SGOTM 13 - tao

[ignas]

I will grab the save shortly and figure out production plans, and a dot map for the other island in case we get as far as settling there. My preference is for getting at least one city established on the second island

We must settle that island ASAP, a dotmap is in the post #114. A settler and galley should complete on the IT when getting Map Making. Maybe firstly settling on the black dot? Then the other on pink dot near wines.

Research: probably philopsophy at max, heading for Republic

 

[Furiey]

Yes, I don't like the P site but the other locations on that map seem OK. We need the first city to be productive quickly without needing border expansions. Pink dot would give wines & 2 BGs without expansion, Black dot would only give 1 BG and 1 other 2 food site but is quicker to get to. How about green dot? The same number of turns to get to as Black but gives 2 BG and lots of grass without expansion, then pink & black.

 

[ignas]

I'd say black dot as it is 2 turns faster (we will improve income faster and gain more points). We will have one more town in Wineland even before a first town on Wineland will grow to size 20 (10turns) so it is good at first with one bg. If we will put second town on pink dot both towns will be connected by culture and will have more "good" (bg's) tiles to work after growth.

We need workers in new island...

 

[TheOverseer714]

Since we can't cash rush, we could MM to get workers built on the same turn that the town is growing and not lose too much population. Of course we will be abandoning Trantor, so its population could be reduced by settlers and workers to help get Wineland developed. I'd say settler 3 needs to be for our new palace town, it needs to grow fast. I agree with Thinktank that it needs to be coastal, even if it means sacrificing a BG.

 

[denyd]

I'd like to see us dedicate the home island cities as follows:
Trantor: build 6 Settlers then disband, use the 6th settler to re-found
Terminus: build 3 Settlers then workers
Selden: build workers

I'm thinking we'll need about 12-15 workers to get Wineland up to speed quickly and then we can join them back to get our towns up to max size, which I'm guess will be 7 (1 Content + 1 for Wine + 2 MP + 1 Temple + 2 SCI). That would give us about 27 units of support (8 Cities & 3 towns), made up of 16 MP & 8 Workers & 3 scouting Galleys. As for military, I don't see any reason to build anything by Regular Warriors. Before Astronomy only the Great Lighthouse AI (Dutch) might be able to reach us and after Asronomy is discovered, if any AI declare on us, we're goners anyway (unless we employ the SABER turtle defense).

I'm thinking we'll probably need 2-3 Galleys to get all the transport done in a timely manner.

I agree that after Map Making we should head for Republic (though Masonry is tempting). We shouldn't need any military until Astronomy (except for MP duty), so barracks aren't needed, that leave only temples & harbors as available infrastructure builds. Suggestions for each new town?

As for the dot map, we might want to move the P one NE if it's on a BG. I'd also like to settle in this order: Green, Palace, Blue, Black, Pink, White, Olive & Orange.

BTW: Since I started the naming of cities on the original with Foundation planets, any suggestions for the naming of Wineland cities? How about wine varieties (Cabernet, Merlot, etc)?

 

[ignas]

I agree palace on coast is much better in this situation. Palace city as 3 rd town is ok, it will have more population when we flip our palace (less military needed). I'd say firstly settle on black dot (it's fastest ).

Of course no military before Astronomy but infrastructure. After Astronomy we may start warfare for specialist farms, stay tuned..

I'd say granary in Terminus for faster settler building, later for workers after the "Wineland" is settled.

And a city naming in "Wineland" sounds good

 

[Furiey]

1E would also give P on the coast and not on a BG. I still prefer Green as the 1st site, a better initial site than black and just a quick. Blue site is a good site and will give wines, horses, production and growth. I think deynd's green, palace blue would allow us the get this up and running quickly. as for what builds what, it will have to be a balance between growth and production, at it is Seldon has no growth and won't be able to build Settlers.

It's a pity Trantor is the capitol and needs to be abandoned, as if we have 2 cities left on our island, Trantor and Seldon would be best. What about abandoning both Trantor and Terminus and refounding Trantor with the last Settler built?

Wine named cities sound good. - blue = Bordeaux?

 

[greatbeyond]

How about the following for city names:

Bordeaux, Riesling, Merlot, Chardonnay, Cabernet Sauvignon, Pinot Noir, Shiraz

I'll be building in about 8 hours

 

[ThinkTank]

How about the following for city names:

Bordeaux, Riesling, Merlot, Chardonnay, Cabernet Sauvignon, Pinot Noir, Shiraz

I'll be building in about 8 hours

Bordeaux is not a grape, the others are. Most Bordeaux wines are made from the grapes Cabernet Sauvignon or Merlot (or a mix).

(My weekly dose of pedantry. )

 

[greatbeyond]

We'll it's not as bad as it could be. Chardonnay founded on Wineland. Another Settler on it's way. Portugal scouting in our direction. Portugal has Swordsmen. One Curragh left in Portugal territory

Temporarily set production in Trantor and Seldon to Harbor. It looks like this will help growth more than Granaries, for now. Settler building in Terminus

The save:
http://gotm.civfanatics.net/saves/sgotm13/tao_SG013_BC0550_01.SAV

Turn log:

Spoiler :

Civ3CSGOTM13
Great Beyond 750BC

T0 - 750BC - check layout see that Trantor will build Temple same turn as MM, change worker from Cow to Coast, change 1 citizen from Scientest to Tax Collector. Change Terminus worker from BG to Cows, change Seldon worker from SEa to BG, change production to Temple

T1 - 730BC - Curragh lost, Spanish are building the Great Library, Switch Workers around to maintain research

T-2 - 710BC -

T-3 - 690BC - Leave everything as is, cut back science slider

T-4 - 670BC - IBT realize that the only city that will complete a build this turn is Trantor, build Galley there as it will take 1 turn to get it into position for transport. Terminus is changed to Settler, it will still take 3 turns? I checked th number of shields last turn and we seemed to be on-target. Seldon is building a Galley and has 19 turns to go. It was a mistake to have it keep building Curraghs as a Temple prebuild at the right time, would have had a Galley ready to go. Set Research to Philo as suggested, at Max it is 15 turns.
Considered Pop rushing the Galley in SEldon (IBT) but decided it would take too long to become productive again.
Trantor working Cows, Fish, Rocks, Hill Terminus working BG, Oysters, Plains, Coast Seldon working Coast and BG. Lux slider moved up to 10% to hurry production

T-5 650C - Russia completes Great Library in Moscow! Portugese are sending Galleys in our direction. We might be lucky to settle one of the two empty islands

T-6 630BC - Arabia builds Hanging Gardens in Mecca, Portugese drop off a Settler on the island near them and continue the Galley in our direction. Spain also drops off a Settler on the same island. Our Settler boards our Galley and heads off to Wineland

T-7 610BC - Our Galley is just off Wineland

T-8 590BC - Our Settler is dropped off on Wineland

T-9 570BC - Lose Curragh in Southeastern Ocean. Chardonnay is founded on the Green Dot. In retrospect I should have sent one of the warriors from Terminus with the Settler

T-10 550BC - Finish Galley in Seldon, finish Settler in Trantor. Our Curragh is traversing Portugese territory and Henry has asked us to remove ourselves. I'm hoping the automatic move may get us on the east side of Potrugal. Settler and Warrior from Terminus loaded onto Galley

ignas (up next)
tao
TheOverseer714
ThinkTank
denyd
Furiey
greatbeyond (just played)

Screenshots:

 

[greatbeyond]

More food for thought:

With the way things are going now, I'm thinking the Great Library steal may be the only way we get close in techs. This would mean building a military and get friendly with the Russians when we find them.

Should we consider establishing an Embassy with Portugal and/or Spain? This might help our relations and cheapen the costs of techs.

 

[ignas]

Ok, got it. Will keep settling Wineland and researching towards Republic.

Anyone looked at QSC score table? We look not so bad. Team Klarius has 4 contacts at 1000bc so there are some more nearby civs, probably in the south. Also team Klarius has 2 temples, Spooks have a granary

 

[ignas]

Played my turnset, met Egypt, founded 2 towns, a settler is 1 turn from blue dot. Will upload the save and post turnlog tomorrow..

 

[ignas]

550bc change Trantor to settler, Seldon to galley

IT: Russians complete Sun Tzu's Art of War in St.Petersburgh

530bc: move galleys

IT: nothing

510BC move galleys

IT: portugese galleys sailing around

490BC: unload settler and warrior on the Wineland

IT: Chardonnay warrior-> worker

470BC: found our to be palace city Merlot, start galley

IT: Trantor grows to size 3

450BC: nothing

IT: Terminus settler->galley

430BC: load settler into galley

IT: Trantor settler->galley

410BC: unload settler on black dot

IT: Egyptian galley comes into our curragh 11 view

390BC: contact Egypt, they are up many techs as Portugal and Spain; notice Spain and Egypt are in Monarchy;found Riesling on the black dot, start warrior, due in 5

IT: Chardonnay worker->galley

370BC:

IT:Seldon galley->galley

350BC: worker starts roading bg

Some production might be changed: switch Trantor to galley, Chardonnay to warrior. Use galleys on suicide missions.

Philosophy is in 6, after that buy CoL and start Republic at min.

Better firstly roading tiles for more commerce.

Galley with settler in it is on the way to blue dot


tao (up next)
TheOverseer714
ThinkTank
denyd
Furiey
greatbeyond
ignas (just played)

 

[ThinkTank]

Do we need to declare a skip here? tao has not been online for 5 days.

 

[ignas]

I guess tao needs a skip.

TheOverseer714 is up

 

[greatbeyond]

Let's keep moving. We have a long road ahead of us and a serious challenge to not be eliminated, by advanced civs. Should we be working on improving relations with a couple of the other civs? The last thing we need is one of them taking a dislike to us and wiping us off the map.

 

[ignas]

Well none civs can reach us before Astronomy (except The Dutch who has built Big Lighthouse) so embassies can wait.

 

[TheOverseer714]

Downloaded the save and I am playing. Verrrry slooowww IBT's, in excess of 2 minutes already, man I dread the Modern era.

 

[TheOverseer714]

I played another thrilling turn-set, with a few new things and some highlights among the lousy RNG results. Here is my turn-log, and the save:

Spoiler :

Pre-flight: CivAssist 2, Word running. Get the save loaded. Look things over.
I switch galley build in Seldon to a settler.

Non-Combat:
Settler 1
Workers 1 native
Military:
Warriors 7
Galleys 3
Curragh 1

Hit enter=>

IBT: Nothing happens, but it takes over 2 minutes, ouch.

Turn 1, 330 BC: Move the boats around, sending one to make the great crossing.

IBT: Galley sinks, my luck continues.

Turn 2, 310 BC: Settler dropped off at blue dot. Another exciting turn-set, I see.

IBT: Cleo warns us about our mighty curragh. I apologize.
Riesling warrior=>worker.

Turn 3, 290 BC: Bordeaux founded=>worker.

IBT: Chardonnay warrior=>warrior.

Turn 4, 270 BC: Lower research rate to 70% and still get Philosophy next turn.
Move new warrior to Merlot.

IBT: We get Philosophy, next is CoL in 32 turns, as there is no way to buy it.
Trantor galley=>warrior.

Turn 5, 250 BC: Send another galley to try the great crossing.

IBT: Terminus galley=>settler.

Turn 6, 230 BC: Curragh keeps finding more Egypt.

IBT: Trantor warrior=>settler.
Another galley bites the dust. I have no luck with suicide ships.

Turn 7, 210 BC: Curragh finds Pink borders, France or Inca colors.
Egypt is now a Republic. Spanish in Anarchy, probably heading Republic.

IBT: Riesling worker=>warrior.

Turn 8, 190 BC: Meet Joanie, they are up the same 6 techs as everyone else.
Also in the “as usual” department, we can afford none.

IBT: Chardonnay warrior=>worker.

Turn 9, 170 BC: Never entered French territory, next turn, more Egypt

IBT: Seldon settler=>galley.

Turn 10, 150 BC: Settler boarded onto galley.
Another galley sets out for the great crossing.
My last suicide galley of the turn-set.
That’s all for a very frustrating and depressing turn-set.

I was kind of depressed at my seeming lack of progress, but then I looked at the results graph and realized I did no worse than anyone else. I'm not sure what catapulted Team Klarius so straight up, but I hope we're on a similar track. I'm not sure my name for blue dot city is wine-appropriate, but I know diddly about wine. I'm sure our wine aficianados will correct me in my lack of information

Save: http://gotm.civfanatics.net/saves/sgotm13/tao_SG013_BC0150_01.SAV