In the "Beyond the Sword" folder look for the shortcut "_Civ4Config", clicking this shortcut will open Notepad with CivilizationIV.ini ready for editing.
SGOTM 23 - Xteam
- Thread starter AlanH
- Start date
Noble Zarkon
Elite Quattromaster - Immortal (BTS)
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I think that's the best move in terms of showing us potential tiles in our BFC but we should probably move 1NW and stop so we can make a final decision.
It would be in D:\Logs, basically you can put a convenient location there if you like.
Dhoomstriker
Girlie Builder
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Huts and Multipliers
It would be interesting to see the possible Hut results for the AIs. Would it be correct to look at the Hut results for Noble Difficulty Level if we want to know what Hut results the AIs can get?
Initial Movements
I would also hesitate to move the Missionary for its second movement point until we've seen the results of the other moves and then use that new info to inform us better on where to move the Missionary for its second movement point.
Since we won't have a Worker-stealing opportunity until Turn 12 at the earliest (unless BSPollux gave out Workers to the AIs--it's an approach that has been done before), I guess that we don't have to wait to move our Warrior. But, on future turns, it may help to move our Warrior last after first moving our other exploring units and then using the overhead Culture view to inform us of any AI Cultural Borders that are just out of visual range. Obviously, our Warrior needs to be sent toward an AI if we want to use it for Worker-stealing.
Espionage Point Oracling
The "formula" for using Espionage values to our advantage is just using the fact that numbers used for certain Espionage Missions have both a constant multiplier and a variable multiplier in order to calculate how many Espionage Points would be required to execute said Mission. If you take two such Espionage Missions, and you know what those constant multipliers are (someone did the code-diving to find out), you can then use that information to cancel-out both of the constant multipliers and the variable multipliers, giving you the base cost of a given Espionage Mission.
For the most part, this base cost is a meaningless value. But, for the Sabotage Production, the base cost is the number of Hammers that an AI has invested into its currently-selected build item. If you think about that fact for a moment, you will see that this information is quite valuable--you know how many Hammers may have in, say, a Longbowman that it is building. If you track this information over the course of 2 turns, you know how many Hammers per turn that AI is putting into a build item.
We used this info 2 SGOTMs ago. I'll attach a spreadsheet from that time, in which I've added a bit of an explanation at the top of it. It's in .xls (Excel) format. Please let me know if you need a different format in order to open a spreadsheet.
It would be interesting to see the possible Hut results for the AIs. Would it be correct to look at the Hut results for Noble Difficulty Level if we want to know what Hut results the AIs can get?
Initial Movements
I would also hesitate to move the Missionary for its second movement point until we've seen the results of the other moves and then use that new info to inform us better on where to move the Missionary for its second movement point.
Since we won't have a Worker-stealing opportunity until Turn 12 at the earliest (unless BSPollux gave out Workers to the AIs--it's an approach that has been done before), I guess that we don't have to wait to move our Warrior. But, on future turns, it may help to move our Warrior last after first moving our other exploring units and then using the overhead Culture view to inform us of any AI Cultural Borders that are just out of visual range. Obviously, our Warrior needs to be sent toward an AI if we want to use it for Worker-stealing.
Espionage Point Oracling
The "formula" for using Espionage values to our advantage is just using the fact that numbers used for certain Espionage Missions have both a constant multiplier and a variable multiplier in order to calculate how many Espionage Points would be required to execute said Mission. If you take two such Espionage Missions, and you know what those constant multipliers are (someone did the code-diving to find out), you can then use that information to cancel-out both of the constant multipliers and the variable multipliers, giving you the base cost of a given Espionage Mission.
For the most part, this base cost is a meaningless value. But, for the Sabotage Production, the base cost is the number of Hammers that an AI has invested into its currently-selected build item. If you think about that fact for a moment, you will see that this information is quite valuable--you know how many Hammers may have in, say, a Longbowman that it is building. If you track this information over the course of 2 turns, you know how many Hammers per turn that AI is putting into a build item.
We used this info 2 SGOTMs ago. I'll attach a spreadsheet from that time, in which I've added a bit of an explanation at the top of it. It's in .xls (Excel) format. Please let me know if you need a different format in order to open a spreadsheet.
Yes, you guys are right to be cautious about the missionary second movement point, where we settle is one of the most important decisions we can make. We should wait to see what we can after 1 move before we make that decision.
I mentioned 1NE 1NW as this maximises what we can see for settling locations that get the only real source of hammers we can see : the solitary hill.
If our missionary sees hills to the west after 1 move, then that changes everything.
I mentioned 1NE 1NW as this maximises what we can see for settling locations that get the only real source of hammers we can see : the solitary hill.
If our missionary sees hills to the west after 1 move, then that changes everything.
In terms of the game, I would think that victory might be best achieved by diplomatic/religious.
Railroad is the most advanced tech we need, so this suggests AP, as we then won't need to research to Mass Media and then build UN.
I suspect that Domination was turned off not to stop 'accidental' victories (this is a SG after all) but more likely to make us preparing for victory a little less predictable.
We don't need to build AP, we can always capture it later.
Railroad is the most advanced tech we need, so this suggests AP, as we then won't need to research to Mass Media and then build UN.
I suspect that Domination was turned off not to stop 'accidental' victories (this is a SG after all) but more likely to make us preparing for victory a little less predictable.
We don't need to build AP, we can always capture it later.
pigswill
fly (one day)
AP victory is possible but could be nerfed by having an isolated civ with a religion. AP religion wouldn't spread automatically and missionaries couldn't get through.
AP and conquest are the obvious early victories and if I was designing a scenario I'd make sure that these wouldn't be easy.
On the other hand BSP might be feeling kind and these victories might be available.
Exploration has to be a high priority.
AP and conquest are the obvious early victories and if I was designing a scenario I'd make sure that these wouldn't be easy.
On the other hand BSP might be feeling kind and these victories might be available.
Exploration has to be a high priority.
Since Goody Huts are turned off, in the scenario we are playing, would not the possible results be Null?
If we are going to delay settling 1 turn, as the last move of the turn, what about moving the settler 1E. Though, given all the river tiles, I do not know if getting a few hills is optimal since it looks like Paris will have many cottages.
Note about test game map:
The sign that reads "Orient" was typed as "Orient ==>", apparently the save game compression does not like all ASCII characters.
Hi Guys. Having fun already, I see 
On an admin note, are you happy to stick with the Xteam name, or do the ex Fifth Element players want a different name? I need to know your team name in the next couple of days to build your starting save, so please let me know. A PM would be best in case I don't spot it in this thread. If you have already discussed it, I apologise for missing it in my quick scan of the thread.
On an admin note, are you happy to stick with the Xteam name, or do the ex Fifth Element players want a different name? I need to know your team name in the next couple of days to build your starting save, so please let me know. A PM would be best in case I don't spot it in this thread. If you have already discussed it, I apologise for missing it in my quick scan of the thread.
pigswill
fly (one day)
I'm happy to play as part of Xteam. Maybe next sgotm I'll have a go at resurrecting Fifth Element.
pigswill
fly (one day)
In terms of initial (T1) exploration I think it makes sense to focus on NW and SE because it would be nice to settle on the river (obviously health and trade routes but also 25% defence on one side). We can move warrior, scout and missionary before committing ourselves to a settler move. Moving settler one tile in any direction won't delay settlement.
Seems to be agreement on this, with missionary only moving 1NW.
"It would be in D:\Logs," Yes, of course, but where/how would I then find D:\Logs?
pigswill
fly (one day)
I've heavily edited the test map to make it more like a SGOTM. Feel free to try.
Noble Zarkon
Elite Quattromaster - Immortal (BTS)
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Saves are likely to be available over the weekend. Who does the first bit may depend solely on timing. I think the initial actions are:-
All agreed?
- Screenshot of all in game info screens - Demographics, Wonders, Corps etc
- Check starting location (F1)
- Warrior 1N1E
- Scout 1S1E
- Missionary 1N1W
- Stop, upload file and post here
All agreed?
Yes, sounds like a plan!
No. Should we not limit play of the actual game to 1 person?
Also, the order of your list implies settle in place. 1N, or some other spot might be better.
I favor this order of events.
- Warrior: 1NE
- Missionary: 1NW; Second move, to be determined, probably follow river.
- Scout: Based on the assumption that we will build the Orient Express in an eastward direction, maybe the scout should move 2SE to begin scouting the east.
- Pause and save
- Screenshots of new territory + game screens with info
My thoughts align with JJ's: scout 2SE and missionary just 1NW.
Traveling twice in the coming next week, so would prefer not to play initial set.
(Also, still don't understand how to set up to find and post a Buffy log.)
Traveling twice in the coming next week, so would prefer not to play initial set.
(Also, still don't understand how to set up to find and post a Buffy log.)
Pete, have you tried playing a few turns in either or both of the test games? Log files (1 log file for each game) should generate automatically).
Noble Zarkon
Elite Quattromaster - Immortal (BTS)
Super Moderator
Hall of Fame Staff
GOTM Staff
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We don't want the saves out there for 18 hours if the nominated person doesn't see them, I suggest whoever sees it first posts a "got it in here".
I didn't mean to imply that, the point of the scouting is to help us decide that. My first action is about getting the x,y co-ordinates for where we are - it may be however that we don't saee that until we settle.?
I think this goes ahead too quickly - these first steps are vital and will have a long impact on the game. I propose all units only make one move, we can then discuss the 2nd move. Only after that do we move on to discuss settling.
Noble Zarkon
Elite Quattromaster - Immortal (BTS)
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Hall of Fame Staff
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OK - saves are out GOT IT!
Please note this doesn't mean I'm playing the first full set but I can do the initial tasks.
Edit: Not ignoring the discussion but I don't think there is any real division about what we are doing just I want to take it slower than some of you.
Please note this doesn't mean I'm playing the first full set but I can do the initial tasks.
Edit: Not ignoring the discussion but I don't think there is any real division about what we are doing just I want to take it slower than some of you.
pigswill
fly (one day)
Gumbolt suggested pausing starting save, my guess is that they want to study screens collectively without making any accidental moves. AlanH suggested download save, pause, upload paused save for everyone to look at. Worth considering?
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