Shoshone civilization, leader Pocatello

[TimeWeaver]

Last time I made this thread, it was still speculation, but now it's confirmed in the hypercube thread:

Shoshone
- Leader - Pocatello
- Capital - (don't know where to check this, the press kit has a map only with the revelead 7 civs and you can only pick Morocco)
- Unique Ability - Founded cities start with additional territory. Units receive a combat bonus when fighting in friendly territory.
- Unique Unit - Pathfinder; Replaces Scout (yey?) It has 8 combat, costs 30 p, allows you to choose ancient ruin bonus (really curious to see this :3)
UU - Comanche Riders; Replaces Cavalry. 134 p, it seems to have 4 movement like Cavalry but has an ability that gives +1 movement, the explanation says they have quick attacks.

What's your opinion on all this? I reckon this civ is great fun to play, in a way a land version of Polynesia.

 

[Verified_Confection_Being]

Well, my first thoughts were, brilliant they've added a native american civ because its a feature of american history.

Upon reading the civilopedia entry, i appear to have been proven right.

To think we almost got the Pueblo, an amazing civilization with prosperous long distance trade routes, complex architecture, advanced agriculture and so much jazz and instead we now have this is heartbreaking.

And to think they haven't even tried to find out anything about them prior to their dealings with the US is even worse. I can see nothing about the Shoshone in their entry, and nothing to suggest they were more significant than any other native american tribe.

All we have been given are "injuns" and that makes me sad. For all the great civilizations north america has produced, they picked one that is only known to be relevant as a feature of US history.

I honestly thought you were getting better firaxis. Now you gone and redone the "native americans" from civ 4.

 

[Martin23230]

Well, my first thoughts were, brilliant they've added a native american civ because its a feature of american history.

Upon reading the civilopedia entry, i appear to have been proven right.

To think we almost got the Pueblo, an amazing civilization with prosperous long distance trade routes, complex architecture, advanced agriculture and so much jazz and instead we now have this is heartbreaking.

And to think they haven't even tried to find out anything about them prior to their dealings with the US is even worse. I can see nothing about the Shoshone in their entry, and nothing to suggest they were more significant than any other native american tribe.

All we have been given are "injuns" and that makes me sad. For all the great civilizations north america has produced, they picked one that is only known to be relevant as a feature of US history.

I honestly thought you were getting better firaxis. Now you gone and redone the "native americans" from civ 4.

To be fair, we haven't seen the Civ entry, only those of the leader and the units. I do agree on most points though.

Plus the civ icon is just a standard, stereotypical Native American headdress:

 

[Loucypher]

Playstyle-technically however, Soshone might be hilarious to play. Especially on large, empty maps where there's a lot of goodie hunts. There's a free tech, there's a free tech, there's a free tech....

 

[Velex]

Playstyle-technically however, Soshone might be hilarious to play. Especially on large, empty maps where there's a lot of goodie hunts. There's a free tech, there's a free tech, there's a free tech....

Maps maps maps maps, maps maps maps maps.

Then you can find more goody huts and get even more maps!

 

[TimeWeaver]

True_Candyman: Valid criticism indeed! Pueblo would have made me very happy, and this choice feels more stereotypical. Apart from the "no" from the Pueblo nation, perhaps Firaxis felt Pueblo would have been to close to the more sedentary civs down south in the Americas. And similarly, they could have picked very worthy nations from Pacific Northwest, but didn't, since they perhaps felt they were too close to their extremely wide take on Polynesia. Nevertheless, it's a good thing Shoshone are in, and I think this civ will offer fun explorative gameplay.

Velex: A mapoholic charters his way through the landscapes...

 

[The QC]

At first sight, it looks like a civ revolving around peaceful expansion. Your cities start with better borders and you have a bonus for fighting inside those borders. If they'd have had a building to benefit from many cities, it would have been more interesting, but as they stand both the UA and the cavalry UU are quite lackluster.

That scout unit is insanely cool though - I want it now!

 

[Verified_Confection_Being]

To be fair, we haven't seen the Civ entry, only those of the leader and the units. I do agree on most points though.

Plus the civ icon is just a standard, stereotypical Native American headdress:

True, i'll hold out hope... But considering the two units they've chosen and more specifically the descriptions of them, i can't see them diverging from the US-centric feel. At least this kind of civ can show the Pueblo their decision was the right one in refusing to be involved in this game... I really thought they were getting better at subaltern history at Firaxis.

I believe the headdress was at least used by the Shoshone, but it's certainly not a representative symbol of the civ, except to outsides saying "look at that crazy hat". It's like using Pacal's giant hat as a the symbol for the Maya...

 

[Aaron90495]

Holy crap.

 

[Theoderic]

What is the color combination? Brown and teal?

 

[Verified_Confection_Being]

I have another problem with this civ gameplay wise.

Founding cities will be cool and different. But there is nothing to make them play differently except at that founding stage, and not greatly different there. Maybe moving one square over from where you'd otherwise go at most...

The scout will only be relevant for the first 20-30 turns then it is more or less obsolete. The riders look very standard and undifferent as a UU go.

This civ is going to feel as plain and boring as america after the opening turns.

 

[apocalypse105]

start built 2 scout get faith ruin built shrine free religion ?

 

[The QC]

Playstyle-technically however, Soshone might be hilarious to play. Especially on large, empty maps where there's a lot of goodie hunts. There's a free tech, there's a free tech, there's a free tech....

That wouldn't be my approach. I'd definitely pick faith first. Then maybe culture, to get some culture production from Tradition or Liberty. Then I'd start with the science...

 

[HeraldtheGreat]

What I miss!?! What's all this hulabaloo? And where is the real hypercube-Civ hiding behind this mundane ruse? (relatively, anyways.)

 

[The QC]

Venice is pretty out there. Not more than Austria at the time, but we always knew that the hypercube was hyperbole .

I share your other feeling though. It's only this morning that I was thinking how bored I am that no news seem to be surfacing. And now: bam! Hypercube! Hyper-scouts!

 

[Martin23230]

What I miss!?! What's all this hulabaloo? And where is the real hypercube-Civ hiding behind this mundane ruse? (relatively, anyways.)

Venice is the hypercube, it can't build settlers or annex cities, only puppet or capture CSs using Great Merchants.

 

[wigwam]

My guess about the Pathfinder is that it'll present you a choice of two or three rewards, rather than the whole list of possibilities. It won't guarantee a tech/culture/faith/citizen every time; it'll just dramatically cut down the number of times you get crappy rewards like a local map or barb camp locations. You won't get exactly what you want, but you'll always get something good.

 

[Death Dragon]

I assume you can pick every bonus only once, like in the Maya UA.
Imagine playing on Terra with an entire new continent full of ruins in late game.
Free techs there would be pretty extreme.

 

[HeraldtheGreat]

Venice is the hypercube, it can't build settlers or annex cities, only puppet or capture CSs using Great Merchants.

Again, WHAT!!?!?!?


Where was this confirmed? I preorder BNW and go for a bike ride, and all hell breaks loose?!?

 

[Kurtbob]

It sounds like a good early game civ, those scouts could be game breaking, but I really wished for an American southwest native peoples. The Pueblo, Navajo, or the Apache would have made me dance for joy. Oh well, hopefully the Shoshone will be fun to play. Still wonder what to expect from the cavalry replacement. A simple movement bonus can't be all.