AntSou
Deity
- Joined
- Jun 8, 2019
- Messages
- 3,052
Well, I have been told that I've played the game for too long and therefore lack the awareness to realise how complex the game may be to new players, so you might have a point.
Sluggish starts...
- Thread starter Linklite
- Start date
Well, I have been told that I've played the game for too long and therefore lack the awareness to realise how complex the game may be to new players, so you might have a point.
yung.carl.jung
Hey Bird! I'm Morose & Lugubrious
I started to look at this site again when GS came out, was a very good Civ 3 player, might even still have a game in the HOF.
Anyway I saw posts about 10 cities by turn 100 and science wins by turn 250, looked at my game with 7 low yield cities at turn 150 and thought crap. I restarted a few times to ‘become better’, failed, went back to my original game and had a blast, science win, turn 450, lol. So my point, enjoy it and improve at your leisure and because some excellent top players can do stuff, it doesn’t mean everybody can or should.
Anyway I saw posts about 10 cities by turn 100 and science wins by turn 250, looked at my game with 7 low yield cities at turn 150 and thought crap. I restarted a few times to ‘become better’, failed, went back to my original game and had a blast, science win, turn 450, lol. So my point, enjoy it and improve at your leisure and because some excellent top players can do stuff, it doesn’t mean everybody can or should.
Kouvb593kdnuewnd
Left Forever
- Joined
- Jul 3, 2012
- Messages
- 4,146
It is just basic sum taken from here: https://www.mathsisfun.com/numbers/sigma-calculator.html
- Joined
- Apr 11, 2011
- Messages
- 11,902
Settlers are typically the best unit to get early apart from if under threat. I could go into the reasons but it would make the post too long. Ask if you want some clarification but as a general rule getting cities out as early as possible massively increases your empire.
some basic tips
Because you start with a population of 1 you cannot build a settler so you build a warrior or some other unit like a slinger, scout or builder. The choice can vary based on choice, difficulty, map and situation and can change.
You finish the warrior and then start on a builder.
2 turns into building the builder you get to 2 population, you have 7 turns left on your builder.
You should not keep completing your builder normally, you should swap immediately to the settler.
You settler your capital and find you have a choice of 2 good tiles to work. A 1 food, 3 prod tile (1/3) or a 3 food, 1 prod tile (3/1). You look at which tile the AI assigned your 1 population to and it has assigned you to the 1/3 tile. This means you can build units faster but it also means your city grows slower and you need to get to 2 production before you start to build a settler. So manually swap the 1/3 to the 3/1 tile. This tile swapping is what very good players do often, they may even swap back to the 1/3 tile after getting to 2 pop to speed up the settler.
the 10 by t100 rule is just a general rule, I was the one that suggested it and it was just to get an idea. Nowadays because I have got faster and need an earlier benchmark I go for 7 by turn 70. I must stress both benchmarks are based on cities captured as well. They are not easy benchmarks and you will not always get them. That is no reason to stop your game, you will likely still win it, but the idea is always keep your mind on settlers before at least T70 as one of your key decision makers.
Another really key area is do you target State Workforce (SW) first in the culture tree or do you target Early Empire(EE) . Early empire will give you a +50% settler Production card Which is great and going there early can speed up settlers a lot. Hence it is called EE. At SW you can build your governor district for an extra governor and also build Ancestral Hall(AH) inside that district which also gives 50% settler production and a free builder with every city. The problem is that getting to EE immediately gives you 50% but once at SW you need to spend another 15 or so turns getting to AH. 15 turns is a lot of turns in a game, it is quite a large % which is what this tip is all about. If building a settler is going to take more than 10 turns, don’t... get other stuff out like army, monument/granary and of course Ancestral hall. Get more production, another 50% card or use chopping to lower that turn rate. You cannot get 10 by 100 if it takes longer than 10 to build them.
... well you can, if you use more than 1 city. So use other cities, especially once you get the 50% card or use the other cities for army/builders/monuments. Your capital city has 2 advantages for settler building. It gets a production bonus from the palace and it also gets a production bonus for units if you have 1 envoy at a military (red) city state. This is why often you will notice your capital has better settler production.
there are other things like Magnus’s Provision promotion to avoid population loss and the Religious Settlers pantheon but I think you have done well if you have read this much.
some basic tips
Because you start with a population of 1 you cannot build a settler so you build a warrior or some other unit like a slinger, scout or builder. The choice can vary based on choice, difficulty, map and situation and can change.
You finish the warrior and then start on a builder.
2 turns into building the builder you get to 2 population, you have 7 turns left on your builder.
You should not keep completing your builder normally, you should swap immediately to the settler.
You settler your capital and find you have a choice of 2 good tiles to work. A 1 food, 3 prod tile (1/3) or a 3 food, 1 prod tile (3/1). You look at which tile the AI assigned your 1 population to and it has assigned you to the 1/3 tile. This means you can build units faster but it also means your city grows slower and you need to get to 2 production before you start to build a settler. So manually swap the 1/3 to the 3/1 tile. This tile swapping is what very good players do often, they may even swap back to the 1/3 tile after getting to 2 pop to speed up the settler.
the 10 by t100 rule is just a general rule, I was the one that suggested it and it was just to get an idea. Nowadays because I have got faster and need an earlier benchmark I go for 7 by turn 70. I must stress both benchmarks are based on cities captured as well. They are not easy benchmarks and you will not always get them. That is no reason to stop your game, you will likely still win it, but the idea is always keep your mind on settlers before at least T70 as one of your key decision makers.
Another really key area is do you target State Workforce (SW) first in the culture tree or do you target Early Empire(EE) . Early empire will give you a +50% settler Production card Which is great and going there early can speed up settlers a lot. Hence it is called EE. At SW you can build your governor district for an extra governor and also build Ancestral Hall(AH) inside that district which also gives 50% settler production and a free builder with every city. The problem is that getting to EE immediately gives you 50% but once at SW you need to spend another 15 or so turns getting to AH. 15 turns is a lot of turns in a game, it is quite a large % which is what this tip is all about. If building a settler is going to take more than 10 turns, don’t... get other stuff out like army, monument/granary and of course Ancestral hall. Get more production, another 50% card or use chopping to lower that turn rate. You cannot get 10 by 100 if it takes longer than 10 to build them.
... well you can, if you use more than 1 city. So use other cities, especially once you get the 50% card or use the other cities for army/builders/monuments. Your capital city has 2 advantages for settler building. It gets a production bonus from the palace and it also gets a production bonus for units if you have 1 envoy at a military (red) city state. This is why often you will notice your capital has better settler production.
there are other things like Magnus’s Provision promotion to avoid population loss and the Religious Settlers pantheon but I think you have done well if you have read this much.
Alashiya
Warlord
- Joined
- Nov 29, 2018
- Messages
- 163
I'm still not getting the starts I require about 4 or 5 cities in the first 100 terms is my average this is despite getting Early Empire and the colonisation civic asap
- Should my capital focus on knocking out settlers as fast as possible? if so how do I do this?
- How can I turn my second city into a settler factory?
- should I build government plaza in my capital or second city
I often find my games are hectic on the early times, because I am busy exploring and dealing with barbs. Once medieval age hits though I start to get a good flow going and can basically city build up and be more organized. Being a Civ5 player, I still get a shaky spine when making a bunch of cities and still run small compared to “let’s grab Everything” AI. I guess building cities and military right away seems weird to me lol.
yes, getting out second city is very important. as soon as you hit 2 pop capital, as people said above. with few exceptions.
but i do not understand, why anyone needs 20!!! cities? why, why? for what kind of scenario 20 cities are needed? or how this is enjoyable? all that work with usually bad, endgame cities is mostly at the time of game, where player is near the end. game is already a chore often at that moment. why delay win with even more clickwork of these nearly useless to win cities?
6 cities is all you need on normal map for any victory. and it is not even "need". i play mostly large maps and rarely go over 9-10 cities. well, there are sometimes resources needed, ok. or interesting natural wonder. problem is, these late eras cities suffer from immense costs of building someting meaningful, beyond city center infrastructure.
as for starting.
if you have improvable resource and no threat, go for worker, research corresponding tech.
if not, go for scout or slinger.
about starting tech.
listen, if you play on prince, you do not need even single campus in your whole game to lead in tech, see? id say, instead of writing go for something what will give you production and firepower - animal husbandry, masonry or sailing or certain map, that way you can explore seas with 1 charge worker very early.
but i do not understand, why anyone needs 20!!! cities? why, why? for what kind of scenario 20 cities are needed? or how this is enjoyable? all that work with usually bad, endgame cities is mostly at the time of game, where player is near the end. game is already a chore often at that moment. why delay win with even more clickwork of these nearly useless to win cities?
6 cities is all you need on normal map for any victory. and it is not even "need". i play mostly large maps and rarely go over 9-10 cities. well, there are sometimes resources needed, ok. or interesting natural wonder. problem is, these late eras cities suffer from immense costs of building someting meaningful, beyond city center infrastructure.
as for starting.
if you have improvable resource and no threat, go for worker, research corresponding tech.
if not, go for scout or slinger.
about starting tech.
listen, if you play on prince, you do not need even single campus in your whole game to lead in tech, see? id say, instead of writing go for something what will give you production and firepower - animal husbandry, masonry or sailing or certain map, that way you can explore seas with 1 charge worker very early.
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