SGOTM 19 - Also Sprach Sid

One point: if we generate a Great Engineer next, which is unlikely, and if we decide that Mining Inc > Sushi, then we may want to stay in Caste/Pacifism for at least one more turn.

Spoiler :

Constantinople has 250/500 :gp: . It generates 102GP per turn.

T114: 352/500GP​
We then drop out of Pacifism, with 4 turns of the GA left. We run 2x Scientists and a 1x Spy:

T115: 379/600
T116: 405/600
T117: 431/600
T118: 457/600​
GA ends. Ten turns later:
T118: 587/600
T129: 600/600GP​
If we chain GAs until the end, starting on T129, this takes us to T166.

Not running Pacifism/Caste System on T113 would delay this Great Person to T132, taking us to T169.

Would this delay Oxford?

----

We are unlikely to generate a Great Engineer.

kossin is right that Sushi requires fewer :science: .

Mining Inc. is easier to spread, if this is the hidden requirement. But this is pure guesswork from the graph.

It looks harder to me to connect the Mining Inc resources, unless kcd has hidden a single Fish and single coal in the top right hand corner of the map.
 
Mining also has a big drawback VS Sushi: we'll know where the Coal is well after the Cuir war has started. It would be good to have revealed the entire map before/when we declare (apart from the Barb corner) so we can easily plan our destructive path.

Mining will probably require more dom limit caution as well.
 
We/I had sounding history of producing GE with low odd.:mischief:

2GEs in SGOTM11, 2 or 3 GEs in SGOTM12.

I'm not clear about which corporation to go, really.

One more question, I'm going to sell Feudalism to Alex immediately since otherwise he could trade it from KK with CS.
 
Doshin said:
One point: if we generate a Great Engineer next, which is unlikely, and if we decide that Mining Inc > Sushi, then we may want to stay in Caste/Pacifism for at least one more turn.

Spoiler :

Constantinople has 250/500 :gp: . It generates 102GP per turn.

T114: 352/500GP​
We then drop out of Pacifism, with 4 turns of the GA left. We run 2x Scientists and a 1x Spy:

T115: 379/600
T116: 405/600
T117: 431/600
T118: 457/600​
GA ends. Ten turns later:
T118: 587/600
T129: 600/600GP​
If we chain GAs until the end, starting on T129, this takes us to T166.

Not running Pacifism/Caste System on T113 would delay this Great Person to T132, taking us to T169.

Would this delay Oxford?
Click to expand...

I'm not sure whether this would delay the Oxford, but it surely delay the university whip. I think that we should start researching immediately after the whip without waiting for OU. I prefer to grow Constantinople to happy cap before running specialists, since there are many cottages to be worked.

It's hard to give a detail GPP plan till the end of the game since there are many things that are not clear now including the date of victory. I believe that the advantage from 1 turn earlier to MT is no worse than 1 extra GP since it means 1 turn earlier to work on all those AIs' cities to be captured and snowball effect including those wonder effect.

Moreover, Constantinople could complete Market with chops or even whip to hire merchants.
 
Yes, those numbers are only approximate.

I also would prefer not to run Specialists outside of Representation (on T113), now that we have the Mids. I just wanted to show that, if we generate a Great Engineer, it will be difficult to replace it with another quick GP in time for the Golden Age.

But, since we don't need a GE and both kossin and pomthom have indicated a slight preference for Sushi (I think? Tentative for both), let's not worry about this for now.

BTW, I don't know whether we should keep Huayna Capac alive for as long as possible, so that he continues researching for us. He already has Machinery.

I'm ok with the Feudalism trade and immediate post-University research.
 
I think HC should be our 4th target after KK, his capital is a great commercial city, not mention those juicy wonders, including Parthenon. HC is not like Mansa, the cost of being his friend is not cheap.

Start playing soon.
 
Started hunting for workers, 1st.

Spoiler :




A GS from capital, no surprise of a GE.

Spoiler :




2nd worker. 2LBs in AA.

Spoiler :




3rd worker. Defense in DB is soft.

Spoiler :




We are 7+ turns to complete OU, the effect of lacking Math in the opening!:sad: I believe that our cash is enough, at worst, building wealth to support. Raise slider immediately to push to MT? Last confirmation.

Spoiler :




Another issue is that whether we want to build university in RP, it will contribute immediately. If we stop producing units in RP before MT, it has lots of hammers to finish many infrastructures.
 
Nice Worker hunting. Could you take a picture of the capital, and its hammers (OF + HPT)?

How much :commerce: does RP have per turn? Consider that a Market costs 150H and a Forge 120H, if you want to build both for happiness and production.

The University will need to pay back 200 :science: compared to building Wealth. Can it do that in ~50 turns?
 
Capital, might be able to speed up by 1 turn if working on hammer tiles. However, the loss from not working on cottages is also considerable. It would be nice if you could figure out the best solution.:)

Spoiler :




RP

Spoiler :


 
You should check these:

----

T115: 112H

T116: (19HPT * 2.75) = 52H

T117: (23HPT * 2.75) = 63H (work GH, last turn of GA)

= 227/400H

If we stay working the same configuration of tiles

15HPT * 2.75 = 41HPT

= 4 more turns = 227H + 164H = 391/400H (plus a few more from growth to size 15)

-----

That would be 7 turns. Let me see if 6 is possible without sacrificing too much.
 
T115: change Grassland Cottage ----> Plains Cottage = 118H

T116: change Plains Cottage ---> Grass Hill = (23HPT * 2.75) = 63H

T117: change GH to Plains Cottage, extra pop to Plains Farm = (24HPT * 2.75) = 66H

= 247/400H​

T118: 19HPT * 2.75 = 52HPT (work PH and GH)
T119: 19HPT * 2.75 = 52HPT (work PH and GH)
T120: 19HPT * 2.75 = 52HPT (work PH and GH)

(52 * 3) + 247 = 403/400H​

----

Again, untested.
 
1 turn of OU is about 80 beakers.

1 grassland village vs a plain hill is 3~4C = 6.3~8.4 beakers if we assume that 2F=4H. The 6 turns will cost ~40 beakers.

I think the result is similar.

So, 7 turns of OU for a lazy man.:p

Edit: Think again, looks like 6 turn OU is better, will follow your micro then.:goodjob:
 
If we try to build OU in six turns:

T115: –1F
T118–20: –6F​
–7F means that we'll take a turn longer to grow at some point. A Village will also mature a little later.

OTOH, we will grow to max pop for working the capital's Cottages, so extra pop is not game-breaking. We'll just grow onto a Grass Hill a little sooner.

It is your decision. But check my numbers every chance you get, if you follow the 6 turn attempt. :)
 
Wait, we can only generate 18HPT working a Grass Hill with the new pop, and changing a Grass Village to a Plains Hill.

18 * 2.75 = 49.5 = 49HPT

We'd be 6H short. If we grow to size 15 by T120, we'd be fine.

On T116, if you change the Grass Cottage ---> Plains Hill (not GH) we'd generate 66H then. That would just leave us 3H short, so easy to make up.
 
For RP:

University = 200H
Market = 150H

I think 11 turns to build these outside of a GA (33HPT * 11 = 363H). Probably closer to 10 turns with the GA hammers factored in. It looks like we have time.

+7BPT means 30 turns to payback. We won't run the slider at 100% until the end of the game. We may settle 1 more GG, but subsequent GGs are probably better settled in the capital for the Academy/Oxford boost.

Wealth or fail gold lets us run the slider for longer.
 
To be clear, my preferences would be:

Chichen Itza fail gold > University > Wealth​
But we are not working either Lake, so no big deal if you prefer a University. We could starve this city in the final turns and run mass Scientists.
 
Good news, MC is available for trading. KK also completed TC. CS<->MC+40g from KK?

Spoiler :




We can't switch a grassland tile to a plain hill since it will be short of 1F to grow. This is what we can do

Spoiler :


 
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