Steve jobs as GS or GE?

Inculde Steve Jobs in the future?

  • Yes

    Votes: 32 30.8%
  • No

    Votes: 72 69.2%

  • Total voters
    104
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But I wouldn't touch a Mac or an iPod because of these kinds of restrictions on user freedom and utility.

I've always wondered where this argument comes from with respect to the Mac. Macs are running an open source Unix-based operating system with a fancy GUI on top. There are no restrictions on user freedom or utility; it's up to the developers of the world to put out software for it, and many do.

On iOS, there are certainly more restrictions, the primary purpose of which is to add an additional security layer. Not once have I said "I really wish I could do such & such with my iPhone/iPad, but Apple doesn't allow it." Erasing the OS and installing embedded Linux "just because" is not on the list of things I wish I could do. Nor is pirating software.
 
I'm pretty sure Apple or Jobs's estate owns the rights to his name and likeness, so that kind of rules him out.

Please no. Its bad enough the media practically deified him when he died, the last thing we need to do is put him in the same category as people like Newton and Einstein. Reality check - the man worked to squash developer freedom, earned great profits off of labor so brutal workers committed suicide and was seen as an all around jerk by his coworkers. Steve Jobs was a nobody who only got where he was by stepping on far greater and more influential people who have gone on unnoticed.

Which puts him right up there with Thomas Edison, who is in the game. :/
 
Jobs as a Great Merchant definitely. His contributions to science are nil. His contributions to engineering come largely from his vision and management style. He dictated what he wanted his employees to invent, but his employees did the inventing. And to be honest, it wasn't really inventing. They pioneered the use of simplistic formats and existing high-end materials for consumer-grade products.
 
Great Prophet, if anything. And Hipsterdom as new religion (y).

Seriously I think neither Gates nor Jobs should be there. While Gates became really rich, and Jobs very well hyped Apple, I don't think they changed the world and the way we live that much.

I don't remember whether he's in, but people like John von Neumann much more deserve to be included.
 
Yeah, well, if he is included as a great merchant, they better include George Carlin as a great artist.
 
Short answer: no.
Sorry, but I feel that there are many more people who deserves to be included other than him, and as if all the media and biographies aren't enough already.


I would mod him out first thing.

Seconded! Or switch the name...
 
I've always wondered where this argument comes from with respect to the Mac. Macs are running an open source Unix-based operating system with a fancy GUI on top. There are no restrictions on user freedom or utility; it's up to the developers of the world to put out software for it, and many do.

Well, just from my own recent experience:

- Friends with multiplayer games from third parties (such as Blizzard) generally have to use a Windows partition to use the games.

- Macs are unable to operate the standard GIS mapping software; professionally I've had consultants unable to perform mapping functions because they use Macs. Given the scientific nature of mapping tools, and the long-term popularity of Macs within that consumer base (as opposed to the very recent emergence of Macs into the consumer mainstream, driven by precisely the approach I'm describing - everyone's now committed to iPhones and iPads, so when they go for a computer they choose one designed specifically for compatibility with those devices), I'd be surprised if this was a decision of the developers.

- A similar issue appears to exist with downloads from ftp sites, which on Windows machines is a straight file transfer from a Windows Explorer window. I only know about this one from a recent report from someone using a Mac, so I'm not sure if Macs are genuinely incompatible with the Windows Explorer interface or whether it was a user issue, but it would fit with what I know of Apple's proprietary approach.

On iOS, there are certainly more restrictions, the primary purpose of which is to add an additional security layer. Not once have I said "I really wish I could do such & such with my iPhone/iPad, but Apple doesn't allow it."

In terms of user freedom, I mean freedom to choose alternative products without penalty. If I had an iPod and Sony, say, put out a superior music player, from what I gather I'd lose functionality if my computer was a Mac while a Windows machine will equally happily function with both an iPod and a Walkman. Simply, I don't want to be tied to a given brand for everything - if I want a camera I prefer to buy Nikon. Music players - Sony. Computer - whatever works with the majority of my devices. etc. etc.

While I understand iPods no longer require music in Apple-patented format, and can now use MP3s, they do still require iTunes as the software to upload - most MP3 players can use iTunes, Media Player, or a variety of other music management software types. Granted there's probably not much to choose between the two these days - when I started using MP3 players Media Player had a format I vastly preferred to iTunes, but sadly recent incarnations of Media Player seem to be devoted to making more closely-resemble the old iTunes I remember, which mostly seems amount to reducing accessibility - such useful former Media Player defaults as creating automated playlists by rating or date of acquisition were never in iTunes that I found, and have now gone from MP. Though this has been fixed, one recent version of Media Player replicated a big issue I'd had with iTunes, which was the difficulty it had attributing artists to individual songs from 'Various Artists' compilations.
 
As a scientist myself I could consider him a scientist. Those nobel prize winners haven't done science in 40 years, they just act as CEOs and more push directions than do the research.
 
But nothing rules out adding Dennis Ritche to the list of Great Engineers in addition to Steve Jobs.

He doesn't deserve to be in the same category of Dennis Ritche. Not just because he was far less important but also because there are countless other people who are also far more important and not in the game. Hell, John Harington should be in there before Jobs.

I would argue that innovation can be as important as invention and still doesn't put someone in the category of invention.

What exactly did *he* innovate?

you need go no further than Thomas Edison.

Nope. While its true Edison was a hack in many ways and I'd definitely agree that he was equal to Jobs in doucheiness, the man invented more than a thousand different things.

I would mod him out first thing.

And that would be the first mod I'd download.

Macs are unable to operate the standard GIS mapping software

Whoa - tangent. Do you have a background in GIS?
 
"Invented" is used loosely for Edison. He paid people who invented things and then took credit.
 
Actually, I think he's more of a Great Merchant than anything else.

Yeah. He was never an engineer or a scientist, he was a marketing expert, and bloody good at it too. He elevated niche products, such as mp3 players, tablet computers and smart phones into mass market consumer products. Microsoft had been trying to create a mass market for tablets since the early 2000's but Job's marketing excellence gave us the iPad as the mass market product we know today. I may never buy an apple product, but you have to really admire the marketing genius that has gone into Apple.
 
Great Merchant never a Great Scientist or Great Engineer... and odds are I would just send him to Belgrade and see how much cash he could milk me.
 
Moderator Action: This is much more a discussion about Jobs than about the game. Please use our Off-Topic forums for such discussions.
 
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