That is false. Democracy is not mandatory just because the objective is mandatory. You could possibly ignore democracy and hope you completed the objective anyhow.
SGOTM 19 Pregame Discussion Thread - The Trumpster
- Thread starter AlanH
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That is false. Democracy is not mandatory just because the objective is mandatory. You could possibly ignore democracy and hope you completed the objective anyhow.
That's a given, and should not have to be stated any more clearly.
If you don't learn Democracy, and therefore don't PM either of us to be told the extra condition, how can you know whether you have completed a victory. Even if the extra condition itself can be achieved without knowing Democracy, you would not know if you had achieved it.
If you don't learn Democracy, and therefore don't PM either of us to be told the extra condition, how can you know whether you have completed a victory. Even if the extra condition itself can be achieved without knowing Democracy, you would not know if you had achieved it.
BLubmuz
HoF Quattromaster
Evidently you're wrong
It's clear to me but see the above comment and others i think it's not clear enough.
While it's true that you have a chance to complete the objective revealed by Democracy without know it, would anyone risk to be disqualified just to skip a tech?
IMO what is not clear, Alan, is that:
- research Democracy is mandatory to be qualified
- complete the objective revealed by Democracy is mandatory to be qualified
The statement you quoted is written in a pleasant way, but it's not clear enough. Or am i wrong?
It is plainly clear to me. You must learn Democracy, PM Swede to let him know you have learned it and then he will let us know what the final objective we have to complete is so we can get to work on it.
Sorry, I fail to see the problem. You have to achieve the hidden objective to win. It would be absurd to try to do so without knowing what it is, and that requires Democracy.
Do you want me to spell out ALL the prerequisites that are required to win?
Do you want me to spell out ALL the prerequisites that are required to win?
BLubmuz
HoF Quattromaster
No, not me but please read post #61 in this thread and more around. I'm afraid it's needed.
My opinion about this community is falling.
My post has nothing to do with the objective being unclear. Just as I said getting democracy is not required (or might not be), building a city is not required either. It is just plainly stupid to do something so counter-productive when trying to win. It is obviously needed but not required.
Post #61 expresses the same fact. If you do manage to achieve the hidden condition without knowing what it is, then you will NOT be penalised for not having learnt Democracy first. Therefore, Democracy is not mandatory - it's simply rather unlikely that you will win without it.
Your question is like asking us to state explicitly that you have to build one or more cities in order to win. We don't require it, so we don't need a rule for it, but it's unlikely that you'll win without it.
[EDIT] Cross posted with Folket. [/EDIT]
Your question is like asking us to state explicitly that you have to build one or more cities in order to win. We don't require it, so we don't need a rule for it, but it's unlikely that you'll win without it.
[EDIT] Cross posted with Folket. [/EDIT]
Funny how we both had the same example.
The probability of completing the hidden objective -without knowing what it is- is low enough that I will suspect some shenanigans if you were to do so without learning Democracy, though I probably would not make a big deal of it if you finished last anyhow.
So learn Democracy. Fast. The sooner you do so, the sooner you will know what you need to do to win Laurels in this game. If you don't care about laurels, just take your time and don't even worry about the hidden objective.
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The probability of completing the hidden objective -without knowing what it is- is low enough that I will suspect some shenanigans if you were to do so without learning Democracy, though I probably would not make a big deal of it if you finished last anyhow.
Swede - Something that keeps scratching at the back of my mind about this hidden objective. How impactful is this objective to the end game? to wit:
1) open victory conditions, i.e, we can win anyway we choose - with obviously the fastest logical choice in mind
2) Must at least research Corporation and 1 "corp" tech of your choice
3) We are required to tech Democracy - a tech that is OFTEN highly ignored by the human in competitive games unless going space.
So considering we have a basic timeframe for victory/research already, how is the hidden objective going to change the game. I mean basically one could have victory in hand the turn you tech/trade for Democracy. Is the hidden objective going to add 10, 50 or 100 turns to the game.
I don't mind these mysteries, but this is a VERY late one considering the parameters of the game and seems only designed to ensure the game progresses to a certain point. I guess it would be nice to know what it is NOT....(like.."Hey Guys! You now have to win by Space! Surprise!")
So the point is this could be extremely disappointing if this condition throws a major wrench in a well executed strategy to win circa Demo/Corp dates (relatively). It would be far different if it was like "stop a Metal Casting" or something. That is just so close to the end.
How impactful? If you fail to complete it, you will not be considered for Laurels before any team that does complete it. So very.
Democracy only comes late by choice, not by necessity (esp considering you will probably plan to get Corporation technology which has Constitution as a pre-req, just like Democracy does). The whole point is that you prioritize getting there quickly in terms of game turns AND in terms of the 3-month time limit. Teams which display skills of adaptation will, as usual for SGOTM's I have made, do well.
As for your strategy getting messed up . I hope so.
Strategies are nothing more than plans. And the best laid plans of mice and men...
But you cannot make the objective impossible to acheive before learning what it is, no matter what strategy you choose. So don't worry - be HAPPY!
Fippy
Mycro Junkie
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Must disagree with "Democracy only coming late by choice" 
It's something like 4.5k beakers (i only really memed deity numbers sorry), and comes after 2 also expensive techs that are bad for bulbing unless i miss something (Constitution and Natio).
Most if not all game plans are done by then.
Not saying that i do not like this concept, am sure this will bring some fresh wind and change standard plans, just that we are def. put into positions where some random luck with how well your plans fit into the surprise condition could be a factor. Space suddenly..very good example
Unless that hidden objective will not be very time consuming, of course
It's something like 4.5k beakers (i only really memed deity numbers sorry), and comes after 2 also expensive techs that are bad for bulbing unless i miss something (Constitution and Natio).
Most if not all game plans are done by then.
Not saying that i do not like this concept, am sure this will bring some fresh wind and change standard plans, just that we are def. put into positions where some random luck with how well your plans fit into the surprise condition could be a factor. Space suddenly..very good example
Unless that hidden objective will not be very time consuming, of course
To all players: please save your whining about how horrible the mapmaker was to you and your team until the game is over. Thanks.
LowtherCastle
Deity
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Mentally or physically? I think you underestimate some of the players here...
Anyway, kcd, thanks for the spoiler info, we were wondering about that...
