would have to stay in St. Pete until the barbs are neutralized) and we still have two barb units wandering around with no counter to them for at least three turns. Compared to the other schemes, this one is by far the worst.

I'd have Moscow build the longbow for garrison purposes after the barbs are gone. Like I said earlier, I'm not leaving maces as garrison units. Once the longbow is in, build the Caravel, then settler. We'll definitely be at pop 9 by this point, and probably close to 10 (but not enough to make stalling worthwhile. Plus there would be the happy cap issue as well).

I moved the galley out from Moscow because I was under the impression the odds of us winning weren't nearly as good and we'd lose the city, so I was seeing where I could stick the galley without irking the barb galley. It doesn't matter what we do with it, so I'd probably leave it in port until the barb galley is neutralized. We don't gain any line of sight by moving him out for a turn.

If you want you can move the archer from seaside. It's not going to end up impacting anything, but if it makes you happy ;) .
 
It isn't what I'd do if playing by myself, but I'll go along with BL's plan if there are no objections by tonight (~9 EST), when I'll play again. To be clear, here's the plan:

Follow post 244, except that:
Move new galley 2NENE-E, out of coastal range of the barb galley. This will let us take a peek at the land to our east before the galley heads south to fogbust around the silver island and probably transport a worker and/or warrior there.
Upgrade the Moscow warrior to mace.
Move Seaside archer toward Moscow. (Move back if unneeded.)
Do not move the St Pete pike.
Move the pike currently NE of Bombay toward St Pete so St Pete pike can join the hunt for the spear (if all goes well).
Move the two workers by Moscow NW to start another workshop. Cancel action that turn to see what happens. Return to original workshop site if possible next turn.
Build a longbow in Moscow (2 turns).
Move warrior from horses 1NW. Put him on cows if necessary, otherwise to garrison in St Pete.

With a little luck, the barb mace will attack us and die, and the barb spear will then either attack again and die, or move off the cows without pillaging. Using TBD (our mace would be ideal, but may take awhile to heal), we will hunt down the spear and kill it. If possible, don't leave St Pete or Moscow undefended to do this, as the unhappiness will be bad.

Check Moscow tile allocations each turn, since barbs have messed with us.

After the Moscow Lbow is finished, build a caravel and then a settler. Move the Moscow mace west to strengthen our positions as needed.

Of course, if Moscow falls, I will ... stop. Given the low probability of anybody else being able to play within the next few days (based on current info), I'll will otherwise play to around turn 50 or so.
 
I was saying to not move the galley at all, but if you want you can move him. Our line of sight isn't improved my moving him at all (and he can't move 2 NE either - it's 1 NE, 1 E ;) ). Just to clarify, the unit in St. Pete is a pike. The unit outside of Bombay is a pike as well. Also don't forget to move the warrior on the horses 1 NW, not 1 N so that we have the option of sticking him on the cows or moving him back towards St. Pete. Fingers crossed the barbs do as they are expected to do.
 
We live to fight another day! ... although it did not go as planned. The barb mace knocked our mace down to 3.28 and then the spear attacked. We survived with 1.6 HP out of 8. :eek: Bloody hell, I don't think my nerves can take any more playing. I'm going to take a little break and calm down. :)

Later...
I played to turn 50 (1535 AD). We're in good shape. Sorry, I forgot to upload the save before shutting down, and the darn Windows startup tune plays at full volume when running it on the iMac--I'll figure out how to fix that someday. The kids are asleep so I'll have to wait until tomorrow morning. (I'm writing this on my laptop.)

Turn 47: We get the Great Eng. I've saved him for now, but am tempted to settle for the hammers and beakers. I also captured the fast worker who dared venture north of Delhi. The other events were recorded above. ;) [Edit: This is when Islam spread to Seaside.]

IBT 47/48: Gandhi builds a caravel in Delhi and the barb axe attacks our explorer while in the forest out west. We win (2.6/4). :)

Turn 48: Fearing the new caravel, I move our trireme west, hoping it won't be followed so it can explore a bit. Gandhi attacks it IBT and kills it. His caravel is now heading north, perhaps to prevent use of our newly netted Broberg seafood.

IBT: Mao founds a new city. I also notice that Seaside has Islam--didn't notice when that happened. Was that mentioned before?

Turn 49: Bombay sends a catapult south. Our knight kills it without a scratch.

Turn 50: Bombay sends a longbow east and the knight kills it (8.5/10 strength, 6/5 XP). To be safe, I've put our healed mace from Moscow on the forest hill NE of Bombay and put the Lbow that was there with the knight.

Builds are proceeding according to plan. I didn't yet move the new caravel in Moscow--where do we want to send it? Our galley has made it down south and the warrior there can board next turn. I figure we'll have the galley check out the tile(s) we can't see before dropping him in a safe spot. Assuming the island isn't much bigger than what we can see, he should be able to fogbust the whole thing. I also have a worker in our SE working on a road until the galley comes back for him; he can be used to at least road the silver and iron and then maybe fogbust on the northern coast to help with barb galley spawning. I've been playing dosey-do with our latest captured worker trying to get him east and he should have a clear path now. Since we have so many now, I'd like to keep the two workers out west to fogbust as much land as possible, even if they aren't doing anything. Broberg has finished its barracks and started on an Lbow. The hill tile to its SE should be under our control in another 3 turns. The Lbow that gave us problems before has been camped out on the hill NE of there, scowling at our seafood I guess.

I can play more but have already had something like 17 turns. Who wants it next (once I upload it :blush:)?

[Xpost with BL: Gah, yes, great fun! I can hardly wait to have more fun in the BOTM Diety game--I'm about to attack my first city, which has 31 units in it at last count. I will likely suffer a humilating defeat. But that's OK, since there's hardly any time left to finish. ;)]
 
Wow. Alright. I'll be free to take over next week. But wow. Wasn't that fun? :p :faint:

EDIT: @XC. Attacking your first city that has 31 units in it? :eek: I hope you brought siege...
 
I've uploaded the save, available on the Progress page. Looks like we're sort of mid-pack on the overall score but highest (for the date), by a lot, on the power graph. Once St Pete finishes its mace, and with Broberg continuing to look after its own defenses, I could see St Pete relaxing a bit and starting to work on a settler. Once it's secure, Broberg needs to build some boats: caravels for exploring and to prevent Delhi from sending out a settler galley (maybe stacked with a galley for blockading), and workboats to help Seaside. It would also be nice to have a galley ferry over a unit to the island west of our explorer; he can see sheep over there.

I didn't move the Moscow caravel yet. I assume we mostly want him to keep the barb galleys at bay? They're coming from the island to our SE. If St Pete can help with the settlers, maybe Moscow could stick in another caravel some time to do some real exploring and get us that circumnav bonus.

The knight works well guarding the plains S and E of Bombay. I'd send our mace toward Delhi to really box in Delhi and protect Broberg. Gandhi still has that Lbow on the hill a little east of Broberg, and we'll need to keep him at bay (or kill him) if we want to work the hill directly SE of Broberg. We'll have cultural control in a couple turns.

I hate to sound like a broken record, but am a bit obsessed with fogbusting everything we possibly can to keep out barbs and their cities, even on islands (e.g., way out west) that we can't get to yet. We have lots of workers provided free of charge by Gandhi; please indulge me and use them to keep the world safe for Stalinism?

[Edit: The Eng will give us 1560 beakers toward Gunpowder. I think Sci's give us 1.5x as much, so that would be ~2340 toward Education, which is a little more than we need, right? The Globe theatre is 300 hammers (normal speed) vs 250 for National Epic, but the Globe requires 5 theatres (on Small maps such as ours) as prereqs. There's a lot of stuff Moscow could build, and settling the Eng (3 hammers, 3 beakers) would increase our hammer total by roughly 15% over the near to mid-term. Seaside won't have a ton of hammers even when fully mined and workshopped, but I'm tempted to settle the Eng in Moscow and start raking in the benefits right now. Earlier benefits are more valuable benefits and we wouldn't be "wasting" any of the Eng's rushable hammers on a relatively minor National Wonder.]
 
[GOTM staff] *cough* Pleeeeeease don't discuss any BOTM-related stuff outside the spoiler threads. :nono: [/GOTM staff]
 
*cough* Pleeeeeease don't discuss any BOTM-related stuff outside the spoiler threads. :nono:

Anyone who could gain any useful info from a complete description of what I've done so far must be in serious trouble with meeting the deadline. :D But I hear and obey. I doubt very much I'll finish in time but I'm having quite a bit of fun with this one.

Hmm, the BOTM words caught your eye but you have nothing to say about our flirtation with disaster? OK, it wasn't a barb axe walking into our capital, but still... :lol:
 
That's why I only left it as a polite request to stop, rather than ask for it to be removed. ;)

And I'm following what you do, don't doubt that. I just think you're doing a good enough job on your own (plus I fear to be dragged in when I don't really have the time to be...). :)
 
Looked at the save, and here's my thoughts.

Economy: It's actually in terrible shape. At 20% we run a gold profit, and a small one at that. No more units - we gotta make do with what we have, since we're already spending 17 gold / turn on our military. To fix this, here's what I propose.

St. Pete is at its happy cap and will exceed it in 9 turns. We're running +3 food / turn surplus here, so I'm going to tear up 2 grassland farms and replace them with cottages while adding a third cottage which was the initial plan before Gandhi showed up. The mines will remain for now. I'm going to need some more workers to do this, since the two that just finished the mine won't be enough. Worker 2 on the tundra furs is coming back as is one of the workers outside of Gandhi's land currently roading to nowhere. As for having St. Pete on settler production... It's too hammer poor to do it effectively. Once I rip up the farms the 15 turns it takes now is going to be more like 18/19, and that's a long time to have a city work on one thing. Instead I'm going to have it build some economic buildings - market (+1 happy now, +2 happy with fur) / bank / maybe grocer depending on circumstances. If we run low on units from Gandhi killing them it could always switch out to a replacement unit or two, but I think to fund our expansion we need to get some infrastructure in place pronto. Not to mention some courthouses too - With four cities we have 13 gold / turn in city maintenance costs. Not cheap.

I'm going to also change Moscow up a bit. Instead of building a settler now, I'm going to substitute in a market (7 turns) which not only ups the happy cap but also multiplies the two gold tiles (and the others ofc) for roughly another 8 gold / turn. Doing this will also get it to grow to pop 9 for settler duty and thus it'll have 2 new workshop tiles to work as opposed to just the one.

Broberg is going to need another grassland hill. If Gandhi's longbow doesn't move once we retake the one tile, I'm going to give our new longbow guerilla I and move him onto the hill next to him and fortify. I'll move the worker to that hill and start mining in, leaving the longbow there as a permanent fixture on the tile. Once the longbow is out I'm going to build some workboats for Seaside (exact number I'm not sure of yet). Afterward, I'm seriously giving some thought to putting some turns into the Shwedagon Paya for failure cash. We're industrious and have gold, so we'd get a ton of hammers invested for not a lot of turn cost. As it stands now it takes 22 turns to finish - and that's working 2 hammer producing tiles. You may say "but we have a ton of gold already," but at 100% we're losing 45 a turn, good for 16 turns or so with our current numbers. It'll obviously be higher since we're not going to 100% now, but I think the point still stands: once we run out of money we're kind of screwed until we get more in the bank.

Our GP farm in Seaside is drastically limited in one major aspect: happy cap. Without any additional units or buildings, we're stuck at 8 until the silver and furs get hooked up which bumps it to ten. However, at pop 8 it could contribute quite nicely to the settler production. Working the five seafood tiles and the 3 mines, it could produce a settler every 11 turns. We'd then have the option of swinging Moscow off of settler duty to build buildings, boats, or whatever.

I'm going to send the Caravel out to explore the nearby land to our west. I think the circumnavigation bonus is out - unless we buy maps off of people I think we're too late, so late that I think trying to without thoroughly exploring what's around us may hurt us. I'd like to see what the islands around us hold to get an idea of how quick we need to settle them.

As for our engineer, we have three realistic options. One, we settle him in Moscow. Two, we rush a wonder somewhere, probably a National Wonder. Three, we save him for Mining Inc. As rolo pointed out way back, global warming is going to be an issue, and the likelihood of us popping another GE is rare. We have 2 gold and 2 Iron right now, we'll have another silver and probably another copper, so that's 6 resources multiplied by 1.5 for 9 hammers per turn from the corp. Not too shabby at all, and that's before we acquire more from other continents/islands. We're going to need hammers everywhere for the nukes to roll off the line, so I'm seriously considering keeping him around until corporation and railroad is in. It's a gamble, but the payoff could be huge.

Keeping with the corp theme, once Seaside is ready to be converted to the GP farm I think we should run scientists (duh) until we're close to teching off medicine. With a well planned switch to merchants we should be able to produce one when we tech medicine. The other option is to just run merchants straight from the start so the pool isn't polluted to guarantee the merchant, then run scientists for the duration. The drawback is obvious - our second GP will be sitting around doing nothing along with the first one until the prerequisites are met. I also seriously doubt our chances to nab the free merchant from economics, especially considering our tech state at the time.

On the diplomacy front, I just thought I'd point out that Gandhi is Mao's worst enemy. We should keep and eye on that and keep that in mind.

And I'm following what you do, don't doubt that. I just think you're doing a good enough job on your own (plus I fear to be dragged in when I don't really have the time to be...). :)

C'mon, you gotta have something to say if you're keeping track at home... There's gotta be at least one thing we've done that's made you cringe so far! :p
 
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