SGOTM 14 - Ivan
- Thread starter AlanH
- Start date
Taking it all in--daughter had a birthday party to go to today. I will play sometime tomorrow, most probably in the evening. So keep the discussion up, not that there's a LOT left to discuss...
One more idea from my side: I think sailing ships all around the continent is quite slow. I would rather (short-)rush two each in Uskudar, Mecca & Medina. In the West just build knights. Using our "trans-continental highway" they can reach the east coast much faster than a ship. Put ship building on the west coast to low priority for now. Our fleet there doesn't need to be ready until we have finished our home continent.
The general settup could be something like this:
The general settup could be something like this:
- Complete a fleet in the east (mainly using FP area) and finish France (or at least take and hold Paris)
- The core area will concentrate on knights for our wars against Russia, Babs and Zululand. Build a galley there only once in a while.
- Time galley production in the west in such a way that by the time the home continent is subdued, we'll have like 6-8 galleys ready. Our "main continental army" will then mount the boats and attack the first target in the west (probably Japan, but if Japan is too strongly defended, we may choose weaker targets first to minimize losses?!)
- In the end we will have two fleets: an eastern fleet, getting reinforcements (ships & knighs) from the FP area, and a western fleet, getting reinforcements from the core.
I. Larkin
Deity
- Joined
- Feb 21, 2003
- Messages
- 4,417
This is correct in general, but I'd like to have more precise schedule. We "overpruduse" horses and our "monarchy" income (~ 120 gpt) will only let us 1 upgrade per turn. Rush Galley at East also costs 116 golg. Because of that any Galley that come to east area from West coast give us extra Knight. To increase income I'd mine Iron near Lagos to have Marketplace there faster.
If we put Gui for prebuild and use Hills, say, KT will be ready in 22 (or 23). That mean that our Fleet at East must be ready to land Knights at turn 19-20 from now. Chivalry come at 7, so we have only (!) 12 turns to make these upgrades and rushes, say 6 Galleys and 6 Knights. This is "bare minimum", I think, for Landing at France. Since Early GA is important thing I don't whant to take risk. Anything, that may help to have more Galleys at East and "more Knights earlier" is what we have to consider and concentrate on.
In reality our "Home AIs" are "done", the "reminder" is
1) Capture SoZ
2) Drive Zulu out.
3) Not let them kill each other.
Because SoZ far away "1)" is "impossible" now
we may start "2)" but may be risky. We thought about MA with Zulu vs France, are they landed at France already?
In fact, befor French Landing we may have 4-5 Knights for 10 -12 turns, not that big forces and not that much time...
Any ideas??
May be simply perform "nerovats plan" of MidEast conflict regulation?
I also think, that we can stay near Moscow, say, in a "hope" that Babylon Capture it and we take it for us?
(Road to Moscow!).
In fact landing to Celtia and America could be very difficult. But in our plan (I think) to use there land as "prison" for others AIs.
I'd like very much to settle Babylons to America's tundra, but we need capture some American Cities and make Peace with Babylons...
I think we may schedule Japan after Babylon. Lighthouse is a greate help and If Army will be in Babylon and fleet ready near it is "just in place". Again, better re-settle Japan to America, but we need capture some American Cities...
Agree with Ivan. Lisbon could build 2 galleys (these galleys will reach Mecca in time for attack on Paris), then barracks. Let's say we need 6 galleys for succesful campaign vs France: 2 comes from Lisbon + one fortified in Lagos + curragh near France upgraded to galley=4, so just 2 needs be shortrushed in Uskudar leaving more money for horse->knight upgrade.
I see. How about the following plan in order to save as much money as we can:
Uskudar, Mecca and Medina collect shields for 10 turns, then rush a galley, then collect shields again until one turn before our fleet will leave the harbor, then rush the galleys again.
If one or two galleys from the West still have time to sail around, that will be ok. (But first make sure, there are no barbarian or Babylonian galleys blocking the way... If it's too dangerous, better turn around and save the galleys for the western fleet.)
For now we don't upgrade any horses! Except in these cases:
That way we should be able to produce 10-12 knights in 18 turns, with only minimal money investment! (Two of the really low-producing towns could build two pikes till then.)
Then, if there's still money left the turn before our fleet sails (and there should be some), rush another galley and/or upgrade a couple horses. Just make sure that we have a perfect match between the number of galleys and the number of travellers. Spend all the money the turn before we sail! Perhaps that way we can even get to 7 or 8 fully loaded galleys!
Once our French campaign has started, we can then return to "normal business" and start using our income for upgrading the remaining horses.
Lanzelot
Uskudar, Mecca and Medina collect shields for 10 turns, then rush a galley, then collect shields again until one turn before our fleet will leave the harbor, then rush the galleys again.
If one or two galleys from the West still have time to sail around, that will be ok. (But first make sure, there are no barbarian or Babylonian galleys blocking the way... If it's too dangerous, better turn around and save the galleys for the western fleet.)
For now we don't upgrade any horses! Except in these cases:
- urgently need a knight for defending against a Babs attack
- we know, that we have reached the required numbers of galleys in the east already
That way we should be able to produce 10-12 knights in 18 turns, with only minimal money investment! (Two of the really low-producing towns could build two pikes till then.)
Then, if there's still money left the turn before our fleet sails (and there should be some), rush another galley and/or upgrade a couple horses. Just make sure that we have a perfect match between the number of galleys and the number of travellers. Spend all the money the turn before we sail! Perhaps that way we can even get to 7 or 8 fully loaded galleys!
Once our French campaign has started, we can then return to "normal business" and start using our income for upgrading the remaining horses.
Lanzelot
I. Larkin
Deity
- Joined
- Feb 21, 2003
- Messages
- 4,417
What barracks for? After Galleys it is time to build settler, and may be some galleys after.. Note that nat all galleys may survie at North.
@Lanzelot: Calculations show that we have "just enough" cash. It is no reason to "save it" for "Later Knight upgrade" if we may upgrade now and do something usefull while Galleys sail around.
Question is "What usefull we can do"?
Two comments:
- Oh why didn't you finish the market I had started there long time ago...
- Before mining the hill, disconnect the road...! I think we should use our Istanbul-iron for connect/disconnect. (But keep a couple of workers near Faro, in case Istanbul flips... Don't know how high the risk is.)
I. Larkin
Deity
- Joined
- Feb 21, 2003
- Messages
- 4,417
Because we urgently need settlers to fill the gap in productive areas. And workers to improve it.
It is so long time for our "connect / disconnect" and so risky to be without iron now that I'd rather mine as it is. + 1gpt now...
I guess we just have too many urgent things to do at the same time... 
And only one thing can be done.
Ok, that convinces me!
Perhaps this would be useful: our peace with Russia will expire in about ten turns. If we have 6 or 7 knights by then, there might be still time to take 2 Russian towns before heading for the east coast?! (Either from Russia directly, or if we get lucky, from Babylon, as Ivan already pointed out.)
But then before that we should take the last Ottoman town and gift it to Russia. Is there still time for that as well?
Attacking the Zulus appears too risky for such a short-term strike. It may bind more forces than we can afford, and put the French campaign at risk.
And only one thing can be done.
Ok, that convinces me!
Perhaps this would be useful: our peace with Russia will expire in about ten turns. If we have 6 or 7 knights by then, there might be still time to take 2 Russian towns before heading for the east coast?! (Either from Russia directly, or if we get lucky, from Babylon, as Ivan already pointed out.)
But then before that we should take the last Ottoman town and gift it to Russia. Is there still time for that as well?
Attacking the Zulus appears too risky for such a short-term strike. It may bind more forces than we can afford, and put the French campaign at risk.
I. Larkin
Deity
- Joined
- Feb 21, 2003
- Messages
- 4,417
And what have happend first time?This is the official "I got it", though I hoped to play last night. I won't let that same thing happen twice.
Children happened. (Not the making of them--that'd be okay--but the taking care of the ones we have.) They were particularly needy last night.
Othniel
fighting for Achsah
Life happens. We're still moving the game along pretty quick.
eldar
ChiefTank
Talking of RL: I just got in a (minor) car accident so I have to take my car to the shop tomorrow to get it repaired. Then I'm taking my NY State Driver's Test on Thursday.
I don't need a job; it's a full-time occupation keeping track of my life right now.
I don't need a job; it's a full-time occupation keeping track of my life right now.
Played, everything went reasonably OK I think. In particular, some fancy blocking (OK, just a massive wall of horse flesh) kept our dark area safe until I could settle.
The save is at: http://gotm.civfanatics.net/saves/sgotm14/Ivan_SG014_BC0550_01.SAV
Turn log:
I have a few thoughts:
1. We're doing OK as far as money for horse upgrades goes. It may be optimal to rush the barracks at Mecca (or, better, chop a forest into it) so we can upgrade there, not a big deal either way though. Forest chop is probably best. Either way, a couple of galley rushes in the east will be necessary, but we have three on the northern passage, one curragh that can upgrade, and one more galley following that may arrive just in time but it's close. At any rate, two galley rushes in the east should be doable.
2. We have two turns left on peace with the Ottomans. Before we declare war, I'd love to see what that orange border to the north of France is (see screen shot). I think it's the Inca, but if I am wrong and it's Ottoman, that makes for some interesting possibilities, notably taking out BOTH Ottoman cities in the north and making some densely-packed jail cells for our captive civs.
3. I have seen no Babylonian units, we're still at war. I'd leave one or two knights home to guard against that and build a force to take them out.
4. The pikes in Evora and Leiria are meant for the French invasion. I think it might be wise to have a few more after that though.
5. May want to make peace with Japan before ending turn? That galley is almost certainly empty but why let it take a potshot at our galley there? We're also very very thin on defense anywhere out west; I'm perhaps paranoid about it but it's Russia and the Zulu over there, I can't be too far wrong.
6. Check the MMing. I'm probably missing a fair amount.
The save is at: http://gotm.civfanatics.net/saves/sgotm14/Ivan_SG014_BC0550_01.SAV
Turn log:
Spoiler :
I have a few thoughts:
1. We're doing OK as far as money for horse upgrades goes. It may be optimal to rush the barracks at Mecca (or, better, chop a forest into it) so we can upgrade there, not a big deal either way though. Forest chop is probably best. Either way, a couple of galley rushes in the east will be necessary, but we have three on the northern passage, one curragh that can upgrade, and one more galley following that may arrive just in time but it's close. At any rate, two galley rushes in the east should be doable.
2. We have two turns left on peace with the Ottomans. Before we declare war, I'd love to see what that orange border to the north of France is (see screen shot). I think it's the Inca, but if I am wrong and it's Ottoman, that makes for some interesting possibilities, notably taking out BOTH Ottoman cities in the north and making some densely-packed jail cells for our captive civs.
3. I have seen no Babylonian units, we're still at war. I'd leave one or two knights home to guard against that and build a force to take them out.
4. The pikes in Evora and Leiria are meant for the French invasion. I think it might be wise to have a few more after that though.
5. May want to make peace with Japan before ending turn? That galley is almost certainly empty but why let it take a potshot at our galley there? We're also very very thin on defense anywhere out west; I'm perhaps paranoid about it but it's Russia and the Zulu over there, I can't be too far wrong.
6. Check the MMing. I'm probably missing a fair amount.
