Space's second attempt

[a space oddity]

Hi all,

I'm back for seconds.

My first attempt was a milkrun on a pangeae map on Regent level playing the Maya. After playing around with MapFinder some more, I found a archipelago map with a decent start, and of course a far better domination limit. I'd decided to step the difficulty up a bit to allow the AI building me some cities that would not autoraze all the time.

I moved the worker North, revealing a second cow.

I moved the settler East, revealing yummy BG tiles.

What really clinched the matter though, was the settler that popped up from the GH. I remembered to change the settler-build in Chicken Pizza and it sure payed off!) [dance]

 

[a space oddity]

And this is what happened to that settler, the world of the Maya after 10 turns:

 

[General Joey]

A very, VERY nice start.

 

[LulThyme]

So what level of difficulty is this?
What about the map specs etc if you dont mind me asking?

 

[a space oddity]

Not at all, LulThyme.

It's Monarch, 'pelago, moderate wetness and temp, old. Full set of AIs of course, but selected for late or useless UUs. Barbarians are roaming.

Domination limit of around 4340.

 

[a space oddity]

A very, VERY nice start.

Indeed. Now all I have to do is not botch it up.

 

[General Joey]

Hehe, if I had that for a conquests victory...
Warrior mass!

 

[Darkness]

Nice start Space!!!

One question though: what's your definition of a full set of AI's? The max: 15? Or minimum required: 8?
In my (small) experience, bonus resources seem to be more abundant with a smaller number of AI's, while luxuries seem to be more abundant with the maximum number of AI's. I'd be interested in your reasoning for choosing what you call a 'full set of AI's'...

 

[a space oddity]

It's the maximum number of AI, and so far I've seen only 2 luxes on the starting landmass (which is big enough to harbour 3 AI besides the Maya) and a lot of bonus resources.

My reasoning to take 'm all was to have more 'ready made' cities sooner and collect lots of foreign workers. And they would check each others' expansion when things would not progress well enough.
With this kind of start however, a higher diff would have been better for that goal, the game feels like a chieftain game ATM.

What I do still find difficult to handle are the sheer distances. These games are good to train logistic skills.

 

[Darkness]

What I do still find difficult to handle are the sheer distances. These games are good to train logistic skills.

Agreed!
I usually wait for Cavalry to make my move in a huge map game. The three moves are vital for fast conquests of large empires in republic, to avoid WW.

The reasons why I go for the minimum no. of AI (8) are:
- More room to expand, while I research to MT
- Less AI means more bonus resources -> higher population -> higher score
- Less complicated diplomacy. This way I don't have to monitor 15 civs until the end of the MA...

 

[Bartleby]

That is a nice start. Good luck!

 

[a space oddity]

Agreed!
I usually wait for Cavalry to make my move in a huge map game. The three moves are vital for fast conquests of large empires in republic, to avoid WW.

The reasons why I go for the minimum no. of AI (8) are:
- More room to expand, while I research to MT
- Less AI means more bonus resources -> higher population -> higher score
- Less complicated diplomacy. This way I don't have to monitor 15 civs until the end of the MA...

Hmm, that might explain our respective choices, I usually start warring in the BCs, using Swords and Horses. This leaves a couple gone and some others severely crippled during the MA. That makes diplo 'overzichtelijk' (ie: do-able).

I certainly have no lack of food on this map... But I really haven't got that much experience on C3C yet, so I can't say whether this is abnormal or not.

 

[a space oddity]

High time for an update:

After 80 turns, i.e. in 1000BC I had 17 cities, a booming Republic and I nearly completed the Pyramids. I decided to not leave it to luck but build it myself this time, even if this would start the GA, I figured early supergrowth would do the endscore wonders. Score in 1000BC was 421 (just below Kuningas' recent game).

This is what the land looked like:

 

[bed_head7]

Any progress since then?

 

[a space oddity]

Yes, but the GotM keeps getting in the way...

I'm at turn 160 (=450AD) and 2540 points (=a little under Kuningas' graph) but I haven't found the time to post.

 

[a space oddity]

After a long break I decided to play a small game in between, a tiny Conquest. I practiced a little and decided upon:
1. The Aztec (doh)
2. Pangaea, max water, cool climate, India and Am's as AI
3. No Rax, just Jags from start to finish
4. A start with some shields
5. Warlord (a short, short game is what I wanted... )
I found a way to not let the AI upgrade their defenders... I entered a game, but it's not optimal, I'm sure there's better maps.

I really hope to get back to this mega-game, but I need to find some more time and patience first.

edit: It works on Regent too.

 

[a space oddity]

A quick update, since I played two whole turns today:

I'm at turn 170, 3000+ points, 27% land, 57% pop, researching Saltpeter.

This is what the world looks like:

 

[denyd]

My current attempt has a very similar start to yours, 20 cities & Republic with Pyramids soon to complete in 1000 BC (of course I'm playing Chieftain). I also got a settler from a nearby hut. My game also features a double cow, coastal on a river location just south of the capital.

I have a question though, you seem to have packed your cities in quite close in your core. I was planning on having size 20+ once railroads are in place. That doesn't seem possible in your current layout. Are you planning on abandoning some of those cities?

 

[a space oddity]

The short answer is yes.

The long answer is that territory seems to make up most of the score, so getting to that domination limit is of the utmost importance, and I don't want to have to build a lot of culture in the beginning of the game. Take all this with a grain of salt though, I'm still experimenting.

I think I've not yet used the ToA well enough yet, that might change my tactics in the next game. Even though Aquaducts are cheap when you're agri, you get better land coverage and people count with a dense build. The C3C specialists make people even more powerful, food can be made into beakers almost directly, leaving all gold for the military buildup.

When the limit is reached a large scale operation will start to relocate cities, a new game in itself. So yes, a lot of cites will be abandoned and rebuilt. This will be done rushing settlers until the city is size 1 and using them to quickly buildup the new city. A new Market to keep folks happy and on to the next location. After many hours the empire is perfect and the whack-a-mole pollution phase begins. I'm not sure I'm up to that, so I might be tempted leave some of the dense builds as they are.

One downside to 'pelago maps I'm running into, is the lack of luxes on the home continent. A fair bit of the gold needs to go to lux too. This will get better during the game, but I'm not sure how big affect that has on the end score.

edit:
close to the core there is a rather large stretch of tundra that will be abandoned as soon as we hit 66%, for the most juicy AI grasslands.

 

[denyd]

Thanks for the quick answer. I've also got some tundra nearby the core (SE), that I plan on using as a Javelin Thrower promotion factory and slave gathering land.

I finished off Portugal (my nearest neighbor) in my last session and am back to building settlers (Golden Age is over). I built the Pyramids, Colossus and am about to complete ToA for my culture expansions. Most of my core got markets during the GA. Is there any point in building the other wonders (Great Wall, Oracle...) besides just to say you've got all the wonders.

One other quick question, what are you using to crop your screenshots? I made screenies of my early empire & 1000 BC and would like to include them in my posting when it's complete.

BTW: Thanks for all the help