should the us be in the game

[jar2574]

I was talking about defeating Germany/Italy. In a way, you could see the War with Germany and the one with Japan as two different wars. The Japanese started their war earlier and finished it later. And they had pretty much no relationship to speak of with Germany. More like a non-aggression treaty then actual allies.

Yeah, I thought you were focusing too much on the European theatre. The Pacific theatre was just as much a part of WWII as the European one. Hitler didn't have to declare war on the USA. But he did. So he allied his fate with Japan from that point on.

As far as Canadian contributions -- they were definately impressive. But to say that they surpassed America's would be stretching it. Canada didn't have nearly the same number of troops as America in either theatre.

 

[drahnier]

Just in case you weren't being sarcastic; and just for the sake of accuracy.. the capital of California is Sacramento.

I wasn't being sarcastic.
I didn't know what it was, but i assumed it wasn't Los Angeles.

I was gonna guess San Francisco.

 

[jar2574]

Another thing to consider on this issue, many Americans can't afford to, or have no cultural connection to any foreign country. It's a big place, and when driving distance to the next county is measured in days... I think that's a big factor in not being familiar with international affairs. Not that it's a good reason, but still.

But yeah, we're gettin' stupid, have been for three decades or so. We really gotta muscle up on that. We've been talking about making it our new years resolution for a while now.

You and I are on the same page. The people I met while living outside the USA were of the same intelligence as those I live with here, and in general they exhibited the same degree of intellectural curiosity towards countries that did not directly affect them. But that doesn't mean I don't want our schools do do a better job teaching foreign affairs.

 

[White Elk]

I wasn't being sarcastic.
I didn't know what it was, but i assumed it wasn't Los Angeles.

I was gonna guess San Francisco.

As much as I hate to admit it.. many of my fellow countrymen have thought LA was the capital. SanFran would make sense as well. If they ever do split California into two or three states, then LA and SanFran would be logical capitals.

 

[Yooka]

You and I are on the same page. The people I met while living outside the USA were of the same intelligence as those I live with here, and in general they exhibited the same degree of intellectural curiosity towards countries that did not directly affect them. But that doesn't mean I don't want our schools do do a better job teaching foreign affairs.

Thanks man. Still, I see where alot of Europeans are coming from. After all, so many of them learn multiple languages. It's easy to see why they would be surprised that a nation whose foundations centered on multicultural unity and blending races and creeds is so lacking in language skills and international lore.

 

[Zombie69]

But, anyway, I cannot find the article I would like to cite regarding scientific patents. It was in the Economist about six months ago, and it compared the number of original patents in the USA, the EU, Japan, and South Korea. By original, it meant the first country the product was patented in. The article pointed out that the USA's once dominant position was being challenged by South Korea and Japan, but America still had the highest number of original scientific patents.

This doesn't mean anything other than the fact that the USA are the biggest market. Because of this, a Canadian inventor, for example, often patents his/her invention in the States before even doing so in Canada! Doesn't make the invention an American one by any stretch of imagination.

I'm pretty sure Japan invents more stuff than the USA do. After all, North America is about 5 years behind of Japan technologically. If you want to know what technology will look like here 5 to 10 years from now, go on a trip to Japan and see for yourself.

 

[Zombie69]

Yeah, I thought you were focusing too much on the European theatre. The Pacific theatre was just as much a part of WWII as the European one. Hitler didn't have to declare war on the USA. But he did. So he allied his fate with Japan from that point on.

As far as Canadian contributions -- they were definately impressive. But to say that they surpassed America's would be stretching it. Canada didn't have nearly the same number of troops as America in either theatre.

Hitler declaring war on the USA probably had a lot more to do with trying to stop the aid given to the British then anything related to Japan.

In Europe, Canada had fewer troops than the USA (though not by much), but we had much more impressive results.

 

[chinesefireball]

We have our own language; it's American English...
Now don't start debating about spelling.

kk - it is still English, just a dialect of english. Is its own dialect enough to consitute a civ. Probably not - we might end up with the Great Empire of Cornwell

Ok back to topic (sort of)

I live in Australia, and I do notice that our education focuses far too much on Australia - don't think I have ever been taught modern world history, in compulsory history (if I did elective history, I would have been taught about the world). So I'm assuming since both the US and Australia are fairly isolated from other country (i.e. not a few hours drive away), their education is more or less the same in that area.

BUT(big generalisation here) since they have so much patriosm rammed into them, they start think that the US is the best place to live and that anyone that disagrees with them is mad even if they have never been to another country.
So in that way some of them can be ignorant - they lack experience

But then I know someone who was doing a school exchange - and they were asked if we had electricity in Australia.

 

[Sahkuhnder]

This whole thing just makes me laugh. America bashing yet again.

American designed game, in English, with large U.S. sales. Number four in a series with all the previous three including an American civ. Do you really expect America to not be a civ in civ4?

If it wasn't included could you imagine the total outcry of complaints? Exactly how quickly would there be a flood of mods to add in the American civ?

Is there any person on the entire planet that hasn't heard of America?


My personal favorite part is that the Three Gorges Dam uses an icon/picture of Hoover Dam for it's symbol.

 

[drahnier]

I like how "the internet" has an American flag and Al Gore, as i've said before.

 

[Esckey]

I don't know if this has been mentioned(I'm not going to go through the 6 pages) but....

Yes America should be in, for the sole reason that you can now pick the era you want to start in.

 

[Screw Flanders]

In Europe, Canada had fewer troops than the USA (though not by much), but we had much more impressive results.

Ok tell that to those that were there. Each countries soldiers fought and died as hard as they could during that horror. Canada, the US, and the UK all lost terrible amounts of men and I SERIOUSLY doubt anyone tried less. WWII history is a hobby of mine and I can give you examples of american bravery and accomplishment for every one that the others did. Everyone did their part, and to suggest that one didnt is shameful. And the russians lost INFINITELY more troops than we did, including a million at stalingrad alone.

America bashing seems to happen here alot. Understand that there are some of us who actually like our country, are proud of it, yet seem to have had the time to educate ourselves about what is happening in the rest of the world and do care. And I have travelled overseas and have been asked incredibly ignorant questions of myself (one guy in amsterdam asked us if we really still rode horses in texas).

So please look at the facts, dont let stupid hate of america cloud our accomplishments. Hell they put the mongols in there but they lasted about 2 generations or so.

 

[kernok]

I like how "the internet" has an American flag and Al Gore, as i've said before.

i dislike it... it's a kind of US private joke IMO
other countries has been involved in the creation of the www
i would have been pleased with an internet picture like a stylistic "@" or some little PCs connected to a world globe.

 

[RockStar-holic]

i dislike it... it's a kind of US private joke IMO
other countries has been involved in the creation of the www
i would have been pleased with an internet picture like a stylistic "@" or some little PCs connected to a world globe.

When someone else in another country makes civV they pick their own inside joke icon for the internet, but I'm sure no one will get it.

Maybe Linus riding the back of a penguin?

That joke and many others in the game give it alot of color or flair, it you will, and is just one more facet that sets this game apart from it's competition.

Oh, and what were you thinking, of course America should be in the game.

 

[kernok]

US naturally deserve to be in a civ game!!
but i did not success to explain my opinion:
i prefer jokes to flags and US flag shouldn't pollute my eyes.
we can see it in 50% of US movies and it's somewhat boring
we now begin to see it in US video games...
what next? US flag tattoed on big mac bred?

 

[Uiler]

There are only two civs in the game who have existed continuously since 4000BC - India and China (not sure whether Egypt really counts since the only common thing between modern Egypt and ancient Egypt is the name).

So if you want to use historical accuracy as an excuse to leave the US out of the game (and I speak as someone who regularly criticises the US), you might as well leave everyone out but India and China.

 

[me_Barb]

When they put back tha American Indians then they can put a civ named the USA and not America. Having stuff like Broadway, holywood and west point, pentagon is enough already. Statue of Liberty is ok but that stuff. Coudn't they pick something more original. It is like having Lublianka or Boliwood for world wonders. Eiflel tower is an equaly stupid wonder. Not because it isn't unique or well known but for what it does. I think after the initial great start the developers alreadt spent their original ideas by the time they got to the modern age. Oh and bring the great Wall of China. How could they miss that. Unforgivable not to mention there should be a wonder called the Coliseum and amphitheater is what the current coliseum should look like and be called. The Temple of Zeus is also a good choice for a wonder.

 

[ruff_hi]

The one thing that all the other Civs have and the USA does not is language! To be a bonafide Civilization you have to have a distinct, unique language. Americans speak the Queens english, and everyone else speaks, well, you know....german, French, Greek, Russian ect.....

In that case, shouldn't it be Civilisation IV? I have to say that the USA does have its own language - been living here 3 years now and they still cannot understand all the words I use - eg chook, stuffed, jumper, trunk, etc

 

[CVDon]

How, exactly, did this turn into a "my country can beat your country" patriotism fest? There's not a lick of difference between Civilizations in this game. They might just as well have called them Red Team, Blue Team, Green Team, etceteras...

Last night the well known War Monger and International Imperialist Mahatma Ghandi declared war on me (we had net +3 relations) then sailed half way around the world to attack me because we had no borders even close. Now, how EXACTLY is that indicative of 18th Century India, or Ghandi?

It's a gimic folks. A sales point.

 

[me_Barb]

Yeah. they should work on that a little. I was Japan on Earth and after China I meet Rome????. How did that happened. Not to mention those legioneries that traveled all the way from Rome just to fight me in a war that I could win easy since their nearest production city was on the other side of the world. I have no idea how but such "expeditions" should be eliminated from the game. Especially the Galley almost going around the world thing. They should make this game hardcore and add Atrittion. I remember a Rise of Nations had a very well implemented concept of this. Armies should not be able to go on a around the world trips. They should be dying from thirst and diesease - the real killers in any war