SGOTM 19 - Also Sprach Sid

[Duckweed]

I would like to sacrifice our Galley and rush another with . The advantage is that we load two Cuirassiers this turn, unload two Cuirassiers on T150. When we reach Medicine, one or both Cuirassiers can move to the hill. This means that Whale City should start a Galley now.

Sacrificing the current Galley would delay the third and fourth (5th/6th etc.) invaders crossing. I don't think it's a big deal: we can raze the barb city and resettle if it takes too long to leave revolt. I value the scouting info more.

2 Cuis are not enough to capture the city and they have to wait for the other 2 at least. I would not sacrifice the current galley.

We might need more troops is there are too many units in the city, I would not mind of sending 1 or 2 Cuis more from RP.

 

[kossin]

By T152 we will see what we want, this is when the first executive is produced... we can adjust from what we learn easily.

If Cornish Cow pops borders on T151/2 and Cuirassiers get to the hill, we will see almost everything relevant.

Spoiler :

The city appears to be relatively small, it is likely it can be captured and come out of revolt in time rather than re-settled. And this is done faster what an alive galley...

 

[Doshin]

All good points. Ok, ignore the idea.

I thought Standard Ethanol needed Oil, but of course it's the other way around, so it seems increasingly unlikely anything besides Coal is located there (I hope ).

 

[kossin]

Here are Alex's remaining troops.

Spoiler :

6 Cuirassiers for Damascus and 7~8 for Mecca ends the war with Alex on T151.

Unless we keep him alive...

 

[Doshin]

We could leave him with Damascus, ceasefire, and gift Augsberg (or another former HC city). When we are at war with Nappy, 2 foreign trade routes = +60CPT.

I am not sure whether it is a good thing to keep Nappy spread out, or have his stack retreat and consolidate.

I would incline to take Mecca and ceasefire.

BTW, we should move the Spy towards an Ottoman target now.

 

[kossin]

Sorry, I can't continue tonight.

Uploaded.

 

[Doshin]

Good night.

 

[Duckweed]

We could leave him with Damascus, ceasefire, and gift Augsberg (or another former HC city). When we are at war with Nappy, 2 foreign trade routes = +60CPT.

These 2 foreign trade routes cannot be used more than once like the domestic trade routes, they offers 2cpt.

I am not sure whether it is a good thing to keep Nappy spread out, or have his stack retreat and consolidate.

I would incline to take Mecca and ceasefire.

I slightly prefer this option as well, more AIs alive offers more flexibility.

 

[soundjata]

I'm on the game!

 

[soundjata]

EOT released.

Played with the city micro:
- We currently have a 60 BPT margin over Biology. Better safe...
- 15 fresh cuirs expected in the next 4 turns. 52 cuirs are alive.

I have drafted a maybe over-ambitious plan for a 6 points attack on Nappoleon in a few turns. Let me know how you see it.

Nappy's stack is not impressive. 9 mediocre units and 4 cats. It should get lost at the gates of Damascus for a little while I presume.
I assume we let Damascus be and cease fire as per Doshin/Duckweed agreement.

DOW on Nappy expected T153/T154
A couple of cuirs need to be reserved at the same time to take Sythian (barb city center North)

Then what's the plan for sentry chariots? We need to pillage one iron (no copper right?) and have the right set of civics (theocracy/vassalage?)

Will end the turn after comments and around 9PM France time.

There's no counter plan (mainly ideas ) to my spreading plan.
Still 11 turns (10 turns without barb corner) and I am happy with it

 

[Duckweed]

Depends on when we can start the War with Nappy, you need to stop sending units to the west and rally them around Candor and Mycenian.

The after Medicine civic might be US+Nat+Slavery+FM+Theology for ~5 turns, then to might switch back to bureaucracy and some cheapest civic in the last few turns. Draft units are mainly for fogbusting.

We will leave Damascus for 1 more turn to allow gifting of a few HC cities, but will DOW again immediately to raze it.

I have not studied the spreading plan, 10 turns might be possible, but 11 turns might indeed be the best we can do. What you need to do now is prechop and road the shortest road network.

Edit: Took a quick look at the save, only about unit movements. There are some units (especially healthy units like Cui 62,63) could move, send them towards Damascus, we need them to raze Damascus after taking Mecca. The small trick of using those units is to let them move and pillage. Moreover, the Cui in Utrecht should move south for the coming war with Nappy. Non-battle units like Axe 4 should move south to fogbust.

 

[soundjata]

Do we really need to attack Damascus? Nappy stack is going there. Better let him take it?

 

[Doshin]

Can I change micro in the current save? edit: offline now. There are some city screen changes, and a lot of unit moves (for healing, positioning in the west, positioning in the east, etc.) that need to be made.

I haven't studied the spread plan in detail, as kossin is much better at this sort of late-game planning. The last plan I saw assumed that several Executives would need 2-turns to reach places like Cornish Cow/Rice Pudding/Mycenian, which is not certain to me. It also included spreading to Ironclad (which will be raised) and the barb corner (unknown, and hopefully unlikely).

 

[pomthom]

We should start dot mapping the fog busting spots now.

I'll have a look at the spreading plan as well (tonight or tomorrow), if there's a way to shave a turn we'll find it! If TSR have planned to spread Alu our only shot at the Gold is to optimise perfectly the spreading, time with war progress and gift/raze/fogbust shenanigans

 

[Duckweed]

Do we really need to attack Damascus? Nappy stack is going there. Better let him take it?

maybe, if Nappy's stack is fast enough. Otherwise we still need to take it ourselves and then deal with Nappy stack in the field, It's not efficient to move a sizable stack back to Damascus later.

 

[Duckweed]

About the spreading plan. We have 33 or 34 (including Nuremberg if it does not slow down) cities to spread.

The fastest way is:

T151 HQ 1
T152 2
T153 4
T154 8
T155 ~ T159 +5 each turn, 33

Considering that there are some cities needing 2~3 turns to arrive, T160 is the best possible date theoretically, T161 is likely, T162 is what soundjata has achieved.

 

[soundjata]

maybe, if Nappy's stack is fast enough. Otherwise we still need to take it ourselves and then deal with Nappy stack in the field, It's not efficient to move a sizable stack back to Damascus later.

I See.
If Nappy guns for Damascus, he'll be at the gates on turn 152.
Then he'll either bombard (which will take forever with 4 catapults) or stack attack (and probably take the city in one swift blow)
The later case would be very favorable to us. Do we have an idea what he'll do? (4 catapults + 9 attackers vs. 4~5 defenders)

Anyways I'll send some healthy cuirs to Damascus in order to be ready for an attack on 151. We'll see what Nappy does.

 

[soundjata]

We should start dot mapping the fog busting spots now.
Done by Kossin already I believe There are some finesses about sentry chariots that I don't fully grasp though.
I'll have a look at the spreading plan as well (tonight or tomorrow), if there's a way to shave a turn we'll find it! If TSR have planned to spread Alu our only shot at the Gold is to optimise perfectly the spreading, time with war progress and gift/raze/fogbust shenanigans

good luck

 

[soundjata]

Can I change micro in the current save? edit: offline now. There are some city screen changes, and a lot of unit moves (for healing, positioning in the west, positioning in the east, etc.) that need to be made.

In the west you must be talking about moving towards Damascus.
In the East I don't know. I put the stack on a rally point and plan to fork between "bursa stack" and "malatya stack" one turn before the dow on Nappy.

I haven't studied the spread plan in detail, as kossin is much better at this sort of late-game planning. The last plan I saw assumed that several Executives would need 2-turns to reach places like Cornish Cow/Rice Pudding/Mycenian, which is not certain to me. It also included spreading to Ironclad (which will be raised) and the barb corner (unknown, and hopefully unlikely).

In my plan, there are 25 [1 turn spread] + 5 [2 turns spread] + 2 [3 turns spread]
Overall 33 cities infected.
I am 3 executive-movement short of doing the business in 10 turns. If we get rid of Ironclad city, that is 1 short. If we can teleport/jump once, we get our ten turns

9 turns could be possible without Ironclad, without Barb corner and with 3 teleport/jump?

Good luck

 

[soundjata]

About the spreading plan. We have 33 or 34 (including Nuremberg if it does not slow down) cities to spread.
Keeping Nurmberg does not slow us down. It is halfway on the Mainz > Kurhasan 2 turns trip.

The fastest way is:

T151 HQ 1
T152 2
T153 4
T154 8
T155 ~ T159 +5 each turn, 33

Considering that there are some cities needing 2~3 turns to arrive, T160 is the best possible date theoretically, T161 is likely, T162 is what soundjata has achieved.

I summarized my view above