Shootings in the Perian Gulf;

[Patroklos]

I stand corrected.

 

[Abegweit]

You'll have to name a specific international law, and point out where the US military broke it. And not just one "odd ball" occurrence. Unless it's not uncommon, it doesn't matter too much.

Do you seriously think that international law supports Johnson's fabricated Tonkin Incident, the Nixon/Kissinger mass murder in Cambodia, Clinton's bombing of aspirin factories, Dubya's systemic use of torture or Obama's Drones of Death? If they do, which may be fact, then it only shows the extent to which international law has been perverted to support American atrocities.

When a communist disagrees with your universal condemnation of the military of an imperialist nation, you know that you're wrong.

No. It shows that communists and imperialists are the same thing. They are both supporters of state murder. The main distinction is that commies kill their own countrymen and imperialists kill foreigners. I tend to think that this makes the commies the more evil group. Definitely they have killed far more people than the imperialists. After all, the Americans have only murdered a few million. Stalin and Mao did waaaay better.

 

[caketastydelish]

Do you seriously think that international law supports Johnson's fabricated Tonkin Incident, the Nixon/Kissinger mass murder in Cambodia, Clinton's bombing of aspirin factories, Dubya's systemic use of torture or Obama's Drones of Death? If they do, which may be fact, then it only shows the extent to which international law has been perverted to support American atrocities.

The only one of these things that I've even heard of was the drones. The drones are under controversy, but they seem like a pretty effective way of fighting terror. Were it up to me, we would completely pull out of middle eastern countries, and just use drones to go after specific terrorist.

No. It shows that communists and imperialists are the same thing. They are both supporters of state murder. The main distinction is that commies kill their own countrymen and imperialists kill foreigners. I tend to think that this makes the commies the more evil group. Definitely they have killed far more people than the imperialists. After all, the Americans have only murdered a few million. Stalin and Mao did waaaay better.

So not only are you flaming the American military supporters, but you've managed to flame the left wingers such as Cheesy as well. Good job.

 

[Patroklos]

Nobody took the bait, so no so good of a job.

 

[Abegweit]

So not only are you flaming the American military supporters, but you've managed to flame the left wingers such as Cheesy as well. Good job.

Left wingers. Right wingers. Blah. Blah. Blah.

Left wingers and right wingers are both supporters of mass murder. Cheesy has actually backed up his support "When a communist disagrees with your universal condemnation of the military of an imperialist nation, you know that you're wrong."

Actually this proves that commies and imperialists are basically the same, They both worship state control over ordinary people. And, when push comes to shove., they both are on the same side.

 

[caketastydelish]

Yep, you're not on anyones side. You just flame anyone who comes across your path.

 

[Cheezy the Wiz]

If you ignore him, he'll go away. Responding feeds the troll.

 

[Abegweit]

Yep, you're not on anyones side. You just flame anyone who comes across your path.

I flame people who advocate mass murder. Sad to see that you think murder is acceptable.

 

[innonimatu]

This may come down to whether a military policy is actually legal or not in the territorial waters of a foriegn country with different laws.

IS it necessary to even ask that?

 

[MobBoss]

I flame people who advocate mass murder. Sad to see that you think murder is acceptable.

Even when you advocate it yourself? Hypocrisy much?

 

[Abegweit]

If you ignore him, he'll go away. Responding feeds the troll.

Woah! It is just so neat to see how all the statists line up together. Murder is as murder does.

 

[red_elk]

This may come down to whether a military policy is actually legal or not in the territorial waters of a foriegn country with different laws.

If any foreign military policy is also legal in US territorial waters, then probably yes.

 

[Patroklos]

This is not as important a question as you might think. The simple fact is that the UAE is a security partner heavily involved with the US whose military units are intimately involved in the security of US vessels going in and out of their ports.

I have made over a dozen port calls at Jebel Ali (the port that services Dubai) since 2003 and our security requirements are far as warning and exclusion zones have always been the same. The UAE has designated a specific area of the port for the exclusive use of the US (and periodically other coalition partners) and hosts a dedicated US waterborne security unit. They also provide their own assets to assist in security, waterborne and otherwise.

So in other words the UAE has full knowledge of our security requirements in their territorial waters and has wholeheartedly approved and enforced them for decades.

 

[wolfigor]

Another case of murder by thugs and your account of that incident has about as much relationship with the truth as your account of this one. In that case, it is quite clear that the murderers lied. They are also being held in court awaiting trial for murder.

Another difference is that the Italian government has compensated the victims' families. Americans simply have no shame. Murder anyone anywhere on the planet and call it an accident.

The soldier are under trial because of the strong campaign of a local (Indian) politician that was "milking" the event for political gain in the upcoming election and to keep under the radar some local bribery scandals.

Also in this case it is NOT "clear that the murderers lied", it's just you that pick the words of one side as the absolute truth without considering the alternative.
Consider the most logical scene:
Oil tanker in high sea, usually roamed by pirates.
Unidentified boat approaching with the modus operandi of pirate ships.
Unidentified boat does not respond to radio or any other signal.
Distance getting dangerously shorter... soldiers shoot.

Any other scenario has much less probability of being true or even logic.
It's sad for those who died, but maybe they should take care of knowing sea rules before venturing in the sea (if Indian government issues naval licenses as they do for driving licenses, I have no doubt of the reason why those Indian sailors had no clue about what they were doing).

The family of the victims were compensated to calm down the local public opinion and close the case with minimal fuss.
The "compensation" to the families is only a gesture from the Italian government that wants to keep good relations with India: this is a clear political compromise that has nothing to do with justice.

 

[Abegweit]

The family of the victims were compensated to calm down the local public opinion and close the case with minimal fuss.
The "compensation" to the families is only a gesture from the Italian government that wants to keep good relations with India: this is a clear political compromise that has nothing to do with justice.

Oh indeed this is true. All state "justice" is about power politics.

Unlike the Italians, no Americans will ever apologize, let alone give compensation for what they did. This is because American goon squads have far more power than their Italian counterparts.

 

[innonimatu]

Oh indeed this is true. All state "justice" is about power politics.

Unlike the Italians, no Americans will ever apologize, let alone give compensation for what they did. This is because American goon squads have far more power than their Italian counterparts.

Is is because US governments want to use their goon squads at will to carry out its little wars around the world. And, as with all goons, the people in those squads will only go about shooting if they believe they have their asses covered. So the US governments will always go as far as possible to cover up whenever they do something wrong. Otherwise the next time they're ordered to do something wrong they might actually refuse it...

It's not an american thing. It's how goons are managed, anywhere. If the italian government didn't protect the mercenaries (or were they just crew?) in that ship it was because they were mercenaries, not the italian government's own goons.

 

[Patroklos]

Or the fishermen just screwed up. Actually, not or, that IS what happened. Until someone posts something even remotely showing otherwise, you are just eating sour grapes.

 

[Formaldehyde]

US warship fails to fire upon Japanese tanker.

DUBAI, United Arab Emirates — A U.S. Navy guided missile destroyer was left with a gaping hole on one side after it collided with an oil tanker early Sunday just outside the strategic Strait of Hormuz.

The collision left a breach about 10 feet by 10 feet (three by three meters) in the starboard side of USS Porter. No one was injured on either vessel, the U.S. Navy said in a statement.

The collision with the Panamanian-flagged and Japanese-owned bulk oil tanker M/V Otowasan happened about 1 a.m. local time. Photos released by the Navy showed workers standing amid twisted metal and other debris hanging down from the hole.

The cause of the incident is under investigation, the Navy said, though the collision was not “combat related.” There were no reports of spills or leakages from either the USS Porter or the Otowasan, the Navy said.

Navy spokesman Greg Raelson said the destroyer now is in port in Jebel Ali, Dubai. “We’re just happy there were no injuries,” he said. “An investigation is under way.”

Three years ago, The USS Hartford, a nuclear-powered submarine based in Groton, Conn., collided in the strait with the USS New Orleans, a San Diego-based amphibious ship.

The New Orleans’ fuel tank was ruptured, and 15 sailors on the Hartford suffered minor injuries. The collision caused $2.3 million in damage to the New Orleans, and the cost so far of repairs to the Hartford is $102.6 million.

The submarine’s commanding officer was relieved of his duties, and the sub’s chief of the boat, an adviser to the commanding officer, was reassigned. Several crew members were punished.

 

[MobBoss]

Not sure what you are trying to imply here Form. That happened at 1 am in the morning. What's your point?

 

[Formaldehyde]

I guess it's OK for the US military to be completely incompetent at night as it was in these two collisions. But it can't possibly occur during daylight hours?